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chrisweeks New user Toronto, Canada 80 Posts |
Im looking at making a production cage and I have found a design I really like, how ever I am trying to find plans on how to build it...
Here is a picture of what it looks like - http://www.magicauction.com/Auction_L_Fo......0167.jpg Ive done some searching but the closest thing ive found is The Cargo Cage... Chris |
Michael Baker Eternal Order Near a river in the Midwest 11172 Posts |
Appears to be a Lady to Lion design.
~michael baker
The Magic Company |
hugmagic Inner circle 7655 Posts |
I'll second that motion.
Richard
Richard E. Hughes, Hughes Magic Inc., 352 N. Prospect St., Ravenna, OH 44266 (330)296-4023
www.hughesmagic.com email-hugmagic@raex.com Write direct as I will be turning off my PM's. |
raywitko Special user western Pa 527 Posts |
It's more along the line off a blammo box since there is no base for the girl. Both effects are similar.
Ray
Sometimes it seems there are more than one of me.
Tabman USA magicdmv email me at [email]fursclass@magicdmv.com[/email] |
chrisweeks New user Toronto, Canada 80 Posts |
After some research, it appears to be a firebox with out the fire capabilities
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Matthew W Inner circle New York 2456 Posts |
Yes, that is a Fire Cage. Chances are it is able to do fire, you can't see it because the false wall is down.
-Matt
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motivationalmagic Regular user Pennsylvania 179 Posts |
Yes, 100% definitely a Fire Cage. As Matt says, the false wall is down. If you look, you'll see two different shades of black. The section in the back is the hiding area when the wall is in the up position.
Rich |
Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2607 Posts |
Shhhhh! Let's remember this is a public forum. The ratio of back wall to base is usually a little different for a fire cage. Without going into too much detail, if a fire cage was set up like a lady to lion as this one is, there would be nothing solid to put the fire out. If you think about the design, you can figure it out. Most fire cage designs are hinged to fold in the middle.
Like he surmised, probably a fire cage "look" without the fire capabilities.
Ray Pierce
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Matthew W Inner circle New York 2456 Posts |
Looks like a fire cage to me.
-Matt
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jay leslie V.I.P. Southern California 9498 Posts |
Why are people tipping things?
Matt, Get a 3D bunny box, an M box or a BA box where the G falls flat - and use it as a sample. Make your version out of cardboard, then when you know the sizes work.... then, make it for real. Make the G last because the outside and inside measurements of your box are different.
Jay Leslie
www.TheHouseOfEnchantment.com |
Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2607 Posts |
Quote:
On 2009-04-24 14:51, Matthew W wrote: lol... I know it LOOKS like a fire cage but it isn't! Ok, I'll TRY and explain this slowly and so someone who doesn't understand magic won't know what I'm talking about. In a "lion's bride" style gaff, there are bars, a duplicate cloth backing, then a plywood backer. The silver things end up facedown on the floor. In a "fire cage" you need something flat to smother the flame. A lion's bride style backer won't do that as the face down part is open with bars and such so there isn't enough to extinguish the flame unless you contrived some special door that trips to act as a snuffer for the flame box which adds an unnecessary degree of complexity to a very simple effect. A "fire cage" has a folding gizmo so the flat plywood/metal backer ends up face down over the flame snuffing it out in one move. If the cage is twice as tall as the space in front of the gizomdus, then it's a fire cage. If the cage is equally tall as the space in front, (as the picture shows) it's a small "lion's bride style" production of a person. Whew!
Ray Pierce
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Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2607 Posts |
Quote:
On 2009-04-24 14:51, Matthew W wrote: lol... I know it LOOKS like a fire cage but it isn't! Ok, I'll TRY and explain this slowly and so someone who doesn't understand magic won't know what I'm talking about. In a "lion's bride" style gaff, there are bars, a duplicate cloth backing, then a plywood backer. The silver things end up facedown on the floor. In a "fire cage" you need something flat to smother the flame. A lion's bride style backer won't do that as the face down part is open with bars and such so there isn't enough to extinguish the flame unless you contrived some special door that trips to act as a snuffer for the flame box which adds an unnecessary degree of complexity to a very simple effect. A "fire cage" has a folding gizmo so the flat plywood/metal backer ends up face down over the flame snuffing it out in one move. If the cage is twice as tall as the space in front of the gizomdus, then it's a fire cage. If the cage is equally tall as the space in front, (as the picture shows) it's a small "lion's bride style" production of a person. Whew!
