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D.Paul Loyal user 228 Posts |
Hello. I was asked by a family member if I would do a charity gig on Saturday night, so I said I would. Even though I hate walk around I did it anyway. What a nightmare. The place was candle lit and the music was that loud, no one two inches away could hear what I was saying. I found that nothing was working that I was use to doing. For instance, I couldn't peek at anything, it was to dark. They couldn’t read any predictions I had wrote out. Even when I ask them to pick a card they couldn't hear a word I said. So I ended up doing coin tricks and napkin made sponge balls, but they even found that hard to follow. Anyone else had this problem? It’s really put me off.
Darren |
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Ken Dyne Inner circle UK 2268 Posts |
I don't mean to sound condisending here Darren mate, I always check out the venue first. if I cant go along personally, as often I just don't have the time, then I ask about the conditions first. I often say that I require such and such conditions, and get them to agree. In my contract it clearly stipulates that I must be able to be clearly seen and heard by every member of the audience.
"If in doubt get the contract out." However if I was thrown into that situation, fork and spoon bending might work. If you present a levitation of an object as mental effor that could be great, such as a ring or soemthing. Some PK stuff. I think you need to think visual mental effort for loud places. Hope this helps, Kennedy
MR GOLDEN BALLS 2.0: https://mentalunderground.com/product/mr-golden-balls-2-0/" target="_blank"> https://mentalunderground.com/product/passed-out-deck/
BAIRN: Named 'Best Mentalism Product Of 2014 by Marketplace of the Mind is my collection of more than 40 mentalism routines in a beautiful paperback book: http://www.mentalunderground.com/product/bairn |
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Ian Broadmore Special user 555 Posts |
Agree with Kennedy, experience shows you don't accept ANY gig unless you have all the details of the venue etc.
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Mark Timon Special user 594 Posts |
Next time read before the book - Maximum entertainment - by Ken Weber.
Regards |
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D.Paul Loyal user 228 Posts |
Thank's for the reply, I was asked only a few hours before the gig and since it was a family member I accept. I had asked about the conditions and I was told there would be poeple mingerling around with some backround music ( hmmm lol ) and since I was just doing this as a faver I wasnt getting paid, So there was no big loss. But I will look into some Pk effects its never been my cup of tea but its worth dabbel.
Cheers Darren |
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Beauregard New user Katrinaville 66 Posts |
Dear Sir,
When one does a performance that has no worth, The performance is perceived as Worthless. With Deep Regard, Beauregard |
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Ken Dyne Inner circle UK 2268 Posts |
I'm sot sure that this "free" performance had no worth. There may well have been potential custom for Darren at this event, or soem other worth. I would say that there is no such thing as a worthless performance, unless of course you are a poor performer.
Just my thought, Kennedy
MR GOLDEN BALLS 2.0: https://mentalunderground.com/product/mr-golden-balls-2-0/" target="_blank"> https://mentalunderground.com/product/passed-out-deck/
BAIRN: Named 'Best Mentalism Product Of 2014 by Marketplace of the Mind is my collection of more than 40 mentalism routines in a beautiful paperback book: http://www.mentalunderground.com/product/bairn |
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Beauregard New user Katrinaville 66 Posts |
My dear boy,...Let's suppose a performer has enough free time to work for nothing.
Now,let's suppose that a potential client is present at the event who makes the following inquiry to the promoter. Client: "What is the fee for this fine performer, as I would like to hire him and I would surely like to have an idea of what you are paying for his services? Oh what's that you say,...nothing ! Well in that case I wish to make him what I suppose is a generous offer. Mr. Performer, are you free son a week from next tuesday? Perfromer:Why yes I am sir. Client:How would you like to make $100.00 Performer:But sir my fee is 10 times that amount. Client:Well it certainly isn't today son and if your free next tuesday you musent be that busy. This is how it is perceived by the public,..trust me on this young man. Ask yourself and then ask anyone here to truthfully answer how much good paying work they ever got thru free performances ? If they are truthfull, I trust you will have your answer. Remember,...when you work for free it is costing another performer a payday. With Deep Regard, Beauregard |
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Spinnato Elite user 428 Posts |
In the words of Mr David Ginn:
"Adapt, adapt, adapt" |
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Avocat Elite user 446 Posts |
My advice to Darren : read 'em the riot act. Or at least complain a little. To me, a last-minute, spur-of-the-moment retention says your relative doesn't appreciate how much work and skill is involved, and possibly thinks you're just playing around when you perform. And if that's NOT the case, your relative should still know that situations like that make you feel devalued, whether your relative actually appreciates you or not.
