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Gordon Pail New user Chicago 54 Posts |
Well guys can I ask something about the carton illusion....
IS this illusion can be performed surrounded? Thanks |
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David Todd Inner circle 2328 Posts |
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On 2005-04-30 12:33, Gordon Pail wrote: No, it can not be performed surrounded . |
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Gordon Pail New user Chicago 54 Posts |
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On 2005-04-30 18:50, David Todd wrote: Just wonder can we build we this carton illusion....? |
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eb02 Special user 680 Posts |
Dear Gordon
As far as I understand they do not have the rights for this illusion, since Paul Daniels had done it on TV at lest 10-15 years ago. I beleive you can find it in some old illusion books as Tarabel or others. Someone wrote that you can find it also on Andrew Mayne book Eran
Eran Blizovsky
www.magic4business.net |
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mysticalmike Special user Saratoga Springs, NY 509 Posts |
I would like to let everyone know that I just got a letter from the person that produce this illusion. His name is Günter Puchinger. he wrote to me "You must know I am the producer and developer of the "Carton Illusion" and other illusions." so I just let you know this.
mike |
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eb02 Special user 680 Posts |
Mike
There is no doubt that he manufacture this illusion but Paul Daniels preformed it over 10 years ago on TV...
Eran Blizovsky
www.magic4business.net |
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David Todd Inner circle 2328 Posts |
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His name is Günter Puchinger. he wrote to me "You must know I am the producer and developer of the "Carton Illusion" Quote:
On 2005-05-02 08:59, eb02 wrote: What does that have to do with who owns the rights to the illusion ? If it is the property of Günter Puchinger then I'm sure that Paul Daniels paid Mr. Puchinger for the television performance rights those 10 years ago. Just because Paul Daniels performed it on television doesn't mean that Mr. Puchinger gave up his rights to the illusion and now the illusion is public domain . On the other hand if Paul Daniels or someone on his staff invented the illusion then the rights are probably with Paul Daniels , unless PD sold it to Puchinger to manufacture. Best to email or send a letter to Paul Daniels to ask him about it . (I think he's on tour at the moment with his tribute to Malini show , but I expect he checks his email) |
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plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
Hi David Todd > In response to your post. I think it would be wise to say the same which you said. Just because he said "i am the manufacturer and producer of the carton illusions" (actually that sounds like even UF Grant stole these ideas from him) he didn't say "I have exclusive rights to manufacture this illusion". PLease refer to Andrew Maynes - Illusion Book. This effect is very well described there. Secondly its a Super X which is public domain disguised with a cardboard box. Now I don't think I can take WINDSHEAR, put a cardboard box over it and say its my idea. LOL. Just my view. Lets try to be fair and square. Why don't we start at the root rather than asking Paul Daniels. Ask Punchinger if he has LEGAL COPYRIGHTS to this illusion or if he has PATENTED his method and justified its uniqueness in design and concept. Id think at this rate I wouldnt be surprised if some guy turned up saying he was the orginator of the finger palm, or the double lift. Then Copperfield will have to drop his grandpas aces.
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mysticalmike Special user Saratoga Springs, NY 509 Posts |
This is the letter I got from him
Hello Mike, I developed this effect many years ago. It is a practical illusion to let appear a girl. You can lift and move the carton again and again. First you can produce two other cartons. Then you can produce other items (important for trade shows). After this comes one hand and then the second hand and then the head. You can lift the carton while the head and hands are alredy out on top. At last cames the complete girl. Audience can sit very close and around. You can wheel the carton on stage and turn it around. There is nothing behind the carton and the magican must not hide something. He can move away during performance and turn the wheeled base. I do not know the Grand Victory Carton Illusion and Mark Wilson´s book so I can not say if my prop is similar. To produce one carton illusion I need 25 hours. In Germany we must calculate 60.-€ (78.-$) hourly wage. The rest is for material. So that is all what I can tell you in the moment about my "Carton Illusion". Can you mail me copies from the Mark Wilson book or from the Grand Victory Carton Illusion? Best wishes Guenter Puchinger |
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plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
He still doesn't say with confidence that it is his illusion exclusively. Let him patent it or do such remedy if he requires it to be exclusive.
