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MentaThought Special user 615 Posts |
I agree, the timing and seeming promotion of the original posts about these fellows does cause one to pause to consider what's going on.
Having said that, I do think some here are being a bit too harsh on them. I only viewed the video clip once but it seemed to me to be rather like a bend Osterlind did in one of his videos only, from my perspective, it was somewhat more believably executed in the video clip.
"A good mentalist ... will teach you a miracle because he understands the subtleties ..." -- Banachek
"If this works it'll be BEAUTIFUL!" - The Amazing Kreskin on a stunning effect he performed on his 1970s television series (PS: it worked) |
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Winnes Elite user 473 Posts |
Isn't he one of the guys from that awful "playing tricks" programme??
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mike stevenson Loyal user 276 Posts |
I believe he is
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Winnes Elite user 473 Posts |
Thought so. Hmm Dr Jez Rose and Dr Keelan Leyser from playing tricks both being praised here.. interesting.
I actually found it very encouraging and inspiring. After all, if this joker can get on the telly, cant we all? |
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Rabbitless Hat New user 65 Posts |
I don't know about Dr. Rose, but I noticed that everything on the websites that talked about Dr. Leyser seemed to be in conjunction with other Ph.D's. His best skill may be that he is able to join or create teams for projects.
This isn't a criticism, just an observation that his main skill may not be performing and that his getting on television may have more to do with these people or academic skills than with his performing skills. Interesting approach possibly....
"Too much flourish for the magicians. Too much magic for the flourishers."
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Dark Thought 13 Regular user Washington D.C. 122 Posts |
Just watched it... I think rather than criticising the first guy on this post we should point him in the right direction as to good metal bending as he clearly has no idea which I might add isn't an attack just an observation if he thinks that is good..
Now if he is Dr Dodgy Bend we are still doing him a favour and ourselves as well as he wont bother promoting his own junk until he is a little more up to par.. The kid on the video was ------- awful (fill in the blanks with your favourite phrase) DT13
"I love the one with the plastic thumb!"
Someone who has seen a s*** magician |
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DangerMouse Special user LONDON CITY 509 Posts |
Quote:
On 2005-02-05 16:16, ChEeKy_MoNkEy wrote: Erm...yes multiple times. It's just that we don't all go around blowing our own saxophones. Curt.
Cheese is nothing but thick milk.
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keelanleyser New user London UK 18 Posts |
Wow! Thank you gentlemen for your wonderful comments. They are, as always, very much appreciated!
Someone emailed me to let me know you guys had spent all this time discussing my metal bending performance on This Morning. So I thought I'd join up to have a read. Firstly, I am not the user 'tablehand magic' I have no idea who this person is, but I thank him for his comments, however, it probably would have done me more favours had he not advertised my website to the magic community. I also agree with the other guys that I am not a household name. Television for me is a necessary evil, it is important to have it on your marketing material to establish your self as a more successful performer in the eyes of a booker. In reality there is not much financial gain from television work and for me I consider it just another gig - it's usually a pain. Speaking to a very well known mind reader recently at a gig about this we came to the conclusion that television is all about compromising your performance to get the job done there are usually many other factors at play when working on TV especially live TV. This could be a topic in itself. ------------- Correct! most of you have not have heard of me. The reason for this is that for the past ten years after winning a few magic competitions in the UK I came to realise that the majority of you slag each other off all the time and that is all you seem to do. I am out there working live gigs all the time, some of my videos are proof of that. I recently gave up my memberships to the two major magic societies in the UK due to the fact that I all I got through the post from them was the council and members slating each other. ------------------------ Regarding exposure... I exposed nothing on This Morning and never had any intention to. All that we did on the series was mention that magicians could replicate the work of a psychic. I had no power in stopping the presenter mentioning the fact that an extremely famous (the most famous!!) psychic spoon bender left carbon paper behind the last time he was on the show (shouldn't he have none better?). It was the first I heard of it. I did not teach the