As a practical matter, if the conditions were that bad, no one will remember you anyway (certainly not as a BAD magician), so no harm done. If you think you'd LIKE to prepare for situations like that in the future (but WHHHYYYY?), you could incorporate PK effects into your repertoire. I can tell you from personal experience that PK effects do work well in such environments. You can do NW/SG stuff, but be sure to use a grease-pencil SG or SuperSharpie. PK Touches also works VERY well; darkness can be your friend sometimes! As for "free = never," that depends. Here in Hawaii, we have a few well-known and relatively successful local entertainers who, because of the nature of things here, are related to a lot of people and wind up as wedding guests. Many times they perform short sets or pieces as a sort of wedding gift. So, yes, they do so for free, without losing business, lowering their prices or diminishing their perceived value. One comedian in particular, while supposedly just leading us in a traditional toast, did a fifteen minute set from the podium. His full show is over two hours. But for just fifteen minutes, we all had a good laugh and, speaking for some of us, wound up more motivated to see his whole show and were suitably impressed that our host had the guy as a relative. So it isn't fatal. Just a bad idea to make a habit of it, or you really will lower your value to zero. |
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Terry Holley Inner circle 1805 Posts |
Darren:
Working conditions aside, I applaud you for performing gratis for a charity. Considering the ideas in Beauregard's post regarding fees, I offer this suggestion. When cosidering charity work, stipulate a fee, but arrange to donate all or part of it back during the "negotiations." This will set charity work apart from other gigs. Terry
Co-author with illusionist Andre' Kole of "Astrology and Psychic Phenomena."
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delbmarcs New user 67 Posts |
I respect D.Paul's generousity, but have to side with the heartfelt points Beauregard
makes. We can't give away what we value, and secrets, surely, are .never. free. That's solid knowledge.
The thing about doing the impossible is that you've got no competition.
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Ken Dyne Inner circle UK 2268 Posts |
Beauregard, good point. Thanks for sharing. The solution I have always worked with, and may very well be ther wrong one is as follows:
I have agreed to do the gig for "free"" but have stipulated to the event organiser that this is a specil rate for them, and them alone and thus should be kept between themselves and me. I have done and do perform at charity events at my cost, this generates publicity and it also puts somethign back. Just my thoughts, Kennedy
MR GOLDEN BALLS 2.0: https://mentalunderground.com/product/mr-golden-balls-2-0/" target="_blank"> https://mentalunderground.com/product/passed-out-deck/
BAIRN: Named 'Best Mentalism Product Of 2014 by Marketplace of the Mind is my collection of more than 40 mentalism routines in a beautiful paperback book: http://www.mentalunderground.com/product/bairn |
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D.Paul Loyal user 228 Posts |
Hello, thank you all for the advise. Im a real sucker for doing relatives a faver when they have done so much for me, but ill make sure the next time this happens I think more carefully. Plus I don't think doing charity is such a bad thing, if you are apart of that charity and providing a service to generate more money that's always heplfull. Like Kennedy said give something back.
Cheers Darren |
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Lord Of The Horses Inner circle 5406 Posts |
Darren, I think that no one here intended that doing charity gigs or a favour to your family (or to a friend) is BAD (or if they did, I missed that point).
However, if you complain, ask questions, look for suggestions from other performers but then you always go back to your old song & rhyme and justification "it was a family member" - "I don't think doing charity is a bad thing" then it is possible that you are not listening to the answers you have asked for... Once again, neither doing a favour to a family member and nor performing at charity gigs are implicitly bad things, quite the opposite... they are GOOD things! But, if you find that your performing conditions are impossible, it's also human to stop. I see family (and friendship for that matter) as something more than a person continuosly asking favours to another one. I see this as a two-ways process. So, if you gladly do the favour to them but, on location, you see you honestly can't perform, you should tell them so and they should understand.
