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phread Elite user md 486 Posts |
I'm going to side with those who start with the sleight and move on to the routine. I have been working on retention vanishes and loading techniques with coins,balls,and any small objects I can get a hold of,even corks from wine bottles. I do it in a street manner in that I approach someone and ask them to watch what I'm doing-judging from their responses I know if it worked well or not. if well I know it has improved if not well then I need more work. the advantage to this testing method is that I have not performed a routine poorly and given something away ie. a bad winged silver would be a disaster...but a quick vanish and reappearance that goes bad is not.
dug
Deckless Wonder
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Mike Wild Inner circle NY, PA, TX, MA, FL, NC 1290 Posts |
RE: "I'm going to side with those who start with the sleight and move on to the routine."
In general I'd agree with that methodology. I usually play around with a sleight or a gaff for awhile, keep it with me constantly, see what I can do with it, etc. Usually, the rough routine comes to me as I'm doing that. Then I hone it out to a finished product. Sometimes I just get a wild hair to create a routine about "something", and worry about the effects and sleights afterwards. "Quantum Mechanics" is a good example of that. The science interested me, so I created the routine based upon that, and added in sleights and gaffs once the script and premise were solid. I suppose this is one of those, "whatever works for you" kind of things. Best, Mike |
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Ronnie Ramin Loyal user 233 Posts |
I have to second Chevrie's recommendation of "The Ostrich Factor" by Gerald Edmundson. I was fortunate enough to catch "The Ostrich Factor" lecture and it was a very insightful lecture. It made me look at how I go about learning a new routine in a different way. The lecture was just the tip of the iceberg, the book really expands on it. Well worth looking for.
Ronnie Ramin |
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Gerald Veteran user Arkansas 325 Posts |
Hello!
I appreciate the recommendations of my book "The Ostrich Factor" from Mars and Chevrie and the PMs that many of you have sent. I really appreciate your interest in my book. If any of you would like further information about The Ostrich Factor, A Practice Guide for Magicians, the link to enter The Ostrich Factor page is at my web site. After entering, the links will probably answer most of your questions. Please don't hesitate to drop me a PM if you need more information. Thanks for your interest! Gerald |
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gene plampin Regular user 168 Posts |
Thanks for the references to the Ostrich factor Chevrie, Mars, and for the link Gerald. I tried your site the other day and it was under construction. Thanks for getting it up and posting it. I purchased it today.
Gene I have a corollary to my original question. Is there something you did during practice, or some method of practicing that seemed like a good at the time, but with experience you now realize hurt more than helped? Gene |
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Jaz Inner circle NJ, U.S. 6111 Posts |
I will go through an entire routine until I am sure of what is going on. I don't really concentrate on perfect sleights at this time.
If I am having a problem with the sleights used I usually isolate them and either practice them or try and find alternatives that work better for me. Once I feel OK with the sleights I'll do the routine again and decide on what patter, if any, I might use. |
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foolsnobody Special user Buffalo, NY 843 Posts |
I too am getting back into magic after many years. I think that age (I'm 58) is an important factor in three ways. 1. Physical: how limber are your digits? How much feeling do you retain in your fingertips? Etc. 2. Mental: how is your memory? Can you remember a script? Do you get more confused than you used to if you have to keep a lot of things straight in your mind at the same time? etc. 3. Reality: how much time do you have on earth? How do you want to spend it?
People seem to give advice as if we were all the same age, which is young and immortal. For me, I say find effects that you can do now, and actually start bringing some pleasure into some other people's lives. Stop theorizing, and don't wait until you're perfect in your own eyes. By then you will be dead, and you will have spent a life withholding all that you had to offer, because it didn't match up to the level you could envision, but were unable to actualize. On the flip side, if you are young and have a lot of time in front of you, by all means practice well, take advantage of it. There is nothing wrong with being able to do consistent table faros or back clip 14 coins. Those can be very useful tools in the right context. But not for me. I don't know about you but if I get a deck in my hands I practice invisible classic passes. Well, invisible to me anyhow! How can I get better? By doing it incorrectly more frequently? How can I correctly learn the top card cover pass without personal instruction from Fred Robinson? I don't think I can. How many angles can they show on a video? How many ways can they describe it in a book? Harry Lorayne's statement that you must learn to make what you know to be your errors appear to be what you intended all along is very very profound. Tough to do with coins though! |
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JJP161 Special user Columbus, Ohio 509 Posts |
Quote:
On 2004-08-16 17:27, Jive-Turkey wrote: Thank you for sharing Jive-Turkey. It's not too far from my method of practice now; you just added some additional structure that I needed. Thanks, Joe |
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Gerald Veteran user Arkansas 325 Posts |
The complete review by Mike Close in MAGIC magazine and other review excerpts from Genii and MUM of The Ostrich Factor are now available at my web site.
Regards, Gerald |
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Mano Inner circle 1028 Posts |
Hi Foolsnobody,
I am sure you fool a buch of people. Thanks a lot for your avice, I really relate with what you wrote above; I feel as if you read my mind right there,LOL. thanks again. Have a good week. Mano. |
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owen.daniel Inner circle England 1048 Posts |
It sounds obvious, but evidently some people still fall into this trap.
I know numerous young magicians (and some old ones), who will learn a sleight that sounds good, or has status (is known to be difficult to master), just for the sake of having it under their belt. In my opinion this is useful practice time being put straight down the drain...Only learn something that is going to serve you a purpose! If you are a beginer, then learning the second deal as your first card sleight is hardly logical...not only will it discourage you (as it will be a very slow learning curve), but once mastered (if it ever is), you will find it difficult to put it into any situation, as you will frequently have to have another move down to do the whole routine. Of course there are many that belong to the theory that learn as many variations and adaptations as possible (this is the sort of theory that modern disciples of Marlo's RCT seem to live by), in this way you can do Jazz magic, and never be caught out with a move. Personally I do not think much of this approach, Jazz magic certainly has its beauties (as does jazz music), but bad jazz...well in musical terms I suppose its like listening to a bunch of people tuning up! The idea of learning 12 different versions of the second deal, just incase one day one of your arms is chopped off and you do have to resort to one or other of your single handed deals, is one (in my mind) that is focusing on the egotistical side of magic, the sort of magic displayed at clubs and conventions. Stick to what is useful, and what you deem to be achievable...Of course stretch yourself, but to not lose your interest in magic, due to not attaining the goals you set out to reach. Owen |
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sleightofhander Special user 618 Posts |
Amen to that!!
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