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hagemagic Regular user 130 Posts |
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magicians Inner circle Teacher and Legend 2898 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-01-22 17:52, hagemagic wrote: This may be new to you, but I have at least six methods to do the identical effect. In "Dances with Ropes". This was also done my Jeff Stewart back in the 80's. Of course its nice. There is also another version where the guy uses red white and blue ropes then goes into 3 color linking ropes. I have a version that works differently than the link. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slGS-qUo8Jg the conversation http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......um=9&102 then the same thing using red white and blue http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......orum=9&5
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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magicalwishes Regular user Hickory, NC 143 Posts |
Is the method the same?
CYRS |
magicians Inner circle Teacher and Legend 2898 Posts |
No. The method used by Criswell is almost identical to Stewart and two others I know of (where the ropes are counted in front). Mine do not work the same but look identical.
The premise of handing out three long ropes is only a holy graile to magicians. Layman are less impressed, as the effect is so short. ------- The title of this was "have you seen this?". So, the quick answer is yes, over the past 35 years in magic, I have seen this. The most recent identical method was a three color nightmare followed by multicolored linking ropes. The ropes are counted the same way as the video, stretched the same way and winds up with three identical sizes (ungimmicked) except they are red white and blue. He then goes into ungimmicked linking of three circles of rope.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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magicalwishes Regular user Hickory, NC 143 Posts |
Oh ... ok now I understand ...
Where can we find the Stewart version? See ya real soon! |
magicians Inner circle Teacher and Legend 2898 Posts |
Jeff plans on re-doing it soon. He just moved to Florida and recently showed it at a club meeting. I know it seems puzzling, but you might as well satisfy your curiosity by getting Criswell's. Cheap enough for $10. Heck, my download is $10 too.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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leondo Special user Las Vegas 759 Posts |
Just get Ian's stuff. More than worth what you payed for it.
I've got NO dog in this fight. Actually, I originally had a problem with Ian. FWIW, Ted L Las Vegas, NV v |
magicalwishes Regular user Hickory, NC 143 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-01-25 23:22, leondo wrote: Is it me or was that a bit weird? LOL |
magicians Inner circle Teacher and Legend 2898 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-01-25 23:22, leondo wrote: Not wierd for me, one of the videos Ted got wouldn't work in his machines. I wound up sending him several copies before his machines would play the DVD correctly. The problem was not with me, but with a bad disk or two. Ted and I are cool. Now, about Criswell, he is a new lecturer trying to make a name and do lectures. To have come up with the rope effect is good for him, the problem with any innovation, it is sometimes a discovery of something that has been done. It does not mean he copies, its just two minds with the same ideas developed independently. It is almost impossible to research what had been done, especially with stuff from BC era (before computers and DVD downloads). Fanatics like me, were there or studied the effects which is necessary in order to claim absolute originality. But, the quirky variation of handing out three long ropes after the stretch, is an effect only important to magicians as a puzzle. This topic was a challenge in the wording of the post. "Have you seen this rope effect". Does that mean "criswells effect" or "something like this. In my case, I have seen those exact moves before and have several methods of my own. Its a case of preference. In my dances with ropes, I duplicate that exact effect of showing three separate ropes, in a very clean manner, as they are unprepared. But, in reality, I use a gimmick after I show the ropes. Other methods show three ropes with the method of start dirty and end clean. My original method is that way, as it is an opener but looks great. That was 35 years ago and still fooling them.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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magicians Inner circle Teacher and Legend 2898 Posts |
Here is one of my methods, a little closer to Criswells
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xf1_kK8Kp_s Just a bit different finger holding.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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hagemagic Regular user 130 Posts |
According to Criswell he uses no gimmicks. The method is different than yours. Actually I have seen this effect before and I don't like it personally unless you are just performing for magicians to fool them or to give them a puzzle. I think if Criswell came up with a new method then he should get credit. I haven't seen evidence that contradicts his discovery of a new method.
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magicalwishes Regular user Hickory, NC 143 Posts |
I agree with magicians .... as well with hagemagic in most respects ... However I see the routine as being the same for laymen as the original but you do get that extra punch at the end for magicians or anyone "in the know"
Chastain put this link in his newsletter .... http://www.magicbyenigma.com/ropes.html that shows a second routine ... anyone ever see that done? SYRS |
magicians Inner circle Teacher and Legend 2898 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-01-26 12:20, hagemagic wrote: Well, I will just have to find the video link that show the exact same method for the first Criswell link. Since I am not believed. The same method was also actually on a DVD sold by Murphy almost two years ago, which also irked me, as I knew that this has been done. I am extremely well versed in most deviant methods of the PN. I have lectured with my first deviation "professor Ians Nightmare" which uses no gimmickry at all. I have several that use a gimmick (all look the same to the spectator). The fat and folded rope versions have all been done before and all have "tells" that are just so suspicious. My last post, actually can be handed out before th effect starts and even stretched by spectators. Afterwards, when the ropes are long, it also passes muster, but I go directly into linking ropes. The one that is exactly Criswell's method is by a Spaniard who's name escapes me. He could stop and dwell on the fact that the ropes are equal and they are multi-color, but he also elects to do the ungimmicked linking ropes using the method "stevens magic" sells (the special knot). The "tell" on both the criswell and the Spanish method is the "fat fist" handling of the ropes, needed to get the job done. If I didn't admit to gimmickry, my version simulates the actual handling of PN. That, is the knit-picking criteria that sets mine apart.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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magicians Inner circle Teacher and Legend 2898 Posts |
I found one that shows the same handling as Criswell, there are others.
This one shows the three different colored ropes, but the handling is the same, then he goes into linking ropes. http://www.gycklaren.com/start.asp?artic......y=Sweden What I call the "fat handed" move. BTW: You know how hard it is to google a technique. Like I said, I have more links of this method, but at least you can see what I researched.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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hagemagic Regular user 130 Posts |
Indeed it appears that Criswell re-discovered something that has already been done.
I don't think you should talk about Criswell's fat fist. He might be sensitive about that. ;-) |
magicians Inner circle Teacher and Legend 2898 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-01-26 16:54, hagemagic wrote: I coined that phrase a long time ago (lol). I am still looking for the demo of another guy who did the method (discontinued on Murphy magic). I will keep digging. I don't mean to be obsessive about this, in actuality after getting a lot of praise and excitement over my own rope moves, its nice to see an effort of originality. I stepped up my own marketing due to quirky moves getting big money for rehashed techniques. I am protective of all original moves and like to set the record straight. I did an "ode to George Sands" when too many people were claiming Sands moves as their own or witout any credit. When it comes to rope, it is almost like card effects, a hand twist or finger in a new direction can be such an enhancement and each segment has its origins. When I lecture on rope for beginners, I mention each creator of every twist. ie: This is John Cornelious tie, or Frank Garcia pickup, or Sands moves. Just setting the record straight. Recently I watched Finney do a teach in of a rope move that ws from my lectures in the 80's. Finney mentioned that "he saw it somewhere". Now that was annoying.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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