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Beauregard New user Katrinaville 66 Posts |
Another post strayed in this direction, therefore I thought that I would begin a separate post on it as I thought it worthy of debate.
So if you will Gentlemen, I pride myself on being a very generous person when it comes to charity but I simply will not work for nothing. My dear daddy taught me that “Charity begins at home” and I live by his words. I will share my solution with you fine gentleman of The Magic Café in hopes that you could make it work for you, as it has served me well all these many years. When asked to do a charity event, I will gladly perform albeit at my non- discounted fee. However, I agree to donate a healthy percentage of every single performance, which is booked at the charity event. At the event I do bring a special abbreviated performance agreement and accept deposits. The event promoters and volunteers do overtime trying to get bookings for the act before and during the event and it works like a charm. Think about this type of arrangement where they have a vested interest in pro-actively getting bookings for the act, as opposed to your donating your time and nobody gives a muskrats tooth if you get a booking or not. Bless you, all who will post that you work for free for being so charitable, and I do mean this from the bottom of my heart but please kind sirs respect yourself and your art and make it work for you. With Deep Regard, Beauregard |
J ack Galloway Inner circle 1309 Posts |
Great post!
I may do a charity event this year (I Do not as a rule) If they will go along with your deal. Best Wishes Jack |
jimtron Inner circle 2039 Posts |
Yes. And you can check out the charity at a place like http://www.charitynavigator.org/
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Osiris Special user 610 Posts |
I had a long discussion with Marvin Roy (Mr. Electric) years ago about this issue. He said that he always got paid no matter what. It may only be dinner and gas money, but they always paid him something, that was the rule!
I have done a great deal of charity work... then again, when we were all young and dumb we all got sucked into that wonderful game of "it's for exposure"... right! Exposure never paid the rent or brought food into the house... remember this! Generally I follow the formula many others have used over the years, a 50/50 door split. Of course, there is a minimum sewn into the contract that assures me that the so-called "Producers" of the event get off their duff and actually produce a bit of effort when it comes to ticket sales... in other words, I charge dearly for "Miracles" My situation now days however, has me doing a lot more charitable work than ever before in my life. Though I do pull in some personal gains via my efforts, I'm very careful as to how much I allow to come in. You see, I'm on disability (and I'm legitimately disabled and not able to work even part-time, let alone full-time with any sense of predictability... even for me and I'm a Mentalist...) In simple terms, my bills are met and I can put a little pocket money to the side (more and more of it is going to Mark Stevens and Brian Hades for some reason though... or, more recently, Michelangelo's Magic Works... dang magic dealers!) I regress... the thing is, I believe some of us are in a better position for doing charitable programs because we aren't as dependent on the fees for the sake of personal survival and/or business growth. It could be that such an element serves as a great formula for success when it comes to both, the charity groups and the performers. |
bobser Inner circle 4178 Posts |
I am always delighted and honoured to do charity work, and always for free.
However, this is the deal. I ask if everyone else is working for free that night and if so, so will I.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
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cupsandballsmagic Inner circle 2705 Posts |
It is also worth mentioning that if you do give a discount etc that you should make oneof the conditions that you send an invoice for the FULL amount and respectfully request that the booker does not tell anyone you discounted them.
