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MBMagic24 New user 18 Posts |
Guys (girls included), I did a search for this and couldn't find much info. I use reference letters from satisfied clients to show to potential clients. No ground breaking technique there. But I have found that getting a reference letter can be a bit like pulling teeth. Do any of you use reference letters, and if so how do you get the people to write them for you? I've found that I get about a 20% return on who I ask to write a letter for me versus who actually does it. I guess it is the fact that the person has to sit down and take the time to do it. So, again, any suggestions on how to increase this percentage? Thanks guys.
-Marc
visit my new blog: marcbuxton.wordpress.com
"magicians only" password: royalroad |
Donald Dunphy Inner circle Victoria, BC, Canada 7563 Posts |
I have hundreds of testimonial letters on file, gathered over the years. (I don't use surveys / evaluations.)
A 20% response rate is about right. People are busy, they don't know what to say, etc. I reward my customers, after the fact, for writing the letters. However, I don't use that as an incentive to get them to write one for me. I usually ask at the show, after finding out if they are happy. And then I might also remind them by asking in a letter, sent a few days after the show (this letter is a different piece of mail from the Thank You card I send out). - Donald
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
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Al Angello Eternal Order Collegeville, Pa. USA 11045 Posts |
Marc
In this day and age when your whole private life can be exposed with a google search it is hard to hide. Lots of people have a performance video on youtube, most serious performers have a web site, if you have been working for any length of time there are agencies that will speak up for you on the phone. A letter of reference is about thirty years behind the times. Others may disagree with me but we are in the 21st century, I fax most of my contracts, and I don't use snail mail unless I have to. Al
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/ "Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone" |
Donald Dunphy Inner circle Victoria, BC, Canada 7563 Posts |
Hi Al,
Just trying to understand. Are you saying that it's out of date to "use" the letters, or to "request" the letters? If you are referring to "using" them, a person can quote parts on their website, in flyers, in letters, in e-mails, or in faxes. I even quote a testimonial sometimes when selling on the phone. A person doesn't have to photocopy the complete letter (for snail mail), unless they wish to. And that isn't the only way to use them. Of course, whether you use testimonials (quotes or complete letters) or not depends partly upon your personal sales style. Again, just asking for clarification. - Donald
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
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Al Angello Eternal Order Collegeville, Pa. USA 11045 Posts |
I'm saying that sending out several xerox coppies of letters from satisfied customers through the mail has not happen to me in more years that I can remember. There are so many quick ways to satisfy a potential customer that a snail mail answers is not what I offer.
I have over 20 agencies that will offer their professional opinion of me with a phone call. My web site is full of pictures of me and kids having fun and that is all the testimonial I need. I am not saying that pages of text is the wrong approach, what I'm saying is I do it with pictures of happy kids.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/ "Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone" |
Donald Dunphy Inner circle Victoria, BC, Canada 7563 Posts |
With over 20 agencies bringing you shows, it's a wonder you find any time to post on The Café.
It's interesting to read the perspective of another. Thanks for sharing, Al. - Donald
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
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Al Angello Eternal Order Collegeville, Pa. USA 11045 Posts |
Donald
Some agents only call me once a year, and others call me every month. I live in a metropolitan area of 5 million people, but I'm never too busy to share with friends. Our friend Dennis Michael can't do all the jobs that he gets offered. I'm not as successful as him.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/ "Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone" |
magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
I use letters of reference all the time. I have a huge collection of them I have received from many clients over the years and happy parents. I haev the originals, make copies and also have them all scanned into my system and saved as PDF files. This way they can be emailed with ease to any prospect. They are great to have and read and shows even more how much I am not only an entertainer but a solutions provider to the clients my wife and I work for.
Like Al, we also use photos on our website and inside our promotional kit to help show folks the reactions and the atmosphere that our show creates. However we do not stop there. Photos to me can only do and say so much to a prospect. So we try and use a combination of both photos and other marketing tools. I am saying that letters of reference can be a very powerful thing, especially to prospects. I always send a few letters of reference along with my promo kits or marketing materials when going after new leads. It is one thing for the prospect to hear me say how good our show is and how we can solve their needs. But when they read an honest letter from a very satisfied customer, that carries with it a lot more weight. Having a combination of both photos, letters and agencies or people willing to give you a good review are all things my wife and I use together as part of our marketing system. It works very well for us and there in lies the key. There is no one way to do this. There is also no right or wrong answer here. It is really what works best for you and your magic business to generate the leads and turn those prospects into paying and satisfied clients. Only you can determine what will and does work best for you in your markets. For Kelly and I, letters of reference are a great tool we will continue to use. =) Kyle
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
AntonZ New user Canton, GA 52 Posts |
All of you gents are providing great counseling to Marc who asked this question.
