Trying find out more information on the appearance of a person from behind two panels that are wheel past each other on stage.
Any recommendations?

Just,
Larry

LOL.....ask the guy in your avatar! He did it with David Copperfield earlier this year

Agt- one of the magicians just did it.

Paul Osborne's "Easy Build Illusions" book has full details. It's a great stage effect if rehearsed well and the angles are right.

When was it done on AGT, and by who?

I was thinking the same thing. I don't remember seeing this one ever on AGT

If you can view this from the US you will see it at the 5:19 mark.

http://video.citytv.com/video/detail/104......-part-2/

It was used in passing for a switch, but not very effective as there was no reason to cover the initial person.

It can be used for an opening production as there is (hopefully) no heat on the panels at that point. I always have a spot light come on Center stage in the empty space to direct the attention there otherwise everyone just watches the panels. It's not near as good for a vanish as there is nothing to direct the attention away from the panels leaving the stage.

I feel that it's an only an "ok" production with perfect staging and direction and very easy to do poorly. YMMV

It's wonderful as a vanish if, just after the vanish happens, the assistants rotate the panels and walk off with the thin edges facing the audience. Any "knowledge gained" from a previous use of them for an appearance is then blown away. If the setting is right for the appearance, you can also have the assistants rotate the panels once or twice before they get to the center of the stage, picking up their "passenger" from a hiding spot closer to the center.

They also go well with the "Doorway to Hell" illusion which is a thin door panel, shown on both sides and then dropped flat on the floor. From there, the "door opens" and several demons creep up from "Hell" as if they were climbing stairs behind the door (or descending vice versa).

Lol... I must admit that if you crossed the screens on a fully lit empty stage well away from any curtains and just inches after they crossed, you turned them sideways... I could be fooled!

Yes, If you add apparatus or other scenic elements to it there any number of interesting variations. My thoughts were just on using the screens on an empty stage.

For example... You "could" use them in front of a BA flash appearance to produce someone, but their main use is just the cross on an empty stage with a wing pick up.

I COULD tell you how it is done on a well-lit empty stage, but this is not the place for revealing secrets.

Maybe I'll get Jim Gerrish to add it to his PVC Pipe Illusions.

Lol... you're such a tease! I could do it using additional items or restrictive sight lines but sadly not on most of the large stages I work.

You are overlooking a whole lot of other possibilities. Open your mind and think beyond the frame in which your mental picture of a stage is confined. There are four dimensions, not three.

I don't have a mental picture of a stage... I have a physical experience of a stage and the 3 dimensions or axis of measure. As I've mentioned, if you are in the middle of a fully lit stage well away from any curtains or masking and you're not using something impractical like a t**p... there must be a place to go. Without BA or optical masking you can't go US as you would require VERY limited sightlines and that won't work in virtually any theater I work in. The "Doorway to Hell" typically uses a very small stage and an US method as the large door masks the relatively short distance to the mask. It just doesn't work in the middle of a 60' stage with 45' between the back drop and the edge of the stage. I could do it for television only on that size stage as the sightlines are fixed and controlled but not in a real world situation.

If you have a method of performing the illusion as you've described in the dead center of a 60 foot by 45 foot area... I can't wait to see it in person!

Louis Histed (inventor of the Square Circle) found another way in his Materialization Illusion. Jim Gerrish revisted the illusion and added some more possibilities to it in his PVC Pipe Illusion Book 4. This is just one more way to think outside the frame. So it's not just me and Gerrish; others have been toying with this concept for years. If you have an "Aha!" moment, please don't blurt it out on this forum. Magicians don't know how to keep secrets.

I know some of Histed's methods but none that will fill the parameters I've defined but to be fair, I ordered the plans off of your site and I will gladly admit if it will work when I get them. On the other hand, if it won't work to fit the parameters I've defined, I'll admit that as well. Time will tell... oooh this is exciting!

I really went for the bait hoping to find some brain storm I hadn't ever thought of or something that would be new and different as a practical method for doing what we were discussing.

After purchasing the effect you described, I do remember the Histed method you referred to which even he says has never been "worked" meaning it was yet another theoretical idea that might or might not work in real life.

I will say that with my background, if anyone could make that method work as designed, I could... but I would never suggest it as a practical method in a real show for many reasons. Sadly, I can't explain this without tipping the method which I will not do.

Remember... we were discussing the crossed screen vanish and you stated that you had a method where the screens could be crossed, then turned edge to the audience afterwards. I proposed a set of limitations and you stated that I wasn't thinking outside the box.

I stated, "If you have a method of performing the illusion as you've described in the dead center of a 60 foot by 45 foot area... I can't wait to see it in person!"

Then you replied, "Louis Histed (inventor of the Square Circle) found another way in his Materialization Illusion. Jim Gerrish revisted the illusion and added some more possibilities to it in his PVC Pipe Illusion Book 4."

The method I purchased was indeed a very elementary method that would not come close to fulfilling the requirements I requested. The Histed method simply would not let you turn the screens to the side with the edge to the audience as you promised. Even the "vanish" in the second section was a very basic vanish which I will not tip but is nothing new or novel and will not work in the middle of a fully lit stage as I asked. The production will not allow the screens to be turned sideways in the middle of an empty stage either. I'm frankly at a loss as to any possible way you can come close to suggesting that the method I purchased will deliver what I asked. On the other hand... you got me to purchase something so I guess you won on that front.