guest how to bend spoons I made the guest use Keval's spoon and so she was none the wiser on the method. -------------------------- Regarding technique...my absolute sincere apologies to all of you extremely insulted by my performance on the metal bending side. Yes, I used a techniques from Banacheck and Gerry's DVD Psychokinetic silverware. I think that calling the performance a rip off, just by using a techniques taught to me my a DVD that is available to anyone is slightly inaccurate. Note to Banacheck...I apologise if you didn't think I came up to scratch using one of your methods..maybe you could coach me next time you come to the UK. ----------------------- Regarding Playing Tricks...you didn't like it, poor you! It was a bit of fun playing tricks on the public! There was no exposure on it though that must have kept some of you happy! ---------------------- Regarding Jez Rose...Yes we were both on Playing Tricks...big deal...I know nothing on what Jez is doing, I very very rarely speak to him, I know nothing on his academic qualifications and I have never seen him perform live either. So can't comment. He seems a nice guy though...he can talk a lot, is very funny and has a cool website. That’s all I can say on him… -------------------------- Regarding Rabbitless hat, than you for studying my life. Yes I have worked with a lot of other PhD’s, when you are in the field of academia you tend to work with specialists in areas other then your own. My degrees are in economics so I tend to work with a PhD in psychology (because, surprise surprise, he knows a bit about psychology then I do!) and a pure mathematician (because he know a bit more about mathematics, although I can destroy him on statistics!) Regarding my performance abilities – come over to the UK and let’s compete against each other at the British Stage Magic Championships next year and let 3500 people in the audience decide what our performance ability is like. I’m serious! come on compete against me…it’ll be so much fun! J Regarding Dark Thought 13 and others Please do point me (I am sincere on this too) in the right direction so I can improve my technique, I always will take advice on board and am always keen to learn. Oh by the way… I see the majority of you have hidden your websites, names and email addresses from public viewing. Why would you do this…embarrassed are you? Surely not! Let’s have a look at your performance videos and websites so we can give you some constructive criticisms. The only person who has put their website on the web is drewmcadam and this website is ------- awful (fill in the blanks with your favourite phrase) … although I can help you with this if you would like help, I do all my own webdesign myself. Regarding a mentalism DVD…I don’t have a mentalism DVD out and have no intention of putting a mentalism DVD out at all. I have one DVD out for beginners that is aimed for the general public with a flirting stance to it that’s all. Going back to user 'tablehand magic' can you please reveal yourself to me? Do I know who you are, are you the person that emailed me directing me to this site? If so, I thank you but I think you opened up a can of worms I could have done without. My websites are not aimed for magicians they are aimed for my potential bookers so please don’t look at my websites they are not for you guys. Have a good day gentlemen, I have to go now and get ready for a gig this evening. Just another note...I have just seen 'tablehand magic's' comments on my DVD and I appreciate that they sound like they are from a salesman or a person getting commission from the video. If they were from me I would have been a bit more subtle in my approach. As mentioned before I had no intention of marketing this DVD to magicians as they are very simple tricks aimed for the general public. I am going to contact the person that is dealing with the sales of that DVD to make sure it didn't come from them. I apologise (again) for any apparent tacky (but nice) comments made by other people that are out of my control. Keelan
http://www.magictricks.co.uk
http://www.facebook.com/magictricks ----------------------------------- http://www.keelanleyser.co.uk |
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ChEeKy_MoNkEy Regular user FCCL 149 Posts |
Hmmmm....I think most people seemed to "miss" the point I was making here in response to tablehand magic's post. I thought it was fairly obvious, I was neither supporting nor attackng Mr. Leyser, I simply pointed out my curiosity as to the strength of the replies to tablehands post.
Still, good to see Mr. Leysers intelligent and candid response. Dangermouse wrote in response to my question about appearing on TV:- Quote:
Erm...yes multiple times. ..err I don't think Mr. Leyser blew his "own" saxaphone about appearing on TV...I think you'll find that was done for him. |
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keelanleyser New user London UK 18 Posts |
Thank you very much cheeky monkey. Yes my trumpet was blown for me and still is blowing it by looking at other forums. It is very sweet for this guy to do so, but I wish he would stop. It's a tad embarrassing.
