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motown Inner circle Atlanta by way of Detroit 6127 Posts |
Over the years many books have been updated in later editions. Bobo's Coin Magic, Expert Card Technique, Burger's Magic and Meaning to name a few.
I really don't see a problem with it. I did though think Moments was priced a bit high for a 128 page small format book.
"If you ever write anything about me after I'm gone, I will come back and haunt you."
– Karl Germain |
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duanebarry Special user 883 Posts |
I think what rankles is that Book 1 was expanded at the same moment that Book 2 was published. The new material could have simply been published in Book 2. Bobo, ECT and M&M didn't have such a vessel so conveniently at hand.
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motown Inner circle Atlanta by way of Detroit 6127 Posts |
I understand where you're coming from. Maybe it would have been better had the two books been publshed as one and sold for $55 or $60.
"If you ever write anything about me after I'm gone, I will come back and haunt you."
– Karl Germain |
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Joshua Jay V.I.P. 196 Posts |
Hello,
Let me clarify two points about these books (and thanks for all the kind words, btw). First, about new material added to Destroyers. This book is now more than ten years old. When books, DVDs, documentaries, and other forms of media are re-released, they almost always include updates or embellishments that time or perspective affords them. Why would this book be any different? Second, look at WHAT was added, and I think you will agree it was the right choice. We didn't add any "new" material, but instead the flipper coin material from Silver Surf 2, which came from the same period as Destroyers (around 2000 and before). It made no sense to me to add more flipper tricks to a new book, when THE seminal chapter on flipper coins (where I explain what one is, the history, how to use it) was already in Destroyers. It seemed appropriate to add that material to the "definitive" chapter on flipper coin work. I hope that answers the question of the updates. And I would HOPE that the many, many people who bought, enjoyed, and use material from Destroyers are not somehow upset with the ten years they have had to enjoy it. We have never insinuated in our marketing that the consumer need buy the new edition. We're just updating it with credits, corrections, and a few additional flipper tricks that are now possible to include. The second issue is more complex and sad--the one dealing with the price of this book, and any other for that matter. We will all have to get used to higher book prices, and I'm afraid this trend will not change. The reasons are simple. There are less people buying books, and the costs and time to produce one have remained the same. Naturally, the price must increase. In order to pay Troy, Tony Dunn (illustrator), a cover artist, a layout artist, have the books printed, and then advertise them, we must budget accordingly. And instead of looking forward to selling several thousand, we are lucky to sell a fraction of that in today's magic market. I didn't ask Troy to take a pay cut, nor did I ask Tony Dunn to do so. The Andy Nyman book is 200 bucks. The last Regal book was 75 bucks. They were both great books, and in my estimation worth the money. The new Berglas book is going to be 125. For 100 bucks you get both Hooser books AND a beautiful slipcase. I think it's more than reasonable, even when compared to other book prices. I hope this sheds some light on where we were coming from. And believe me, although I don't check often, when someone directs us to a thread where people are saying kind things about the projects I work so hard to produce, it makes my day. Every time. So glad some of you are enjoying Troy's magic, and I just hope that the books do his wonderful material justice. Josh |
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rklew64 Inner circle 1265 Posts |
Keep publishing.
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learachel Elite user 446 Posts |
And it's a real pleasure to read these books!! Buy it!
simon Belgium |
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motown Inner circle Atlanta by way of Detroit 6127 Posts |
Approaching magic was over 500 pages and a larger format, so I could understand why it was priced at $75
Here's a few more examples of Quality books recently published: Card College Lightest, 152 pages, $35 Secret Agenda, 424 pages, $55 Magic & Meaning Expanded was rereleased, 238 pages, $40 Nick Trost's Subtle Card Creations, Volume 2, 275 pages, $40 Obviously, there are many larger, quality books being published at lower prices than these.
"If you ever write anything about me after I'm gone, I will come back and haunt you."
– Karl Germain |
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Steven Leung Inner circle found the Magic Rainbow after 1614 Posts |
Received my book 'Moments' weeks ago, last night finally got a chance to flip through those pages.
I am so happy that each page Troy teaches and remind me how to make every moment have stronger impact to the audience. It is not a book for beginner. My only two words: BUY IT!!!
Most memorable moment - with Maestro Juan Tamariz & Consuelo Lorgia in FISM Busan 2018.
"Being fooled by a trick doesn't always mean they are having a good time" - Homer Liwag https://hhpresents.com/ https://www.glitchstudiohk.com/ |
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Joshua Jay V.I.P. 196 Posts |
Motown, I'll see your four and raise you four more. Here are other quality books I remember from the last year or so, all in the range I was talking about:
Reinventing the Real = 60 Del Ray book = 68 Ascanio Vol. 3 = 70 Zarrow book = 125 Book prices are going up. It's unavoidable, and nobody is happy about it, least of all the people making them. My dream would be to have my books in the hands of everyone who appreciates magic--not to have them priced out of the budget of half the target audience. But these things are not under my control. The ONLY great thing about this predicament is this: the only people crazy enough to write and produce magic books in our era are people who do it because they love it. And books produced out of love will always trump books produced for big profit. Now back to writing the next project...600 tricks for a retrospective on one of my favorite magicians...Jay Sankey. Josh |
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jekyllandhyde Regular user 200 Posts |
With all the talented folks out there you can spend time with and introduce us to by producing another amazing project, you chose to rehash Sankey material? Come on buddy.
