I am curious if any of the members here study their area of magic for the interest in how effects are achieved without intending to perform or entertain even friends or co-workers. In other words are there those who finds magic simply an intellectually compelling area of study in and of itself? I find my interest is piqued by learning about new effects (moves, sleights)but after learning the steps of a trick I get kind of bored and want to move on. It's as if the trick has lost its mystery causing my interest in impressing someone to just fly out the window. It may sound irreverent, but at times the trick seems silly after learning its mystery.

Am I alone or have others experienced such feelings.

I doubt you're alone. Many people are just curious about the methods and history. But I think it is required to perform magic, if you want to be considered a magician.

Otherwise you are a magic historian, perhaps, or a secret enthusiast.

There are many collectors who never perform.

Well the magic happens only once the trick is performed.....
Else it's just technical and yes it becomes quickly boring.
My intellectual interest goes into the relation with an audience...learning how to turn a technical manipulation into a magical moment....

Excellent point Tendrecube. I think you may have induced me to confront some performance anxiety issues to get to the next level...i.e., the relationship with a spectator or audience.

The phrase in the OP, "my interest in impressing someone" caught my eye. Others of late have used a similar expression.

I, for one, find that a poor reason to do be involved in magic at any level, performance required or not. Or anything else in else for that matter.

Our language is changing (de-evolving) rapidly. Does this term now mean something other than egoic indulgence?

The desired result of "must be magic" requires a cooperative give and take with an observer, the study and performance of which has nothing to do'
with "impressing" someone.

Trying to push past that, magic effects can be performed in many settings other than "for entertainment." The study of the psychology of why magic works,
or why it has universal appeal, can lead to creativity and appreciation of life beyond "boring" or "technical."

I have tested the use of magic tricks (demonstration of inexplicable phenomena) in tens of thousands of presentations in which it was not known I was a magician or intended to demonstrate something astonishing. (see Furst Principles). The result was almost always that the observer questioned their personal perception of what "impossible" means. Some might say this was not "magic" as discussed by most on the Café'. The point is that "no" one does not have to "perform" magic effects in order to derive tremendous benefit from the "presentation" of inexplicable things.

So, I agree with Wichdochris is that one must perform publicly if one wishes to be known as a magician, but note that "magic moments" do not require you to be acknowledged as a magician.

The mentioned "relationship to an audience or spectator" is of great value, and magic is a great one way of achieving this -- but not the only way, and often not the best way. Consider the importance of interpersonal relations in every facet of normal life. How does performance magic prepare you for 'tomorrow's challenges? What events of awe&wonder did you observe today? How were you changed by these events?

Boring? Never!

Note that he didn't say "fool someone" but impress. When I was a youngling, I loved "impressing" people by, well, proxy. Sharing stuff that impressed me. Making friends discover the music of Pink Floyd, say. "Wow, thanks for that", they would say, totally forgetting that I am NOT Pink Floyd.

As a beginning, wanna-be magician (of the it's-a-hobby variety) I'm actually *still* trying to impress people by proxy (and dang! I wish I could "tell" so they, too, would get the punch in the guts learning a stupidly simple secret brings with it (still the best feeling, to me. I've been had! Wow! -- I understand most people hate it).

Tough love there, Funsway, but I sense a great deal of food for thought. You're insights are definitely on point. The problem is that being in my 60's, how the heck can I create a new, more appropriate perspective? The answer is I won't know until I try. Thanks for your thoughts.

TeddyBoy, I am also in my 60's and have been performing magic for over 45 years. I have never once, been bored by our art. I set challenges for myself in order to keep evolving as a performer. There are moves and sleights I am not great at anymore (due to age or health issues). I find new ways to perform, that sits well with me. I adapt. You must find the proper balance and believe that the magic you perform is meaningful. Script out performance pieces and let the stories you tell accentuate your magic. When you find a new way to look at your magic, you will once again find your passion.


Best Magical Regards,

Mark Williams

In the world of magic, there are plenty of secret collectors. I think that's okay. I mean, please don't just go tell people the secret to how a trick works. That messes it up for folks who want to actually perform. But if you just want to know the methods, go ahead and legitimately support the art of magic through your purchases. I'm fine with that and I think most magicians are fine with that.

However, sometimes it is good to be unaware of how the mystery is achieved. I think it was Dan Harlan in one of his lectures who, talking about his ACAAN, said that the real reason a magician shouldn't tell how he does things is that it ruins the trick for the audience. They just saw an amazing mystery and if you actually tell them the secret (which often is, indeed, rather simple and kind of dumb), that wrecks the enjoyment of the mystery.

If your only goal is to know the methods, go ahead and learn the methods. Most of us have other goals in magic. I enjoy sharing a moment of amazement, whether it is a simple trick or a complex one. I love when people are delighted with a trick, even as simple as a ring and string trick with the ring (large bead in my case) coming off the cord and going back onto it. It isn't a matter of impressing people, as I can do that better just by reading a palm, to be honest. It is about delighting, surprising, and occasionally amazing them. In order to do that, I need to do the moves smoothly and confidently, not just know the idea of how they are done.

I would ask you what is going to happen when you run out of secrets to learn. Will you lose all interest in magic at that point?

-Patrick

Mr. Woolery, not to worry, I am not a "divulger" of secrets. Part of my not performing is that I am quite (unexpectedly) introverted on the subject. When you tell people you are interested in card magic the first response is "show me something." Given my lack of ability in that regard, I shy away from making my interest known.
Mark, thank you for your thoughts. I hope that I can find ways to maintain my interest. Actually, I would like to get to the performance stage as a hobbyist to keep the momentum going, but that is hard for me right now.

Teddy,
Don't make he mistake if thinking that you are too old to do magic. There's a man at my local magic group who is 90. He comes to the meetings and usually doesn't perform. One meeting, however, he got into the spirit. He did the ID and coins across. It was very entertaining to see the way he enjoyed it. I myself have a hard time approaching people to show tricks. When you make the effort, most times, you won't regret it. The joy that you see on people's faces is contagious.

Ted, I didn't think you were going to share the secrets, I meant only to say that as long as that aspect of magic is respected, I have no problem with someone simply collecting secrets.

My advice is worth what any free advice from a guy on the internet is worth, but I'll give it anyway. I suggest learning exactly two card tricks to a degree that you can perform them well. Two. For me, they were Card through Handkerchief and the 9 Card Trick, as explained by Peter Marucci several years before his death. Not that I don't know other card tricks, but I feel that if you have two you can do without having to say "hmm, what am I going to do for this person who just asked me for a trick?" you have a very useful tool and are more likely to perform. There's a plan in place, in other words.

If you have those two tricks ready to go and have worked out what to say and how to present the tricks, you can ask someone to give you feedback on one. Just one. If it goes over really well, he will ask you for another. Do the other. Refuse to do any more at this time. Unless you really want to do more. But if you have two tricks ready, you can meet the challenge whenever it comes your way.

This is only if you want to do more than collect methods, though. If that's all you want to do, just do that. It is okay to be a magic collector instead of a magician. But I find a certain satisfaction in my casual performances.

-Patrick

Thank you all for your well thought-out comments.

I like watching instructional videos by the greats of magic, like Tommy Wonder. I will never construct some of the incredible props or be able to do some of the complex routines he performed.

But even so, I think it's an exercise that helps me grow in my own understanding of magic, and over time I absorb small details of presentation and approach that help me, even when performing simple tricks to family or friends.

Yes sometimes even I like to buy tricks which I know I will never perform or won't get the opportunity to perform. But I watch them just to expand my knowledge and maybe try to improvise it into more of my style. I think that is actually a very important exercise for any performer.