Now I really must go and get ready for my gig! KL Err..saxaphone..not trumpet
http://www.magictricks.co.uk
http://www.facebook.com/magictricks ----------------------------------- http://www.keelanleyser.co.uk |
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ChEeKy_MoNkEy Regular user FCCL 149 Posts |
Keelanleyser - thanks for the response. Yes I was going to put Trumpet, but I thought it might appear "rude" to "correct" Dangermouse, so I decided to leave it in..lol!
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chicagoman Regular user 105 Posts |
Dr. Leyser,
I can't tell whether you're sincere or sarcastic. My critism of your performance, and I believe the others', was a sincere honest, unsolicitated opinion of your performance. (And please realize, as well, we were almost unanimous.) The slam on Drew's website and challenges to "magic show" duels does not seem to be in line with someone taking the critism very well. I personally appreciate you coming on board and explaining yourself (though again I'm not sure how you really feel) but surely you must realize the sensitivity magicians have about exposure and performance. If you're interested in opinions in that vein, you more than welcome here anytime. |
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keelanleyser New user London UK 18 Posts |
Good evening I'm just back from my gig. I am absolutely sincere regarding all my comments chicagoman and I do appreciate honest opinions regarding my performance. I have two pet hates though. Firstly, people jumping to conclusions or making assumptions regarding my background, knowledge experiences or passion in magic and secondly being accused of writing things I didn't write or exposure of mentalism I didn't do. If they are genuine constructive criticisms of performance that's good that but the majority of comments like 'this guy is sh*t, my dog is a better performer is not helpful to anyone' especially from people who are supposed believe in furthering the art of magic or mentalism.
BTW... I was sincere regarding my comments on Drews website but I was also sincere that I could give help if he requires it. Regarding ,the comment on the championships, yes, tongue in cheek, but still sincere, I'm intending to enter many comps next year and it would be nice to see some of these people that write so much actually perform live and they too can see me live as 10 years have past since I last entered a competition. Also chicagoman, I have just reread one of your attacks. I do appreciate you feel strongly on many issues on mentalism but to go straight in and start calling me an 'IDIOT etc' before you have ever met me, spoken or seen me perform live does make it quite hard for someone who has initially seen all these posts about themselves to accept these criticism without a hint of sarcasm too. I genuinely have been booked many times from people who have viewed clips from my site. I hopeyou don't feel that my clients are Idiots too for booking me as I have many many client video comments and ready to put up on my site with genuinely great reports of total amazement of bewilderment by real laymen. Now, before people jump in and say how arrogant I must be to say that, I'm not. I'm not saying I'm the best spoon bender, mentalist, illusionist , magician in the world all I am saying is that for the past 10 or so years I have done literally 100's and 100's of performances on different areas of magic and the majority of them have gone down really well perhaps with a few exceptions. Surely you must agree that, that is furthering the art of magic. Yes there is always room for improvement, isn't there always. If I was already the best then I might as well give up but at least I'm having fun giving it a go to best I can given certain circumstances. I can see why people would think this 'tablehand magic' guy is me. I was thinking about his comments today and how unrealistic they appear and that if comments are too good to be true...they probably are...either this guy is a major fan of mine ( it's nice to have one at least out there ;-)) or he knows how these chat forums work and has written all this stuff to make me a target for attack. The guy has been giving such great comments about my DVD that were so over the top it's untrue...he wrote that I should create a sequal to it before he has even viewed the product..how can the guy say that. He also claims to know that I regularly use the illusion audience dismember which I have only used once or twice which has caused similar comments to the ones here on other parts of this forum.
http://www.magictricks.co.uk
http://www.facebook.com/magictricks ----------------------------------- http://www.keelanleyser.co.uk |
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ChEeKy_MoNkEy Regular user FCCL 149 Posts |
Keelanleyser wrote:-
Quote:
If they are genuine constructive criticisms of performance that's good that but the majority of comments like 'this guy is sh*t, my dog is a better performer is not helpful to anyone' especially from people who are supposed believe in furthering the art of magic or mentalism. I agree.....why are some people so ready to jump in with derogatory and sometimes puerile comments instead of gving constructive criticism? As for tablehand magic, I don't know him from Adam, but I took his original post at face value and was a little surprised at the stream of what seemed like quite "hostile" comments. Tongue in cheek banter or constructive comments are one thing..."wiseguy" remarks are another.... Just my thoughts |
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Vision Veteran user London 395 Posts |
Trust me, my dog is quite a spoon bender, I never said it was mentalism though.