If you do not do this you will quickly get a reputation as the guy (or girl) who works for next to nothing. A reputation like that kinda sticks.... I actually had quite a few charities caling me back in the day's when Iused to do the Aerial strait jacket. They saw me in the papers etc and thought it would be a great attraction for their fete / gala etc. They expected me to work for free. In those day's Ididn't mind and agreed as long as they paid expenses. I told them it was upto them to hire a crane for half a day and arrange it. They dropped out at that point (or after a few phone cals). Point being that they couldn't be bothered or they were not getting the crane for free (was I going to stump up a few hundred quid AND perform for free while risking my ife?) Watch out also for charities pleading poverty, let me start by saying that there are some wonderful charities (which I do give to on a monthly basis) which do great work but many are NOT short of money. I happen to know that many people at the top of sme of the large charities are in a particular financial bracket (which means that they are paid in excess of £90k a year). I digress, watch out for charities pleading poverty and saying they cannot afford to pay you, you turn up and they have paid for everything else at he silver service event. Some chariy events are more lavishly produced than many corporate events I have attendedand it is all paid for. I prefer to do special events for charity and give during my everyday life (on a monthly basis) but as a performer I do not wish to be percieved as a guy who works for nothing. |
Ken Dyne Inner circle UK 2268 Posts |
Bobster, this is the approach I take also. I don't want to be seen as the free entertainment if everythign else is being paid for.
I have been, and do get paid for charity work, I also do some for free. A fair balance. Of course they are at my discretion, such as on a low night of the week during low season. I would have to be stupid (says he with white hair, purple glasses and wearing cowboy boots) to take a free charity booking on a saturday night on the 17 December. Best, Kennedy
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BAIRN: Named 'Best Mentalism Product Of 2014 by Marketplace of the Mind is my collection of more than 40 mentalism routines in a beautiful paperback book: http://www.mentalunderground.com/product/bairn |
Jim Reynolds Elite user Special Guest 431 Posts |
I am of the belief that discounted fees 'cheapen' your act more than donating your act for charity. Like any other great art work, you either pay full price or it is given as a gift.
So pick your charity work carefully. Otherwise, have the charity find a 3rd party willing to donate your fee. just my opinion... |
Sergeant Regular user 129 Posts |
Charity work is a slippery slope. I have been in many discussions regarding charity work and have heard many good points. I do not believe there is an absolute right answer on this but this is my take.
First let me say, I am a professional performer. I make my living doing magic. That being the case, I must always be sure to choose carefully. I always make sure that it is a bona-fide charity event. The money must be going to a good cause and most, if not all, the people involved are donating their time. There is a huge difference between a charity event and someone who just wants you to do something for free to promote some event. Next, I must evaluate what I am going to accomplish or damage by doing this event. Here are some thoughts: 1. Will people now believe that what I am doing is free and therefore worthless: I have heard this argument many times. I have never had a problem with this, but as I have said I am careful as to what events I donate my time to. If you are standing shoulder to shoulder with other high caliber entertainers and event planners, then you will be associated with them. If you are doing an event where everything seems half baked and unprofessional then you will be associated with that level. I have never had anyone that has seen me in a charity event assume that I was free. It is a matter of professional presentation in the business sense. 2. It will get you great exposure: Not usually, but it can. I will insist that I am included in the promotional material, that I am listed on the program, and that I am treated with due respect. That is that I get the proper stage, time, lighting, introduction, etc. This is very important. I have networked at these events and increased my booking circle by doing some of these charity shows. It is not a matter of exposure as many times it is a matter of doing business and finding out what connections the people at the event have. I have never done or even heard of a charity event that gets bookings for a performer based on the event as Beauregard as suggested. Usually their money is coming in based on the event itself using a Q3 format or Charitable Resolution Charting. They are not a showcase to get bookings. I have made connections that have gotten me a trade show booking and a theater gig based on charity work, and yes the very occasional corporate booking. But more importantly it is a great place to network. 3. It is an event that I believe in and want to help: Perhaps I want to support the charity for personal reasons, then I might not care about the money at all. However, I will still insist on (2) above. 4. What does the event see as your worth: I have seen fellow performers jump at the chance to donate time and shows because a “Big Charity” asks them. They begin to think, wow, these guys know who I am so they must think I am good. This is where the advice is “2” above will come in handy. I make some pretty straight forward demands. If they cannot accommodate them, then they do not think I am worth much. Therefore, I will not do the event. I have had nothing but great experience in doing Charity work, except for one. The Event promised much but delivered zero. It was a fairly large charity group. They assured me that they would adhere to my “rider”. However, when I got there, I found that they had not done a single thing to honor their word. There was no stage, there was inadequate sound. They have not set up the room for a proper show. I was not in the list of events. They decided at the last minute to have me come on while food was being served. I told them this was unacceptable. They told me that they were giving me the chance of a lifetime. Hmmmm. Really?! I tried my best to explain that I would simply not do the show under those circumstances. They were flabbergasted and could not understand why I would turn down the chance of a life time. I walked. Better to not perform than to perform badly. Sergeant |
Reuben Dunn Inner circle Has a purple ribbon wraped around my 1592 Posts |
You might want to consider something else.
