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kah22 New user 16 Posts 
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Perhaps the best place to ask as I'm still in learning mode
I've been practicing my Hindu shuffle over the past few days. I think I have the technique correct, it's now a matter of building up speed. There is one aspect that is bugging me so hopefully you can offer some guidance When I started my practise I separated all my cards into numerical and suite order: H. D. S. C. After every three passes I checked the order of the suites and found that even after 12 passes there were still large clumps of each suite and the colours themselves weren't that well mixed. I began to think to myself that if I had to shuffle a new deck it would take quite sometime for a proper mixture Perhaps I'm lifting to many/to few cards at any one time. To get a good mix how many should I aim to lift at once: 5, 10, 15 ? Perhaps it's not a great shuffle for a new deck It does seem a relatively easy shuffle to learn. Could you suggest any solutions to my problem Kevin |
jimgerrish Inner circle East Orange, NJ 3209 Posts
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The last thing I would use the Hindu Shuffle for is to "shuffle the cards," that is, "randomize the deck." It's only important that it APPEARS to be shuffling the cards with a series of cuts. Its other uses for forcing and controlling a card or series of cards are the reason it is still very much used today. "The Royal Road to Card Magic" by Jean Hugard and Frederick Braue has an entire chapter devoted to the uses of the Hindu Shuffle. Reading should be your next step in learning what to do with this venerable card magician's tool.
Jim Gerrish
magicnook@yahoo.com https://www.magicnook.com Home of The Wizards' Journals: https://magicnook.com/wizardsTOC.htm |
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kah22 New user 16 Posts
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Quote: I must admit Jim I'm not surprised at your reply. As you said it is important that you APPEAR to be randomising the cards. It seems to me then that from a performance point of view that the best option would be the riffle shuffle, perhaps started or finished by a quick Hindu shuffle. The overhand shuffle seems so armatureiish .
On Jul 4, 2017, jimgerrish wrote: |
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jimgerrish Inner circle East Orange, NJ 3209 Posts
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Don't knock the overhand shuffle as inferior. It has its uses as well. Learn what each shuffle is good for and then be ready to apply whichever is needed for the effect you want to achieve. I have been having fun using the Paul Curry "smushing shuffle" in tricks that employ the Gilbreath Principle because it looks so deceptive to the audience and can be done with jumbo cards that really can't be shuffled any other way.
Jim Gerrish
magicnook@yahoo.com https://www.magicnook.com Home of The Wizards' Journals: https://magicnook.com/wizardsTOC.htm |
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James F Inner circle Atlanta 1096 Posts
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Why are you learning a Hindu shuffle over an overhand shuffle? I have literally never seen anyone shuffle cards that way. I have never used a hindu shuffle in performance ever. People use the overhand shuffle all the time. Hindu shuffle not only looks unnatural, but isn't a good shuffle either.
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Rupert Pupkin Inner circle 1452 Posts
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Quote:
On Jul 15, 2017, James F wrote: Because you're American. |
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James F Inner circle Atlanta 1096 Posts
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I'm assuming he is too based on his name. Could be wrong, though.
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Ben Blau Inner circle 1475 Posts
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Hindu shuffles don't necessarily seem odd in North America if done with nonchalance. In this video, I use a Hindu shuffle as part of a full deck false shuffle sequence. I tend to use this one when my attention isn't on the cards, and while I'm casually talking to the spectator. It just seems like I'm absent mindedly mixing the cards in a non-flashy way.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/qxra1gjk4w8ima......mov?dl=0
Ben Blau
http://www.benblaumentalism.com |
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James F Inner circle Atlanta 1096 Posts
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But he is specifically learning a Hindu shuffle over an overhand shuffle. If he's in north america, I would say that's a mistake.
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Ben Blau Inner circle 1475 Posts
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Just an anecdote. I live in a part of North America with a heavy middle eastern population. I've had MANY spectators shuffle my decks of cards using the Hindu shuffle as their most familiar style of shuffling.
Ben Blau
http://www.benblaumentalism.com |
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61magic Special user Sacramento California 775 Posts
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Kevin, let me add a little to this discussion. Magic in the eyes of your audience is effect... Many including Vernon believe the simple direct method was as good if not better than complicated manipulations.