As for wanting to further the art of mentalism? No I don't want to, personally I will and I do, but I've seen so much bad stuff 'out there', that I think magic and mentalism is almost beyond help. And I can do well without any competition. //Daniel
www.awonderfulmind.blogspot.com
check it out for new products. |
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keelanleyser New user London UK 18 Posts |
Daniel...I hope you further the art of mentalism sounds like you believe you will do, you certainly are going to make lot's of money with your spoon bending dog. A mind reading dog was big in the 30's nice to see it revived. The last dog I saw wasn't a mind reading dog but a hypnotist it was called hypno dog, he is still around actually, Germany I think, MTV approached me and a few of the Playing Tricks guy who you love so much to do a pilot that involved this dog. Good luck with yours I hope you make many millions from him.
Though you may or may not be interested to know that a company that I know have created an electronic cueing device for instant stooging use that is going to be marketed at Blackpool for around £150 mark. Have you have good and successful lives...I 'm out of here (for the moment)
http://www.magictricks.co.uk
http://www.facebook.com/magictricks ----------------------------------- http://www.keelanleyser.co.uk |
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nic New user Lancashire 4 Posts |
WOW..... I am relativley new to magic and can not claim to be an expert at all. I regularly post to another magic forum and have found that it is a great place to go to get advice and chat about magic in general or specific styles.
As you will see this is only my second post on this forum, after reading this thread I wonder whether it may be my last. It is a shame to see people slinging mud at each other. Criticism is a positive element to anyone wanting to learn and develop, but unstructured comments are distructive. Maybe people need to look at there response and think how would I react to this? How would I feel? If you were honest I think you would rather have structured comments made about yourselves and your performance so that you can develop yourself. I am dissapointed at the way people here have welcomed new people and are derogatory about others without stating what they find wrong with what they do. |
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Muddy Elite user 449 Posts |
Don't let it run you off nic ... there's a lot more good than bad here. Being in the spotlight (TV) seems to bring out non-constructive (even mean) comments from peers sometimes here. I'm sure they aren't necesarily bad people ... it just that the internet tends to change our personalities for the worse sometimes ... I know that I am not immune from this phenomena, and I try counter it (for myself) by conducting myself as if I were face to face with the people with whom I am communicating.
Welcome! |
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ChEeKy_MoNkEy Regular user FCCL 149 Posts |
Hi nic - I too am new here. Some of the points you raised - I have raised also in this thread and a couple of others. I guess there will always be a few people who think making "wiseguy" comments is the way to go instead of giving constructive criticism. However, I must say I agree with Muddy on this - I've found the majority of people on here more than willing to be helpful.
So don't be put off, remember everybody was a "newbie" once lol. Keep posting and welome. CM |
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ThomasBerger Special user 593 Posts |
The point a lot of people miss is that it doesn't
matter what your opinion is of any performer... The only thing that counts is what laypeople think. And the acid test in the real world is *re-bookings*. If you get rebooked often, you are doing it right. You can talk all you like about doing this move or that one better, it's the same argument they have in magic clubs where where some amateur with "slow motion perfect" ability of some move like the pass considers himself the fastest gun in the west and can't understand how the Pro is getting away with "easier" or "inferior" moves (or heaven forbid- no moves) in performance. I have to say, the L+L website, clients and testimonials, movies and "packaging" of mentalism as a business tool is superb. They have a highly marketable product for the business world, and these guys must be making a mint. Combining mentalism with business practical strategies has huge potential in the corporate world. I think the way they have packaged biz strategies with mentalism, sound and light show and economics of buying, is one of the best presentational "hooks" for corporate that I have ever seen. I say good luck to these guys. They have inspired me. Tom |
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