Ray Pierce
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Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2607 Posts |
Quote:
On 2009-04-24 14:51, Matthew W wrote: lol... I know it LOOKS like a fire cage but it isn't! Ok, I'll TRY and explain this slowly and so someone who doesn't understand magic won't know what I'm talking about. In a "lion's bride" style gaff, there are bars, a duplicate cloth backing, then a plywood backer. The silver things end up facedown on the floor. In a "fire cage" you need something flat to smother the flame. A lion's bride style backer won't do that as the face down part is open with bars and such so there isn't enough to extinguish the flame unless you contrived some special door that trips to act as a snuffer for the flame box which adds an unnecessary degree of complexity to a very simple effect. A "fire cage" has a folding gizmo so the flat plywood/metal backer ends up face down over the flame snuffing it out in one move. If the cage is twice as tall as the space in front of the gizomdus, then it's a fire cage. If the cage is equally tall as the space in front, (as the picture shows) it's a small "lion's bride style" production of a person. Whew!
Ray Pierce
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Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2607 Posts |
Quote:
On 2009-04-24 14:51, Matthew W wrote: lol... I know it LOOKS like a fire cage but it isn't! Ok, I'll TRY and explain this slowly and so someone who doesn't understand magic won't know what I'm talking about. In a "lion's bride" style gaff, there are bars, a duplicate cloth backing, then a plywood backer. The silver things end up facedown on the floor. In a "fire cage" you need something flat to smother the flame. A lion's bride style backer won't do that as the face down part is open with bars and such so there isn't enough to extinguish the flame unless you contrived some special door that trips to act as a snuffer for the flame box which adds an unnecessary degree of complexity to a very simple effect. A "fire cage" has a folding gizmo so the flat plywood/metal backer ends up face down over the flame snuffing it out in one move. If the cage is twice as tall as the space in front of the gizomdus, then it's a fire cage. If the cage is equally tall as the space in front, (as the picture shows) it's a small "lion's bride style" production of a person. Whew!
Ray Pierce
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Michael Baker Eternal Order Near a river in the Midwest 11172 Posts |
Ray knows what he is talking about. So do Richard, and Jay, and so do I.
This is the basic Lady to Lion (Lion's Bride) design. It could be made to use fire. Since none of us can see through the gimmick in the photo, let's be safe and assume that it does not, by paraphrasing Ray, "...without adding an unnecessary degree of complexity to a very simple effect." It does not need any additional space for the girl after the change, IF deceptive steps are used (old school fart here). It is also POSSIBLE that this particular cage was used simply as a production of some person or animal, without changing "assistant A" into "assistant B". Advice to the young and young in magic... buy old books and learn to read, pay attention to the old farts, and when you think you have the definitive answer, keep digging. Your shovel won't wear out for a long, long time. The other option is to be prepared for many epiphanic and expensive "Oh, s**t!" moments when you build your illusions.
~michael baker
The Magic Company |
Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2607 Posts |
PS... I'm really sorry for the multiple posts... no idea what happened! If anyone can delete them so I don't look like an idiot that's great... if not I've looked stupid many times before..;-)
Ray Pierce
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RVH Magic Special user 877 Posts |
WDI Magic wrote: In a "lion's bride" style gaff, there are bars, a duplicate cloth backing, then a plywood backer. The silver things end up facedown on the floor. In a "fire cage" you need something flat to smother the flame. A lion's bride style backer won't do that as the face down part is open with bars and such so there isn't enough to extinguish the flame unless you contrived some special door that trips to act as a snuffer for the flame box which adds an unnecessary degree of complexity to a very simple effect.
A lot of fire cages are made like a "lion bride" (with bars, duplicate cloth & wooden back) and have a extra system that closes the flame box. This is recommended since it adds a extra safety! The confusion about the cage in the picture is that there are 2 versions of the Fire cage : Jonathan Pendragon came up with the fire cage concept based on the lion bride effect The original Pendragon fire cage has a big improvement that the other fire cages don't have and that is that it's twice as tall as the space in front.(so the girl fills the cage more) It was actually Hans Klok who was first using the Lion Bride style system for the fire cage effect after seeing the Pendragons version. Jonathan Pendragon gave him permission to use the fire cage effect. Since then the Fire cage has been copied worldwide... On the magic auction site this cage is described as a production cage, which is a fire cage without the fire using the lion bride system ;-) (without the b... or T...! ) |
adam christopher Veteran user 316 Posts |
And if you're still confused please go re-read the last page of Michael Baker's post a few above this....there's more wisdom in that post alone then much on the Café...kudos MB....AC
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Michael Baker Eternal Order Near a river in the Midwest 11172 Posts |
Adam,
In retrospect, I think I was a bit abrasive, but I'm glad you saw through that. I just hope Chris found the working of a production cage that he can build.
~michael baker
The Magic Company |
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