I would only add that in my day mostly Pre- Fax, Email, CD's and Internet... testimonial letters seemed important and I made a point of asking for them because I knew that if I did not it was more likely than not that none would arrive. As I look back I realize that in the early stages of building my show and on-stage mentalist character I was rewarded doubly when I received a letter. It was yet another way for me to build on my self-esteem in believing that I was not only Joey Feldman, a Bulova Watch salesman, but that I was indeed Anton Josef Zellman, Entertainer! Of course when fees were low and I did a great job it seemed that those clients did not mind taking the time to also reward me with a few words that I could use as "letters of references". I don't think I even knew of the word, "Testimonial". Then when my fees increased substantially I no longer received any letters. When I asked a particular client in the nineties if he would send me a letter I could use to get more work he refused and basically told me, "Anton why would I need to take my time to compliment you with a letter. We know you are the best at what you do... that's why we pay you the kind of fees that you ask for... not that we don't think you're worth it... those big checks are our thank you!" I remember getting his point, smiling and saying, "yes and please let's keep them coming!" The guys here all have it right (AGAIN) Go ahead and get comments from clients and then add the key phrases to your on-line brochure and any mailing pieces you may still choose to mail. |
Donald Dunphy Inner circle Victoria, BC, Canada 7563 Posts |
I have had customers tell me that they won't write a letter (for whatever reason they choose), but that they are very happy with my services.
They still book me again and again (and give referrals), so I am not disappointed in the slightest. One thing to remember is to not push a customer for a letter too much. Ask, and then move on. - Donald
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
That is exactly right. You will never know unless you ask. It is their choice whether they want to or not but if they do say no, then do not take it as a negative at all. Simply thank them for their time and move onwards as donald suggests.
Kyle
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
Al Angello Eternal Order Collegeville, Pa. USA 11045 Posts |
Anton
I think there is an important place for letters of reference in this day and age. Every time I get one I put it on my refrigerator to let my wife know I'm really good at what I do.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/ "Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone" |
Magic_Steve Inner circle Maryland 1476 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-11-04 21:19, Al Angello wrote: Kinda like being in kindergarten and bringing home a drawing where you colored INSIDE the lines, right Al?? |
Flec Special user UK 585 Posts |
At wedding fairs, brides to be often stop by my stand and ask what sort of work I've done before, and what sorts of weddings I've performed at. I have a folder of testimonials from a wide range of clients (corporate, private parties, weddings, golf days, etc) so that 1) they can see what people think, and also 2) they can see I don't just perform at weddings. After reading some of the letters I often get people saying "oh you do parties aswell? I have a birthday coming up..." etc.
This is the only instance I use my testimonials. But still they are nice to have on file so that if anyone ever asks me I can provide them straight away. They're also nice for your ego aswell too! To have a folder with 100+ people telling you how great you are can't be that bad!!! |
magicalaurie Inner circle Ontario, Canada 2962 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-11-02 08:22, MBMagic24 wrote: Glad to see I'm not the only one who's had this problem. Folks are busy, true, and I've had difficulty obtaining letters even from those who offered one without being asked. Waiting on one right now... we'll see. |
Al Angello Eternal Order Collegeville, Pa. USA 11045 Posts |
Laurie
The reason why my web site is full of pictures of kids, and adults having fun with me is because pictures are easier to read than text. If you are sending out invitations to a party at your house how hard is it to get people to RSVP? As I said before this is the 21st century, and the rules have changed.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/ "Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone" |
AntonZ New user Canton, GA 52 Posts |
I know all of you already know this... just thought I'd add it to my previous $2 worth.
Thank you letters, references and testimonials are absolutely a great tool as long as I don't totally depend on them to convince the potential client that I am as good as I wish for them to think I am. I must also have other text and visuals to support them. I'm suspecting that in this day of Internet, emails, live chats etc. few potential clients are going to read an entire letter or a packet of them as I used to send out. I can remember making dozens of copies of every letter that I had collected and sorting them into stacks that would address specific aspects of my act, my business capabilities and so forth. I purchased the best stock covers I could find and made booklets of them and then sent them to the contact with a 8x10 photo. cover letter and a poorly produced brochure. No wonder I decided to stop looking for so many customers and work on getting repeat business from the same clients. Pure genius here.... I also used these letters and everything else that had my name on it to up my self esteem. To provide me with a constant reminder that I was the Amazing Zellman! That I could leave my day job and make a go of it. |
magicalaurie Inner circle Ontario, Canada 2962 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-11-05 23:00, Al Angello wrote: I agree with you on this, Al. I've got photos- and I think they are powerful. But I like to have letters, as well, for those who might like some text behind the visuals. Want to cover the bases if I can- keep a variety of tools in the box. |
JeffWampler Regular user Bristol, TN 191 Posts |
Photos absolutely say a lot more than words ever could. However, there are some things that photos can't capture that words would be more appropriate. This would be things like appropriateness of material, how easy you are to get along with, punctuality, etc.
I think really a variety of pics and letters of reference, or ANYTHING someone else has said about you (newspaper clips, tv clips, audio references, etc) is probably more effective than just one or the other. as magicalaurie said, you need to keep a variety of tools in the box bc you don't know which tool will hit the right button for your particular prospect...just my .02 as for getting an actual letter, the easiest thing to do is just ask. Ask at the end of the program when the program organizer is telling you what a good job you did. Remind them in your thank you letter you send the next day with a SASE. This doesn't ALWAYS work, but if it just works 1/10 times, you've only spent $4.10 for a piece of promo material you can use FOREVER, and that ain't bad. |
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