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mysticalmike Special user Saratoga Springs, NY 509 Posts |
I am sorry I was just let you know.
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Gordon Pail New user Chicago 54 Posts |
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On 2005-05-02 14:56, mysticalmike wrote: Well there is something that I want to highlight is that ...in His Statement of the letter...he stated that the illusion can be performed surrounded...when in my previous post I did ask David Todd whether does the illusion able to be performed surround. And David Todd answered no. So I believe there is some problem with his mail and statement that he stated that the illusion is his or able to performed surround...Do you guys agree with what I note. Pls guide me if I m wrong...Thanks Regards Gordon |
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eb02 Special user 680 Posts |
This illusion can not done surround.
eran
Eran Blizovsky
www.magic4business.net |
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Gordon Pail New user Chicago 54 Posts |
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On 2005-05-04 04:04, eb02 wrote: I know ! Eran. I know that the illusion cannot be done surrounded. But the letter from the orginator (Guenter Puchinger) states that the illusion can be done where audience can sit very close and around. You can wheel the carton on stage and turn it around. Since it cannot be done surrounded why does he states that sudience can sit very close and around. You can wheel the carton on stage and turn it around. So I believe that that somewhere there is a loophole with what the orginator that he claims 'carton illusion' is his creation.. If I m wrong, pls correct me again...and verify this doubt. Thanks Gordon |
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plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
He states it can be wheeled around. Yes. Did he say it can be surrounded when performed ? NO. lol. Yes you can wheel any super x around. Given the right design. But when you perform ?
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David Todd Inner circle 2328 Posts |
It certainly does not seem as if it could be possible to do this surrounded , unless we're all off on the method ( "super-x in a box")
Overall ,the angles look pretty good from what one can see in the Paul Daniels presentation. (see the entire video on Paul Daniel's site . At one point the camera cuts to a view from the side.) http://www.pauldaniels.co.uk/html/video.htm The first time I saw this illusion on Paul Daniel's web site I skipped right over the possibility of "super-x in a box" and thought it was actually using a different form of levitation technology . (think : Flying by Foy) After having looked at it again several times I think it probably is the super-x in a box method . I think this illusion is cute. It has potential , if handled by a good performer , as seen in the Paul Daniels presentation. For most magicians it's probably not the most devastating mystery ever staged , but I think it looks pretty good . |
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Gordon Pail New user Chicago 54 Posts |
Well guys it is interesting thay you guys are talking of the ( "super-x in a box") .
Can anyone tell me more about ( "super-x in a box") ? Thanks again |
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eb02 Special user 680 Posts |
As I mention erlier on this issue, this illusion has potential if you preform it nice. I belive Paul Daniels has great presentaion.
Eran
Eran Blizovsky
www.magic4business.net |
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David Todd Inner circle 2328 Posts |
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On 2005-05-05 01:58, Gordon Pail wrote: Magician's shorthand. Everyone here who automatically knows what "super-x" refers to doesn't need any more explanation than that . It's a method of magically suspending a person in mid-air manufactured by Abbott's Magic Co. and in many variations by other companies. Unfortunately to explain any more about exactly what it is would mean to violate the Café's non-exposure rules . Once you hit a certain number of posts there is a hidden part of the Café that you will be given access to where secrets can be more openly discussed. In the meantime , if you were to use the search engine on the Café to look for "super-x" or "super-x suspension/levitation" , or "Abbott's Super X " you would probably find something of interest. Here's a link to a photo of Mark and Nani Wilson peforming it in front of the Magic Castle. You'll often see the Super X principle utilized in this way for publicity photos. http://www.markwilsonmagic.com/images/splash/splash_03.jpg |
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Gordon Pail New user Chicago 54 Posts |
Thanks David Todd,
Ok Ok ! I know what you meant for Super-X. I didn't know that method is called super-x. Ok ! I got the idea now. Thanks David Todd. Ok, so how was the progress of the result of who is the orginator of the Carton Illusion. If no one is able to verify this, I intending to build one for myself this weekend. Hope that someone and verify it before I do something foolish. Regards Gordon |
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