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Cameron Francis
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Another On The Spot topic: Love 3/4 Across; not quite getting the Goshman Pinch down. Could someone PM me on some pointers?

Much appreciated.
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GeorgeSantos
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Jay Sankey's Revolutionary Coin Magic video teaches it in detail since his routines are based on it.
"David Roth is the greatest coin manipulator in the entire world.."

-Dai Vernon "The Professor"


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ClouDsss
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There are many DVDs that teaches this sleight. Also known as Tenkai Pinch (if I am not wrong).

Check out Rubinsteins's Encyclopedia of Coin Sleights Vol 1 - 3 or Ammar's Introduction to Coin Magic.

Sankey uses this sleight quite often in his routines too.

cheerios
Think outside the box, cos people are all thinking inside now!! - ClouDsss
Vraagaard
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I've worked on the 3/4 across and Sankey's Mr. Clean coins across both using the Goshmann pinch in every transfer. I can only say that I was quite happy to see Sankey perform it live in Blackpool 2 weeks ago, and to see him not care about the angles. He performed this with people all around, well knowing that a least 30% of the specs would see the last coin (if they looked at the right spot). Because that's the whole problem here, you want people straight in front of you using the Goshmann pinch, and that has always been my problem with this rotuine.

I've found that doing the 3/4 across in a table hopping situations you can actually lower your hand towards the edge of the table to hide that last coin (It's always the 3rd coin that seems to flash more than the first two coins - simply because you cannot hold your hand in the right angle, because you have to hold the other 2 coins visibly as well).

For your information, the only difference between 3/4 and Sankey's routine is the secret transfer of the last coin. Gregory Wilson dumbs it over, whereas Sankey puts it over, using a Roth subtlety. I must admit though that Sankey spends more time on teaching the ins and out of the Goshmann pinch, but there is really not much to it than sliding it in position, not hiding to much of the pinky, making sure it doesn't flash from the front and that it is in a slight angle on the back of your hand.

Good luck.
GeorgeSantos
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Scotty York has an interesting way of getting into the Goshman Pinch/Tenkai Pinch. Rather than sliding it in a curled palm, he does it with the palm flat and without the help of the thumb. It is quite hard at first, but it is a great alternative to the closing of the fist method.
"David Roth is the greatest coin manipulator in the entire world.."

-Dai Vernon "The Professor"


I AM A FILIPINO MAGICIAN
Werner G. Seitz
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Quote:
On 2005-03-07 06:21, GeorgeSantos wrote:
Rather than sliding it in a curled palm, he does it with the palm flat and without the help of the thumb.
I think he does use his thumb, but he does push the coin between his middlefinger and thumb and not 'over' the tips of them as usually done..
There ARE some advantages doing it that way, but not that it matters that much..the classical way -I think- is more surefire.

Doing it without the help of the thumb would be quite foolish and just fingerflinging to display it for fellow magicians..it simply can't be 'safe' enough to do under fire..so I can't imagine Scotty does it that way, he not even did it that way many years back, when he wrote up his C/S/B in Genii.
Learn a few things well.....this life is not long enough to do everything.....

( Words of wisdom from Albert Goshman ...it paid off for him - it might
as well for YOU!!!- My own magic is styled after that motto... Smile )
harris
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On one of the Roth tapes, he shares and interesting use of the T.P. with a coin and hankerchief.

I was lucky enough to see Goshman at a convention back in 76. It was back when I knew next to nothing about coin magic. Now I know even less.

Be safe, well and creative.

Harris
Harris Deutsch aka dr laugh
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Dan Watkins
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Quote:
On 2005-03-07 06:39, Werner G. Seitz wrote:
..it simply can't be 'safe' enough to do under fire..

Apollo Robbins does a palm up entry into Tenkai Pinch safely under fire. He does it under the cover of his other hand during a "wave". I never saw him miss and he did it several times for me. Pretty sure it is on Cultural Exchange 1 "Coin Exercise"
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Werner G. Seitz
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Quote:
On 2005-03-07 14:41, Dan Watkins wrote:
Apollo Robbins does a palm up entry into Tenkai Pinch safely under fire.

Dan, 'without' the use of his thumb at all??
Ok, I just tried it, it can be done, but of course I couldn't do it fast and certainly not 'safe', but it worked the first time, so with a lot of practice it's doable, but TBH, I wouldn't spend the time, it works fine the standard way..
Learn a few things well.....this life is not long enough to do everything.....

( Words of wisdom from Albert Goshman ...it paid off for him - it might
as well for YOU!!!- My own magic is styled after that motto... Smile )
Cameron Francis
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I'm getting better at it. Worked on it last night and for some reason, it started clicking (figuratively, not literally).

Getting it into position quickly will take a lot more practice.
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Vandy Grift
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If I'm not mistaken when Greg Wilson does the Goshman pinch on 3/4 across he slides the coin over the top of his fingers and into the pinch. I never liked that method, I can do it really well with my left but not the right for some reason. You should check a few sources and see which way of getting into position is best for you. You don't have to do it the same Greg Wilson does in order to do the routine. It sounds like you've made some progress which is great, but try a couple of different ways as well. It's the best way to find out which is best suited for you.
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leko
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In the Second British Close Up Symposium, 1991, p.55 is described a spellbound move by Geoff Ray, where he uses the Scotty York method to get the coin into Goshman pinch, but without the use of the thumb. (with illustrations)
Dan Watkins
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Quote:
On 2005-03-07 15:20, Werner G. Seitz wrote:
Dan, 'without' the use of his thumb at all??