Working a charity gig is a great way to work on your technique/ability as well as provide a way to network. Last year I did a gig for a national charity "Hearing Dogs for Deaf People". I did a single show and got paid gas milage for the experience. It was a 20 minute spot and went well. I got a rather good written reference from the organizer, and, after getting back a questionaire that I pass out for comments; got some quotes, some of which I've placed on my web page. I got an e-mail four months after the event asking if I was available for a gig for a Breast Cancer Awareness charity this year. What I've done is quote my full performance price, then offer to donate a percentage to the chairity. I'm booked. I've also got a booking at a Lions' club breakfast using the same fee base If I had charged my full rate, or even a percentage to the Hearing Dogs chairity, I would not have been booked, their budget was tight. However I'm booked for this year with two other groups, and will do another show for the dog charity in June 2006, at normal fee. I think we ignore this market, the charity market at our peril. I'd refer you all to Chuck Hickocks' book "Mentalism Incorporated" to get his slant on working with charities, notabily, the United Way. |
Ian Broadmore Special user 555 Posts |
Charity=Karma=what you give out you get back ten fold.
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Doc Dixon Special user Pennsylvania, USA 655 Posts |
My 2 cents:
Regardless of the amount, we all have a finite amount of money we can donate to giving. If a charity appeals to us, we will give from that finite amount. If not, we won't. Likewise, we all have a finite amount of time. If the charity appeals to you and you think it's a good cause, do the show. If not, don't. Forget about the "exposure" and business aspect of it. Just do it because you care. Nobody puts a buck in the Salvation Army kettle for exposure. They do it because they want to help. If you're doing the show because you care about the cause, you won't have to worry about exposure and all the other business concerns. Just saves a lot of headaches. But if those things do result, then they're gravy. As it was posted earlier: Charity=Karma=what you give out you get back ten fold. Now if you don't think it's a good cause or, more likely, you've done your giving elsewhere and for whatever reason this group didn't make the cut(there's that "finite" thing again), then and only then treat it like business and consider all the things one would normally consider without the veneer of false charity. I'm certain the times I've done charity gigs have been made much more enjoyable because I just didn't worry about the business side of it. And when you go into with that outlook, it is virtually impossible to be taken advantage of -- which is kind of a nice situation to be in of and by itself. Respectfully, DD |
ninjaduffy Veteran user UK 332 Posts |
How depressing, So you wouldn't spend 90 mins of your time occasionly to help others who share the society you live in!!!!!!!
I can imagine that although you are magicians, you see little magic in the world you live in. I do, I Share it and so should you. Shame on you that don't and well done to those that do. Kev. |
happymagic New user Overland Park, KS 18 Posts |
Quote:
Charity=Karma=what you give out you get back ten fold. I'll second that. Here's an idea: Actually SEEK OUT some charities that you're interested in helping, instead of waiting for people to call you. Also, another tip: What I do when someone asks me if I'm available to do a free show, I let them know that due to time concerns and a busy schedule I only do 1 or 2 charity shows a month max. So if it's a last minute thing, I'm off the hook, and if they are legit, they'll have other events in the future that I can help them out with. |
Father Photius Grammar Host El Paso, TX (Formerly Amarillo) 17161 Posts |
I've always followed the rule of doing charity events of only charities that I felt I could support and didn't mind being identified with. If no other performer, mc, dj, band, or what ever is being paid, and it is local, then I would consider doing it for nothing. But even a dime to another performer, and I charge my full fee. If it is not a local event, then generally I charge full fee and expenses. I do not offer to contribute any of my fee to the charity. If it is a charity I normally support, then I contribute what I normally give, at the times I normally give it.
