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Melies Regular user Boston 114 Posts |
Folks, does anyone know how to safely set fire to a hanky/silk for an appearing cane effect? I've seen it done before, but I'm afraid of either damaging my (metal) appearing cane or setting the place on fire. I assume that the fire would go out with the vanish....But is there a special type of material or cloth treatment people use, or is this a normal silk or piece of cotton? Anyone have experience with this?
Thanks, John ("Méliès") |
Dick Oslund Inner circle 8357 Posts |
I hope you have plenty of liability insurance. --You might damage more than your Walsh Cane!
At a national convention (SAM,I think) a few years ago, Jay Marshall had to step in to close the final show with Lefty. The fire marahall had said, "NO!" to an act that used fire. Many auditoriums, night clugs, and yes, schools (Chicago for sure) prohibit fire. You might read the opening paragraph in Dan Mannix's "Step Right Up".
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
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Melies Regular user Boston 114 Posts |
Happily, no one yet has told me I can't use fire (although I can't say that I ask, either!). But on reflection, I can see how this effect may be significantly riskier to do than, say, a simple in-hand vanish using flash paper. I'm curious to know what other folks think about this one....
John |
Dick Oslund Inner circle 8357 Posts |
Well John, At least you can express your thouthts in clear (American) English!
May I strongly urge that you check into local fire laws and regulations. I'm not an attorney (just a retired old professional performer who has heard that "Ignorance of the law, is no excuse." Dick
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
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Anatole Inner circle 1912 Posts |
I would heed Dick's advice--even though as he states he is not an attorney. He is, however, a performer who has decades of experience performing for schools and other organizations. Personally, I don't think fire would add anything to the appearing cane effect at all. Yes, I know that Shimada does the "torch to cane" as an opening effect and that other pros do effects with fire. But why take the chance? John Moehring produced appearing canes as a running gag on "The Ed Sullivan Show" and never once used one with fire.
There are probably a lot of things that officials at a venue may never tell you that you can't do. But that is not to be construed in any way as carte blanche to do anything that would be questionable. You said "no one yet has told me I can't use fire"--but then, no one yet has told you that you can't do the bullet catch either. But in many venues that would be inappropriate. I guess you have a legitimate reason for wanting to set fire to a silk handkerchief. But it does seem like a waste of a silk scarf. ----- Amado "Sonny" Narvaez
----- Sonny Narvaez
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Ekuth Inner circle Floating above my 1538 Posts |
Jeff McBride said it best:
"Confetti is the new fire." Personally, I love fire effects. But I have never publicly performed one due to liability issues.
"All you need is in Fitzkee."
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Dick Oslund Inner circle 8357 Posts |
I just found this thread again.......
Is that confetti made of flash paper? hee hee
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
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bojanbarisic Elite user Croatia 462 Posts |
Effect was created by Juan Mayoral and it was described in some of his lecture notes. Many years ago Mahka Tendo told me about his method and preparation for this effect. If you can find Special lecture on canes by Mahka you will see it performed and explained there.
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Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
I was at a magic convention once and Juan Mayoral was there selling several of his items. He was selling the Silk on Fire to Cane. In the dealer room I watch him soak the silk with ordinary lighter fluid until it was dripping. I was so shocked when he lit the silk, and flames shoot up to his fingers holding the silk. I was only about 4 feet away from him, and just was stunned. To me this is the most illogical thing to do in a dealer room and on a show. Anything could happen for the unexpected situation. The flames were huge and very dangerous.
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Sam Sandler Inner circle 2487 Posts |
I probably should not encourage you...but SEO magic sells Wave Fire by Kikuchi
basically same thing. search there fire magic section:) but I would also second and third and fourth Dick's advice. i was a pyrotechnition for many years as part of a big magic illusion show and even with all the training and preparation things can happen. don't get me wrong I love fire. I many times perform my hands on fire routine and still today use match pulls, candles, and flash paper. but I also know when and where and don't take unnecessary risk. I also have insurance! stay safe and have fun sam
sam sandler- America's only full-time DEAF Illusionist
http://www.samsandler.com http://www.deafinitelymagic.com |
Christopher Moro Special user 793 Posts |
I also saw Mahka Tendo do the silk on fire to cane and it looked very spectacular. I never tried it because the Torch to Cane I've done is much safer. The flame is smaller, your hand is nowhere near the fire and there's much more control.
Are most venues prohibiting fire these days? |
JNeal Inner circle I used to have 999 posts, now I have 1617 Posts |
I would not expect any venues to 'easily' allow fire and I would imagine that the restrictions will get tighter over time. So why invest time and energy into effects that you may have to eliminate down the road? I work on cruise ships most of the year and some of them have outright bans on fire of any sort, and others require the Safety Officer's approval and then he has extra people standing by with extinguishers.
visit me @ JNealShow.com
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Christopher Moro Special user 793 Posts |
I had a feeling, Jonathan. I did a NYE Show and my opening effect was supposed to be torch to cane. The venue had banned fire. Silk to cane lacked the punch and was a poor substitute. It's definitely better to have something in place that won't need to change based on venue restrictions.
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Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
Quote:
On Nov 2, 2014, Christopher Moro wrote: I believe what you really may have meant was, The Silk To Cane is a poor Substitute for Fire. The Silk To Cane, if presented with showmanship and attitude is a great classic trick. It is harder to do without the dangerous fire element, but that is what separates the performers from the amateurs. |
JNeal Inner circle I used to have 999 posts, now I have 1617 Posts |
Bill brings up a valid point. Without a doubt, fire by it's very nature attracts attention: it's dangerous, it has motion, brightness, requires no explanation...we regard it as a primal force of nature. Whereas a silk scarf...is a glorified hanky. But because fire calls attention to itself... it asks less of the performer's own unique qualities. But if you can learn to hold an audience without it, you will end up being personally stronger for having done so. Paradoxically, working within limitations, frees us to be more of ourselves.
visit me @ JNealShow.com
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Christopher Moro Special user 793 Posts |
Yep, that's actually what I meant, Bill. Generically, fire can more easily and quickly capture attention than a silk.
Personally, I actually think the Silk to Cane is a more magical and potentially stronger effect than Torch to Cane because the range of transformation is greater. Something clearly soft and limp transforms into a solid walking stick in the blink of an eye. Compare that to a stick on fire turning into another, larger stick that is not on fire. Some have actually described the effect as simply, "the torch went out." Of course in my experience, transformation of the torch into the cane receives applause (framing the moment helps) but I've come to feel the silk transformation is probably clearer. Great post, Jonathan. In particular, "working within limitations frees us to be more of ourselves," has much more in it than one might realize upon first reading it! I've found that when we implement a set of creative rules or restrictions, it actually OPENS UP creativity and the work becomes better than if we had "free reign." We have to dig deeper and find something inside that is cohesive not only to the piece, but to who we are. We have a better chance of being more original that way, too. For me, this has proven itself to be true in EVERY creative endeavor I've pursued. |
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