Like anyone who has ever purchased any effect under false pretenses... I'm sadder but wiser. Thank you for a valuable lesson!

If you feel cheated, then you still haven't learned the lesson. What I offered you was a new way to THINK about the Illusion, a principle you admit you hadn't considered. I'm not suggesting you use the Histed ILLUSION but consider the PRINCIPLE he used. I'm not going to take you by the hand and lead you down the garden path (which is another excellent solution that you will not consider because for some reason you insist on imposing conditions that the original poster never mentioned) to the one and only solution for performing the pass screen illusion as I originally described it. Yoiu may dismiss Histed's PRINCIPLE as merely theoretical, but I suggest it was not theoretical to Chung Ling Soo, and is used today in a popular appearance illusion. If you can admit that there is one PRINCIPLE you hadn't considered, then perhaps you are missing others which WILL lead to a working, not theoretical, solution to the Passing Frames Illusion. Instead of shooting down every idea that does not fit in with your vast experience, work within the principles that magic provides us - all of them, not just the ones you buy in stores - and you may come up with things that surprise even you. That's the lesson. If you feel cheated, look in your PayPal account.

I did check my paypal account and you did return my money which I do appreciate. In fact I have always thought you were a good guy and appreciated what you do for the kids and giving them practical solutions to help growth. I want to make sure that isn't ever in question.

If it was a direction or idea for creating the illusion we were discussing that I didn't know or had not considered in the past... I would have gladly paid MUCH more, believe me! I have purchased MANY illusion books for much more just looking for one new idea or approach.

If you will carefully look at solutions I've developed for performers and shows around the country, I seldom use "stock methodology" preferring to ask magicians and producers to start from scratch with no self imposed constraints of past methods and create the effect first than develop a method that fits the needs of the new design. It is part of my concept of static vs. dynamic creativity. From Chris Hart's T&R Music Sheet or Transposition Finale to Disney's Totem Transformation for the DCA Brother Bear show... I have a long history of "outside the box" approaches to new effects. I created a flash transformation of a plaster art mold to a large vase of Flowers (lol... yeah it was a weird one for a special event!) That utilized REALLY weird approaches to get it to work so I love any idea that doesn't fall into the same old patterns.

My ONLY complaint with your method was that I'm always looking for practical solutions that can work in situations I need. Not ones that are restrictive on having a small stage so the proportions of the effect work properly. As an example, my Mission:IMPOSSSIBLE segment utilized a new version of the Tom Palmer "Cape Switch" for a key method. It worked because I was mostly working the Magic Castle and smaller stages where the scaling of the effect worked in the relatively cramped environment. When I later went to do the same effect on a large stage, the wing work was out of scale with the rest of the area and I had to come up with a lot of other work to compensate for the design flaw. It worked but wasn't as good as when it was at the Castle.

My Motorcycle Vanish was dependent on the US wings being set at 24'. Now in most of the theaters I was working, I could cheat the main to 48' and the Mid and US wings could tab in accordingly to scale it right but it was definitely a design flaw as some theaters looked better than others.

As I also mentioned, being an acrobat and aerialist, I have developed techniques that not many other magicians could even do so I LOVE creative thinking and thirst for practical and creative solutions!!

lol... So now we come to the crossed screen effect above!. I wanted a new way to "think" about the solution as well. It's really impossible for you to know all of the things I've thought about and solutions I've considered in the past that led me to today so I understand that it's hard for you to know what is and isn't new to me.

I was just sad because I was really excited to get something creative and new to me that I hadn't already considered. I was looking forward to something really different and I just didn't get that.

As I also had mentioned... I was seeking a real solution based on your posts, not just abstract ideas to stimulate my thinking. lol.. I must admit I have no shortage of those here! I would also agree with you that most people need a lot more of that in their thinking. I live it and preach it as well so we're are much more on the same page there then you might think in spite of your fear that "I will never learn".

In a normal creative brainstorming modality... there are no bad ideas so you can feel free to come up with any wild solution possible. When you get to the selection phase however, you must apply critical thinking and wisdom to select the best answer for each situation. It is a very conscious shaft from right brain to left brain thinking... which I believe leads to be the root of our conflict. I thought you were proposing an actual left brain solution, and you thought I just needed some right brain freedom to explore more creative ideas.

I do admit that even though I was aware of it... I didn't "consider" the Histed method for the crossed screens because it wasn't really good. I guess you could say that when I'm in my critical thinking phase...I don't consider many methods as I quickly narrow down the options based on the specific variables at hand. Max Maven once said about methods that you can technically use a sewing machine to cut a piece of steak but a knife is a more elegant solution. My job is to as efficiently as possible narrow a search down to the most practical solutions, then select something that will be as elegant and magical as possible. This is why I don't "consider" using a 100 ton crane to do the rising cards or floating dollar bill. Yes, it is creative... but dumb.

I do appreciate your "lesson" as unbeknownst to you, it is the same thing I've been pushing people towards for years. I do have a very broad knowledge that some might describe as vast but for me, it is just a small start at a great untapped resource that we can strive for utilizing effectively. I understand it is so hard on here to have meaningful discussions without knowing more about the participants. All I know about you is from your posts and books. I on the other hand I haven't really published anything publicly or talked about most of my lecturing, show direction and past thinking as it is frequently for markets outside the traditional magic areas so it was impossible for you to really know anything about me.

Thanks again for the stimulating thinking and hopefully more good things can come from our discourse on here!

All the best!

Thank you everybody!
Larry