I have found so many charities request an entertainer for "free" to find out that one or more other entertainers on the venue is getting paid. This , of course is all based on booking not being through an agent. The agent gets his full due if he books, and as such I get full compensation. I'm all for supporting charities, but I have worked for some and know how the money is often spent and how its "administrative fees" are distributed. It would be different if there was some guarantee that all proceeds were going directly to some at the grass roots cause. While many charities claim they stay at a 6% or less administrative cost, many do some very unique accounting to arrive at that. So I don't feel I am asking anything out of the ordinary to get my full fee. If they are making money off of my performance, then there is no reason why I shouldn't. I do limit the number of charity engagements I will accept. Do too many and they will be all on ur neck to do theirs. And make sure the charity is indeed a charity and does charitable work. I once nearly agreed to do a show for a police benevolence fund, which turned out to be a way of funding a local private police club (bar). Not exactly caring for widows, orphans, ill and injured.
"Now here's the man with the 25 cent hands, that two bit magician..."
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Osiris Special user 610 Posts |
Quote:
On 2005-04-07 17:16, Ian Broadmore wrote: I'm still waiting... No, truthfully I have experienced just what you're saying Ian. The catch is, the "good" that comes back to us don't typically return in the same "form" as it was given out. This is what confuses and often "frustrates" people (I know it got my hackles up more than a few times). As to some of the other things that's been said in this thread... Yes, chairty work can help you brush up on style, technique, etc. If you have the comfort of a day-job and "need" a venue in which to bruch up on your chops, this is a great opportunity. The reality is however, you get better the more you work and work it. Get yourself slated for a season in a theme park if you want to be underpaid, under appreciated, get tons of exposure, and refine your skills... or work a carnival sideshow... either way we're talking no less than 5 to as many as 20 performances as day doing the same shtick... you'll either learn or you'll burn! If you go into a chairity show and you're not practiced, it can destroy all hope of going any further. Most charities play host to some of your communities key players. Not the kind of crowd you want to come off looking like a buffoon in front of. You want to shine, get their attention as well as their future patronage for home parties, mixers, etc. More than any other group the guests at most charity programs are the kind of people you want to network with. Like all your promotional print, you need to shine and stand out in order to demand that call to action... just a little something that tend to get ignored when we discuss this particular issue. "Doing Discounted Work for Charities "Cheapn's" Your Public Value..." Yes and no! When we do too many charity dates vs. finding one or two primary issues to stand up for and work with and gain an identity with those one or two groups vs. a plethora of groups... this is the trick to making it work as well as keeping the others off your back. If word gets out that you did a FREE or even a $50.00 show for group A then brace yourself for calls from XYZ and all their friends for the same kind of treatment. Years ago I did a lot of AIDS related charities because of the number of people I knew dead or dying from the disease. I've always done programs for the Humane Society/SPCA as well as FREE Consumer Protection shows in High Schools, Colleges and Senior Citizen Centers (pertaining to charlatan practices & dangerous cult awareness). Recently, due to my own set of circumstances, I've started doing shows and promotional dates for the National Multiple Sclerosis Society. My point is, give yourself permission to work charities that have a genuine personal connection. This allows you both, excuse and the ability to focus and become recognized as an entity allied with said group(s). To coin an NLP point of view... you create a memory anchor for folks... when they see an ad or hear the name of a given charity, they will, in time, think of you at the same time... THAT'S MARKETING and positive Public Relations in action. Well, enough for now... |
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