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Cpontz Special user Daupin PA 553 Posts |
With all of the published material of coin masters (from Downs, Buckley to Slydini, Vernon and to current day with masters like David Roth and Curtis Kam) we can learn and appreciate tons of amazing coin magic. However, I know that magicians really don't like to tip their best work. That said, imagine the magic that has been lost because it was never published.
Anybody have any stories of "lost" coin gems? Thanks Craig |
funsway Inner circle old things in new ways - new things in old ways 9982 Posts |
Two years ago I found part of a manuscript stuffed in an old, handmade Foo Can,
by Nelson Birch -- not a well know magician -- these 1934 notes were legible enough for me to glean and I have written several routines using the "Birch Stack." Some I now use the the T.U.C. and will be included in the upcoming book - "Essential T.U.C." PM me.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst
eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com |
Curtis Kam V.I.P. same as you, plus 3 and enough to make 3498 Posts |
Thank you for including me in your reference to "masters", a title I'll now struggle mightily to live up to here:
There is a great deal of folklore in coin magic that has not seen print or video, and you're right, we are in danger of losing it entirely. For instance, Albert Goshman followed Dai Vernon's advice to "learn to do one thing better than anyone else". The thing he chose was "Spellbound", and he worked on it until he was able to change a silver half dollar to a copper penny at his fingertips, with no cover. The change was miraculous. Oddly enough, that routine never made it into his act, and was not described in his book. I don't know of any video of him performing the change, and the number of people who can recall seeing him do this grows smaller every day. John Ramsay apparently had a number of varied handlings for his "Coins in the Hat" Andrew Galloway mentions this on his excellent discs dedicated to Ramsay's magic, but he does not describe the variations, and they are nowhere in print as far as I know. Geoff Latta left behind a trove of unpublished work, hopefully we'll see it all in the book that will come out, someday. If not, some great ideas will be lost. The last time I saw Roger Klause live, he showed me a marvelous bit with a coin that was a favorite of Max Malini's. I don't think that's in print, but if it is, it's underappreciated. As far as I know, Fred Kaps' stage routines featuring jumbo coin manipulation have not seen print. And there are many others. All of this is dwarfed, however, by the good material that is hidden in print that is easily overlooked. The introduction to the "Sawa Library of Magic, volume 1," for instance, contains hidden gems.
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Cpontz Special user Daupin PA 553 Posts |
Thanks Curtis. Great stories and some of our older magicians, I'm sure, could provide many, many other examples.
Hopefully, with more masters putting their best work on tape, we won't lose as much as has happened in the past. I also like your point about the good material that is hidden in print and overlooked. I wonder if, 50 years from now, there will be a lot of good material that is on hidden on video (tapes, CDs, DVDs) that will be overlooked. Or, will technology change so much that magicians will have access to all of the best of today? |
J-Mac Inner circle Ridley Park, PA 5338 Posts |
One thing that scares me with current multimedia formats is how much faster they change. I see a day when a lot of great magic is there on media formats that can no longer be played by many folks.
I know I once had a monstrous music collection on vinyl - good old LPs and 45's. Then Eight-Track was in and turntables started disappearing fast. Cassette tapes quickly pushed Eight-Track tapes out before we could even start to build a decent collection, and then all of a sudden we had CD's. Of course videos had recently become available in Betamax and VHS formats - VHS won that battle only to face ultimate defeat at the hands of the DVD. So what do I have now? A fairly large DVD collection that I don’t think I'll ever be able to afford to change to Blue-Ray, and a medium-sized music CD collection that will probably become extinct over the next couple of years. All of the above is just to point out that my Eight-Track/cassette tape/CD collection never got close to the size of the vinyl collection I had - that music is gone for me. I couldn't afford to replace it. What will happen as the corporations change formats faster than many magician historians can keep up with? I would bet that we will lose a lot of material right under our noses this way. Jim |
jazzy snazzy Inner circle run off by a mob of Villagers wielding 2109 Posts |
True Jim
The jury is still out on the longevity of these new formats. Nothing has changed since cellulose film stock and acetate tape. All disc media are not created equal. Some being considerably more archival than others. Alternatives are hard drives, offsite storage, SD chips, master tapes, etc. My solution is; all of the above and I'm still nervous about it. We have miles of footage of elder Japanese craftsmen at work. The master digital tapes from 10 years ago are still OK. The Hi 8 tapes shot by my predecessor 14 years ago are a mess. They now require extensive and expensive frame-by-frame processing to be usable again. Any claims that a certain medium is archival or guaranteed to last 100 years should be considered as advertising hype. Multiple copies at several locations stored under optimum conditions with regular scheduled backup and maintenance is the only solution we have right now. I think "next of kin" is the biggest menace to the retention of this material. Imagine the volume of films, photos, journals etc. that is disposed of by relatives. A retired magician friend passed several years ago quite unexpectedly. He was constantly inventing stuff. He had at least 5 trunks of apparatus, notes ad documents in his apartment. Amazing how fast it all vanished. The relatives had no clue what they were doing. Obviously there are many Café members who are actively creating new material, - things not yet published commercially, not to mention huge investments in props, books, etc. You might consider appointing a fellow magician as trustee for these things, and tell the relatives why you did. Things that look like junk to the layman could in fact have immeasurable value in the context of history.
"The secret of life is to look good from a distance."
-Charles Schulz |
funsway Inner circle old things in new ways - new things in old ways 9982 Posts |
"I think "next of kin" is the biggest menace to the retention of this material"
When I went overseas during Viet Nam I stored all my stuff at my Mother's, wrapped in plastic, placed in a trunk and sealed shut. When I returned I found that three of my sibling had explored it all, broken some pieces and left the trunk unsealed. Lost were an original Run-Rabbit-Run, Cats & Chicks, Multiplying Candles and Spirit salte with real slate. But the worst was a complete set Genii Magazine Vol 1-12 - all mildewed and rotting from water damage -- only ten copies useable. mighty sad!
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst
eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com |
ziggystarsane New user Melbourne - Australia 92 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-01-30 23:47, J-Mac wrote: OMG... are you saying that Eight-Track's have now been superseded... It breaks my heart to think of how much great material has been lost forever. It dose I suppose add another level of romanticism & intrigue to the history of Magic. I remember as a kid first reading about Nelson T Downs in Bobo's, thinking I wonder if this guy was as good as my imagination says he was.... |
Cpontz Special user Daupin PA 553 Posts |
How about you? Do you have a trick or routine that you have developed that you would not want to pass along?
Craig |
J-Mac Inner circle Ridley Park, PA 5338 Posts |
I certainly don’t, Craig!
To be honest if I did I like to think I would pass it along to all. Go out the same way I came into this place: bare-a$$ and not a care! Of course I don’t see such a thing that would have great monetary value so if it were just a nice effect I'd pass it along. Jim |
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