With all that said a Hindu can be used in your magic provided you use it consistently and not just for one effect. The single use will cause many to conclude the shuffle was indeed the method bringing about the effect. Use the shuffle consistently, even as a nervous flourish between effects to normalize the shuffle. As the audience sees you using the shuffle all the time they will accept this as your way of shuffling. You can use a Hindu shuffle to control cards, randomize all or part of the deck or just a fancy of shuffling. What you are seeing as a problem is really the way the mixing of the cards happen during a Hindu shuffle. Unless you are trying to completely randomize a stack fresh out of a sealed box it will go unnoticed if you don't bring attention to it. I've used it and received comments from audience members about the "cool" way I shuffled the cards. Don't sacrifice smooth but just going for speed, a nice even smooth pace doesn't draw unneeded attention. Attempts at speed can draw the eyes to the wrong place at the wrong time. Keep practicing it's worth it.
Professor J. P. Fawkes
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Rupert Pupkin Inner circle 1452 Posts
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Quote:
On Jul 20, 2017, 61magic wrote: I think Darwin's advice is best: use an indirect method to produce a direct effect. |
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RayRannala New user Tampa, FL 32 Posts
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James, the Hindu shuffle is an extremely easy way to force. I do several effects that take advantage of it like the Chicago Opener. Also, unless you are into "cardistry " there is very little value in performing a "professional" looking shuffle. I deliberately shuffle in a sloppy manner to disguise my handling skills. Dropping cards from time to time hides sleight of hand. Also non magicians do not know that the Hindu shuffle is ineffective. It really works if it is the best method. I have performed it hundreds of times without question. You may want to reconsider 😃
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On Jul 15, 2017, James F wrote: |
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JBSmith1978 Veteran user NY 389 Posts
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I don't use the Hindu shuffle but I have seen many use a Hindu like shuffle. The grip is different though. It might be worthwhile to adapt the Hindu sleights to the different grip. It might mean that some of techniques don't translate well. On the other hand it might lead to new opportunities.
Best, Jed |
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DaveGripenwaldt Elite user 487 Posts
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For what's its worth, for those to whom the Hindu shuffle looks to odd to use, you can do the same type of force off an overhand shuffle.
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SimonCard Special user 601 Posts
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I haven't seen any layman doing overhand shuffle in China, they all do hindu shuffle or in-hand riffle.
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carlyle Regular user 166 Posts
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I've never seen anyone do a Hindu shuffle, but use it sometimes. I just find it somewhat uncomfortable, the wrist positions. But I have nothing against the Hindu shuffle.
I have seen a number of people (like my wife) who will do an overhand shuffle with the cards turned 90 degrees - the cards are held by the long ends as opposed to the short ends. It looks a bit like a Hindu shuffle, but feels like an overhand shuffle (which it is, of course). I've tried once in a while to use it during a control or false shuffle, but have had no luck. |
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James F Inner circle Atlanta 1096 Posts
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Quote:
On Aug 22, 2017, RayRannala wrote: Just because something is easy, doesn't mean you should be using it. It looks seriously unnatural. Will it probably fly by 99% of all spectators? Sure, I suppose. So in all honesty, there really isn't any reason to debate this issue. But I think people will kind of think to themselves that it's a weird way to shuffle cards. I don't think they would think there is anything tricky going on though. But either way, the Overhand shuffle is used much more in the magic literature and the OP would benefit much more from mastering it. This will help in the future with things like jog controls and what not. Either way, to have a card selected normally at the beginning of Chicago opener, only to then have them select a card in this really weird, unnatural way a few moments later doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Just sayin' |
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RayRannala New user Tampa, FL 32 Posts
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James, I agree that there is no need for debate. We should all use methods that best fit our performances and personal style. Thanks for your comment!
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On Aug 23, 2017, James F wrote: |
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James F Inner circle Atlanta 1096 Posts
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Right on!
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| The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » All in the cards » » The Hindu Shuffle (12 Likes) | |
Posted: Jul 4, 2017 11:09 pm 
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