Then you'll rise right before my eyes, on wings that fill the sky, like a phoenix rising!
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Beauregard New user Katrinaville 66 Posts |
I pride myself on being a very generous person when it comes to charity but I simply will not work for nothing.
My dear daddy taught me that “Charity begins at home” and I live by his words. I will share my solution with you fine gentleman of The Magic Café in hopes that you could make it work for you, as it has served me well all these many years. When asked to do a charity event I gladly perform albeit at my non- discounted fee. However, I agree to donate a healthy percentage of every single performance, which is booked at the charity event. At the event I do bring a special abbreviated performance agreement and accept deposits . The event promoters and volunteers do overtime trying to get bookings for the act before and during the event and it works like a charm. Think about this type of arrangement where they have a vested interest in pro-actively getting bookings for the act, as opposed to donating your time and nobody gives a muskrats tooth if you get a booking or not. Bless you all who have posted for being so charitable, and I do mean this from the bottom of my heart but please kind sirs respect yourself and your art and make them work for you. With Deep Regard, Beauregard |
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Gianni Special user WILMINGTON, DE 993 Posts |
I think Beauregard is 100% correct, but only from one side of the aisle. The spectators in all probability viewed the performance as worthless. But the other side of the aisle is the performer's point of view. From there, much of value was gained. Look at all D. Paul learned from this experience. And that is how we grow: by getting beat up.
The tricky part is to balance getting beat up for the sake of growth, with developing a reputation for being bad, and boring. Gianni |
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Harley Newman Inner circle 5117 Posts |
I always ask the ones who want freebies, whether they are doing their job, and if they do it for free. It's a way of making a point, and then doing all of the above, if I like the charity is one to which I'd donate anyway..
“You can’t depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus” -Mark Twain
www.bladewalker.com |
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bobser Inner circle 4178 Posts |
All good advice (well most of it anyway). However I do feel for you. We all fall into these every so often. It's always good to have something else, just in case.
For example I now also do male escort work (mainly for women who just don't care anymore). Bobser (£550 per night which of course is constantly negotiable)
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
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handa Inner circle Pittsburgh, PA 1357 Posts |
The biggest "red flag" I saw for Mr. Paul is actually the amount of notice he had. I try to avoid "short notice" gigs unless I know the situation will not make me look like less of a professional. Face it, as entertainers, we are often hired as atmosphere or a side diversion and not the main focus of the event. If we are too much of an afterthought, then we may become the victims of poor planning.
I even turned down one gig that I was offered via a phone call as I was returning from a morning engagement. They wanted me there in less than two hours. I was still in my performance garb and my close up case was right next to me. Even though I have a "ready to go" show, the amount of thought and preparation by the client was not within my level of comfort. I prefer to have time to have a conversation with the client, determine the nature of the event, the makeup of the audience, and any special needs or concerns the client has. This is almost impossible in the "can I book you the same day?" scenario. We all "live and learn" from our mistakes. I did a "too dark/too loud" party in a venue that I had tested the week prior. The client had hired a DJ and altered the lighting in the week between my scouting/conversation and the gig. I made the best of things and seriously scaled back anything that required me to squint or any type of effect that required upon sound to carry the effect. It was a tough night. As for charity work, everybody has their own rules. I book about a half-dozen "favors" each year either fully donated or at a fee to merely cover my expenses with the understanding that it is a private contract and neither party should discuss the terms of the booking with a third party. I have a set of criteria in my head for each situation, and do not donate my work if the organization has a budget unless it is a pet cause or the pet cause of a close friend that I would consider supporting. These are just the guidelines I have set for myself that work within my own comfort zone. I know excellent performers who have not taken money for shows in any of their performance bookings in the past two years. I also know lousy performers who charge more money than they should for what they give the client in return. It is the performer and the performer's attitude toward the performance, audience, and client that determines the level of professionalism and not the amount printed on the check. Chris |
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