It is a good thing to learn from some of the Masters like Gazzo or Celini.
I first started with C&B and general magic about 15 years ago before I went pro but I learnt the hard way, on my own. Then I got better by studying Celini his books and videos. Then Gazzo came on tour to the UK providing a master class so I jumped at that, and my C&B have never been the same.

How do we make our self’s stand out?

When I look at these masters we can include others like Michael Armmar. The one key to there success is each have there own identity. They are not carbon copies of each other.

My routen is heavily influenced by these masters and I would give 75% credit to Gazzo but I am also striving to set my self apart. I don’t want to be as good as someone else’s routen; I want the best entertainer I can be in magic. So right from the start I am looking to see how I can achieve that.

Take for example look-alikes; no Mel Gibson look-alike is going to be more famous than Mel Gibson. They will make Mel Gibson more famous even if they both entertain. A magical example is David Blaine; there is a lot of waner-bes that walk about doing David Blaine, kind of stile walk about magic. But the public see the stile and think David Blaine.

It is important that we learn from successes in show business.

1 What can you do to set your self apart?
2 What are you doing to set our self apart?

Mario

I want to be like Mario Morris..
Is that enough of setting myself apart ?

Kidding aside, what MM mentioned is *the way*, but it really IS hard to forget *the best* one has seen..
Here I don't necessarily mean the best performer, but the best way to handle and present a certain effect seen done by a real master..
It is hard to imagine, it could be done better and so one is 'almost' forced to copy and imitate his handling and presentation exactly..and this way, one has to copy probably a lot of different performers way of handling and presenting different effects.

It's the wrong way to go of course, but it takes REAL work to leave that route...

Here is my maybe simple minded advice: Once you have a decent act, stay away from all other magicians, books and DVD's for about three to four years. Perform a lot during the time and you will see that you are naturally different and unique from all others.

mmG Roland

That's a very interesting remark, because I've heared it before, many, many years back.
The one mentioning it was Ken Brooke, also he put it in another way.

He said, he NEVER watched other magicians act, because that might influence his own way of working..

This actually is an interesting theme, because John Ramsay said exactly the opposite..
He said, *watch each and every magician you have a chance to watch..if he's good, you can learn something, if he's bad, you can be more pleased with yourself*..

Maybe not excatly the words he used, or KB did use, but out of memory as close as it can get.
I realize though, KB did mingle with magicians -still he might have avoided to se their act-, he had to, as he did sell GREAT magic and ideas to fellow magicians.

I suppose the truth lies between what both these great performers said and what Roland tells here, actually HIS tip is more clear and a better one, IMHO, but mind you, it is mainly aimed at pro performers, amateurs love to mingle with fellow magicians ..

Which of those two routes you go, largely depends on the individual and how much they value their own uniqueness. Some people will never copy, regardless of how many magicians they see, while others will never learn to think independantly.

To add a slight variation to the statement credited to Mr. Ramsay: ...if he is good, you can learn something; if he is bad, you can learn more.

Had the opportunity to work at the Paris Air Show several years ago, and during my off time in the city, took some time to go to the magic show at Le Double Fond. The absolutely most impressive fact was that the three magicians on the show were radically different from one another, and more importantly, radically different from any acts I had ever seen anywhere. They performed a round robin show format, each making a couple of appearances throughout. One guy in particular presented completely different characters and styles everytime he came onstage. To me, that's going the extra mile to stand apart.

It changed my own perspective of magic and really cemented the idea that beingdifferent, although often harder, is the best way.

It has also changed the way I am able to market myself. Now, when I am approached by a prospective client, it is generally because they want ME, and not just a magician, one of many similar that can be "rented" off the rack.

~michael

I have seen many magic acts and performances. I am sure I am not unique that each of these presented something I liked, and something I didn't like. Whether it was the personality, the effect, the patter, I think we all have opinions. We also all have our own ideas that we can vary to suit our own needs. I like what Michael said above..



That pretty well sums it up for me as well. I will always watch others perform, and not just magic. A great performance is a lifelong journey for me, not just a destination.

I think that for real performers, the issue of being different is the result of the quest to stand out from the crowd, and create and develop their own identity.

As a result, unless a performers goal is to be a clone of someone else, (Elvis impersonators as an example) or is some kid tring to be Blaniac, the end result of doing things your way, is that it is your way, and no one else's way.

Nobody does what I do, the way I do it. Why not? Because they are not me. They could dress like me, although I don't anyone ele with poor enoguht taste to do that, and even if they end up looking like me, or sounding like me. They wont do my act my way beacuse they cant think like me, respond s I do to circumstances,e tc. Not that I do everything as well as it could be done... far from it. But it is all done my way

So I guess, I don' think is much worry about unique identities for real performers. Pros, do what tehy need to do, and that is be themselves. While amatuers are content with being clones or imperesonators.

That's my story, and I am sticking it to you.

BroDavid

Would someone please tell me what C&B is, because if Mario wants a good C&B so do I. I like nice T&A, but I don't think he meant that.
Tanks
Al Angello

Cups and Balls

Well, C&B is an age old thingy most think they do well, but they don't..

Thanks BroDavid,

I have a different thought on that, you can and there are many impersonators that make more money than you or me, because they are pros.

I don’t think this thread is about worry but rather how do you make your mark beyond what you have already achieved. This is about bettering your self setting goals in the world of entertainment.
If one is happy with where they are at, they will not continue to grow and develop that is great if they are happy.
If you are not happy with where you are at then you are aware you have not reached your full potential but you are happy to try, that me that’s my story.