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Joshua Jay V.I.P. 196 Posts |
Sankey is an undisputed creative force in magic. He has invented some of the most useful and brilliant tricks of the last three decades. And when you look at some of the other noteworthy tricks in recent times, many of them were predated or inspired by a Sankey effect. When you eliminate all the crap and add some of his unpublished gems, you have before you a collection as strong as any magic book I can think of. I think it's going to be a worthy addition to everyone's library.
Josh |
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duanebarry Special user 883 Posts |
I realize book publishing is difficult these days, and I would like to find ways for publishers and book buyers to be mutually supportive (note my PDF suggestion for original DesTROYers owners, above). In the interest of publishers producing books that buyers will buy, I must gently point out that the publisher's comparisons of books, above, do not seem apt.
Del Ray, Ascanio, Zarrow and Berglas are legends. Those books are large, definitive monuments, distilled from lifetimes of work by those luminaries. Del Ray: 448 pp + 92 mins DVD Ascanio: 394 pp Zarrow: 480 pp Berglas: ~400 pp + 3 DVDs From a buyer's perspective, 128 pages of somebody's latest stuff is a different kind of book. Even paired with another 189 pages of somebody's earlier stuff, it's still clearly in a different category. That's 317 pages combined. One buyer's thought process: Ascanio is 25% larger in pagecount than the combo, he's a total legend, and his book -- an expensive book! -- is 30 dollars(!) less. Buyers have to make hard choices now, and pricing regular books at luxury prices may not allow for as much buying and selling of books as everybody involved would like. |
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rklew64 Inner circle 1265 Posts |
Can't articulate the analogy of publishing a book nowadays to current gas prices, but I think there is something relevant there maybe? Oh well. Like anything else, isn't volume one factor in any pricing?
Gas prices in the last 36 hours: Kroger in Kentucky, $2.84 Shell in San Francisco, $3.25 : ( , I'm with jekyllandhyde, I don't think I would pick the upcoming book on Sankey. I do own 2 effects of his. Something about his performance persona does not speak to me. I will say I'm a big fan of David Ben. Both are Canadian and each one has gone completely very different paths. I won't go into details. Let's just say Ben has been involved in some pretty heavy magic books ( Zarrow and Vernon). Not saying a book should be written about Ben. Haven't anyone been surprised at seeing certain names connected with some of the recent books out there. Take Guastaferro, he has contributed to many books for a while way before his One Degree even though many think he came out from no where all of a sudden. imho. |
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GeneG New user 6 Posts |
I just received the Joshua Jay's "Destroyers" and could not be more pleased, even with the price. This is a self-published volume with a low production run (I suspect it will not outsell J. K. Rowling). Such works are always going to cost more than trade books with high print runs. Also, the quality of the materials used is absolutely superb. Great hardback cover, heavy semi-gloss paper, and sewn binding so it lies nice and flat on the desk/table. 100 years from now the book won't have the pages falling out as happens with glued pages - in much shorter order. As for the content, as far as I can tell the descriptions are clear and the artwork is appealing. As an author, I know the hours that go into these productions. Break the royalties down over against time on the clock and, frankly, few of us would work for that hourly wage. But, the pièce de résistance comes on p. 181 where Troy's voice emerges: "Well, that's it. Between these covers are twenty years of my life -- twenty years of tinkering, problem-solving, and polishing." Twenty years of hard work and experience - for $50.00. This is one good, cheap book! Buy it. And get one for your grandma, too.
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motown Inner circle Atlanta by way of Detroit 6127 Posts |
Quote: Great Points.
On 2011-01-21 12:13, duanebarry wrote: I had an opportunity to pick up an original copy of Destroyers and did, because it was a much more resonable price.
"If you ever write anything about me after I'm gone, I will come back and haunt you."
– Karl Germain |
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Motor City Special user Metro Detroit Area 587 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-19 01:08, Joshua Jay wrote: Josh, just to clarify what you said above, are you saying that if one has the original edition of "Destroyers" and "Silver Surf 2", one has ALL the material contained in the new edition of "Destroyers?" John Luka |
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ggarcia Veteran user San Antonio Tx 395 Posts |
I have to agree with the sankey feedback. I respect his work but he has also flooded the market with effects and I believe he easily has more dvds out then anyone else. I'm sankey'd out. I have enough sankey material to last a life time.
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Joshua Jay V.I.P. 196 Posts |
John,
That's right. I think you have all the Destroyers material if you have those things. As for Sankey, I'm sad to hear that there are people out there who feel "Sankey'd out." I understand, in a way. But if you write off this book (before it comes out, no less), I promise you will be missing one of the most extraordinary collections of magic to be released in a long time. When you see all the best stuff together (without the less-than-great material), the collection just sparkles. And there's lots of new magic very, very worthy of study too. Josh |
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ftlum Special user Roseville, CA 730 Posts |
Josh, I think a lot of us don't like to keep re-buying previously published material. I ended up (reluctantly) buying Destroyers again, because I like Troy's work... but I already have a lot of re-mixes of Sankey's material. Some-- like the in-depth DVD on Paperclipped were worth it as it went into a lot of (very good) detail that was not touched on previously, but not all these republishings feel worth the money.
- Frank |
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ralphs007 Inner circle 1087 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-02-17 14:41, Joshua Jay wrote: Hi When is the Sankey book being released ? Thanks Ralph
"You can easily judge the character of a man by how he treats those who can do nothing for him".
James D. Miles |
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