Yes without the thumb at all, that is what makes it very deceptive looking, he just waves his hand over the coin, and the coin is gone. It is first front clipped by the 1st and 2nd finger, and then the third finger moves up, the forth down, and clipped in Tenkai. I can't do it very fast either, but I imagine with practice, I could. He did.
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angpc
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I only know Greg Wilson's method, from the On the Spot video.
I can't do it for all angles, but it works best for me if the spectator is on the same side as my T.P.ing hand.
(also it seems that your hands develop more strength with practice, which helps with keeping the coin in position)
corte1
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Hello,

I've found that Sankey's Mr. Clean Coins Across gets a much better reaction when you simply borrow 3 quarters from someone and perform it. You use their borrowed quarters - make all three transfer from one hand to the other, and then immediately give them back their quarters. A big advantage to this is that the Goshman pinch is much easier to perform with a quarter than with a half dollar. Plus, these days, people just immediately get suspicious when you pull 3 half dollars from your pocket. I mean, come on, who carries half dollars around? I went to my bank the other day and asked for half dollars and was told the bank doesn't carry them anymore. Mr. Clean Coins across plays beautifully and looks more like real magic if you use borrowed quarters.

Just my 50 cents worth!

Corte Swearingen
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Cameron Francis
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Well, I could do it another way, but I've been practicing so much doing it the way Greg demonstrates it that I'm finding it difficult to do it any other way. I think I'll stick with his method for now and once I get good at it, try different techniques.
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Bill Wells
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Quote:
On 2005-03-07 06:39, Werner G. Seitz wrote:
Quote:
On 2005-03-07 06:21, GeorgeSantos wrote:
Rather than sliding it in a curled palm, he does it with the palm flat and without the help of the thumb.
I think he does use his thumb, but he does push the coin between his middlefinger and thumb and not 'over' the tips of them as usually done..
There ARE some advantages doing it that way, but not that it matters that much..the classical way -I think- is more surefire.

Doing it without the help of the thumb would be quite foolish and just fingerflinging to display it for fellow magicians..it simply can't be 'safe' enough to do under fire..so I can't imagine Scotty does it that way, he not even did it that way many years back, when he wrote up his C/S/B in Genii.


Scotty does not have to use his thumb when getting into the "Goshman" pinch with a single coin. If the coin is positioned properly, it is not that difficult to go into the pinch from the palm...just takes a little getting used to... Although is is certainly much easier with the thumb. Using the thumb, one can also selectively put one from a group of two or three coins into the pinch.

Bill
Dan LeFay
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I've seen Geoff Ray do his things with pinching. It looks marvellous. What does he do nowadays? Still in magic?
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Tom Wolf
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If you can do a simple revolve from between forefinger and little finger to the rear of the hand, all you need to do is releaee the coin from forefinger and allow it to be held by little finger.

All this can be done without the thumb.

As your right hand covers the left hand for a moment, just do the revolve the the rear palm and release.

Go forth and amaze.

Tom Wolf
The magic director and performer at the Rincon Gaucho supper club in Mexico City,

We opened the first and only close-up room for magic in Mexico with Wolf Ruvinskis.
have several new coin vanishes and routines to share shortly just as soon as I can find someone to film them for me.


Now living in Harrison, Ohio
Werner G. Seitz
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Quote:
On 2005-03-08 13:08, Dan LeFay wrote:
I've seen Geoff Ray do his things with pinching. It looks marvellous. What does he do nowadays? Still in magic?

I wonder too..
I did meet Geoff Ray once, when he was in company of Fred Robinson, can't recall at what convention, but I think it was in Paris 1973.
Fred asked me to do *something* and I did a silly Spellbound, finishing /getting rid of one of the coins via the Topit.

Geoff Ray immediately did a few very clever Spellbound moves, I recall he used the Goshman pinch and throwing a silver forth and back from one hand to the other made it change to copper and immediately back to silver.
VERY well and expertly done.

He showed me the technique for this change and it was very practical and not too tough to do, in any case I was very impressed..
Actually I still can do it to this day..

At first I thought he was Milton Kort Smile and said so to him... Smile
(Never had seen Milton Kort)

Wonder what he's up to these days..I also recall, he was involved in Karate, actually somewhere I still have his advertising card with fotos aso I got at that time and a pic of him together with Fred Robinson tooken at some english convention, a pic Fred did send me later..

(BTW Dan, the *colourchanging deck* you've seen is Geoff Rays..used with his permission)

Quote:
On 2005-03-08 14:33, mago wrote:
If you can do a simple revolve from between forefinger and little finger to the rear of the hand, all you need to do is releaee the coin from forefinger and allow it to be held by little finger.

All this can be done without the thumb.
It depends highly on the size of your hand contra the size of the coin used!
It really should be as large in diameter as the distance between your forefinger and little finger, actually a bit larger in dia.
Still it's very tough to do without the use of the thumb.
I'm pretty sure not many are able to use that 'technique'.
Learn a few things well.....this life is not long enough to do everything.....

( Words of wisdom from Albert Goshman ...it paid off for him - it might
as well for YOU!!!- My own magic is styled after that motto... Smile )
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