Do you have any thoughts on my 2 original questions?
Mario
PS
C&B = Cups and Balls

1 What can you do to set your self apart?
2 What are you doing to set our self apart?

Re 1.
We all need some inspiration to delevop 'ourselfes' to be different, so here is a thought.

When NOT out working, but out at a party, at public places,whereever, have a look for some person that somehow 'stands-out' in one way or another, maybe you overhear him telling a story, maybe it is 'just' a 'clerk' selling stuff/cloth, in a fascinating/certain way, whatever in a store.

IF you find that guy somehow 'interesting' and you also have the feeling you're not alone, but others do to, try to analyze the *why* he's fascinating.

Don't choose another entertainer for this to look out for, just any normal person that soemhow stands out..

After analyzing *why* he stands-out try to incorporate some of that guy into youself to form a similar character.

As you just watched 'life' and normal ppl, this is not exactly 'stealing' material from a fellow entertainer, but adapting 'life' and learning from 'others'..as mentoned, we all need some inspiration.

As magicians also should be actors, what I mentioned makes sense..

Take Daryl, he's not the same person off stage when not performing, neither are many other 'characters'..

Re 2.
As I'm not making my living from performning, I don't 'need' to follow my own advice, but I most certainly would use that approach IF I was in the bizz. Still Im try to watch and study human behaviour and try to find out why some ppl are more interesting to socialize with then others..

I'm playing for the fun, nevertheless I act a bit, one has too, otherwise the normal 'guy' would probably be too boring..

There are very few not needing this 'acting', ppl like Dai Vernon..there was no difference weather he performed or not, it was the same guy, but a pro performer-I think- has to transform himself into a magician, when he is *on*..

Just my humble thoughts re your questions..
My above thoughts covers everything, meaning it includes the way ppl dress, move, talk aso..

TT, C&B, CMH is there a reference guide for those of us who only speak English. If anyone wants to know what T's & A's are you will have to PM me. (LOL)
Confused
Al

I'm off for a large G&T to think.

1 What can you do to set your self apart?
2 What are you doing to set your self apart?

Mario

Its inside you, I enjoy being entertained by other magicians and like many others
appreciate the work, do I want to be them? mmmmm NO. maybe a little - only the ones like me.

Do I want to float that note? mmmmm NO it's not me.

What about that great zig-zag illusion? mmmmmm NO it's not me.

What about those three shells and that lovely pea? NOW YOUR TALKING and those lovely cups, don't forget the dice, that's me.
I'v already started to set me self apart by knowing who I am.

I think so many "magicians" see a great effect preformed and think I'll do that and that one oh and that one, They end up doing nothing there not going to set them selfs apart because they don't know who they are, To be successfull I have to be like him no him no it must be him.

How have I set my self apart from other magicians I know? I tell my audience that I cheat because that's my character. NO BECAUSE THAT'S ME.

Just get out there and mess with them and be your self.


Good luck

Royston
HEADS I WIN, TAILS YOU LOSE

Roland

Thanks for your thoughts; I went down that route you suggested when I first started. The truth is I thought I was good until I sore others perform and that just made me want to get better ten years latter I still want to better my self.

I think today we are spoiled with advice, books, DVD and lessons and we should take full advantage of this.

This does not stop us looking to develop an angle in our character that makes us stand out. You know, the hard man of Magic, The gentle man of magic, the clown of magic, all the sick nutter of magic. I think every angle is covered; nothing is new under the sun other than your self. So the question I ask my self is what can I bring to that angle? How can I develop my character and most impotently will people want to watch the end product?

Mario

Thanks, Royston
For the record my questions are directed at you rather than how I should go about it.

I have already said how I am going about to develop my self. I am interested in how other performers are going about answering those questions for them self’s if they have asked them self them.

Personally I think it is a mistake to develop a character based upon a prop, a mistake I have made often. I think we should develop our prop around our character only then can we see the true potential of props. If we don’t then we will not take so many risks our character will not develop and will still be in the shallow end of performance.

Take for example the Milk erne escape, I have never liked this prop until the other day I sore it performed by a performer hows character I liked. Suddenly this prop holds new potential. What does that say about me, well my character is limited. That is not setting my self apart.

I suggest before we through the baby out with the bath water look at again and ask your self this.
How can I make my character fit this prop?
Not how can I fit this prop to my character? You may never use the prop, I mean I can’t fit an erne in my shoulder bag but by asking this question I am developing my character. I will come up with a different presentation. Your character will be stretched challenged and uncomfortable I think that is a good place for performers to be.

The truth of the matter is not many magicians that reach the height of what we are talk about. If they did then thy will be world famous or at least famous in the magic world. We should keep this in mind I am sure they will give a peneys worht sooner all later.

Do let me know how you anwer the qwestions for your self.

Mario
PS HEADS I WIN, TAILS YOU LOSE is my mates moto as well

Mario
I was talking about myself and how I'm developing my character.
But It's definitely an on going quest.

All the Best

Royston

Oh I got you, great stuff thanks
Mario

The one thing we often fail to recognize is that every single person IS unique.
You are unprecedented. There has never been and there will never be anyone like you.
In order to 'be different' all you have to do is be yourself.
Do whatever comes naturally and you will automatically be original.


Now, if this post has enlightened you, please put money in my hat!

RiffRaff you got it, have a large J.D.

Royston

Well, also what you say is entierly correct, that persona, in this example *you*/whoever, isn't necessarily INTERESTING for the specs to watch and spend time on!
I still think it takes a little more then just *being oneselfes*!
You have to be an 'interesting' character too..

And watch out for Mario re coming close and putting money in your hat...when you count the money before and afterwards, the final result might be less
(Sorry Mario, I couldn't resist )