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chrisrkline Special user Little Rock 965 Posts 
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Rules give comfort to many people. It gives comfort to the anal retentives who need structure and control in their lives. It gives comfort to people like me who want to have something to fall back on when something doesn't seem to be working. A rule can become a guideline to help focus my routines and effects.
It is also important for those who do not like rules. After all, what would some people do without rules to worry about? How could they brag about never following them if there were no rules? 
Chris
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Kozmo V.I.P. 5473 Posts
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There are some basic rules in street performing that just make things work better, controlling audinces, pitching your hat....rules that you can break if that works better for you...rules.....i hate rules but live by a few
a |
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EVILDAN Inner circle 1279 Posts
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Okay, so what happens if we take rule #1 and #2 which are:
A STREET SHOW SHOULD CONTAIN JUST ENOUGH MATERIAL TO GET THE MONEY. NO MORE. NO LESS. A SHOW SHOULD NEVER EXCEED AN AUDIENCES ATTENTION SPAN. Now as time moves forward and the current MTV Generation start having families these two rules could cancel each other out. Attention span is now 5 minutes or less. So you modify your show to 5 minutes or less. You put out your hat only to find that audiences didn't find 5 minutes or less of "entertainment" worth putting a dollar in the hat for. Why? Answer: It was too short. Such a quandry with so many rules.
by EVILDAN....
"The Coin Board Book" - moves and routines with the coin panel board. - http://www.lybrary.com/the-coin-board-book-p-827955.html "SLASHER - A Horror Whodunnit" - a bizarre close-up routine based on Bob Neale's "Sole Survivor." PM me for more info. "Zombie Town" - a packet effect about how a small town turned into zombies. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nzJhcoJtyOM |
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chrisrkline Special user Little Rock 965 Posts
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But whether we have rules or not has no bearing on the truth of what you say. If your crowd does not want more than a five minute show, and won't tip on that long of a routine, then you either give it up, or you figure out how to lengthen their attention spans or you figure out how to get that dollar tip from a five minute show.
Chris
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JoeJoe Inner circle Myrtle Beach 1915 Posts
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I certainly don't think an audiences attention span in only 5 minutes ... they still sit for two hours watching a movie, nobody has reduced the length of a movie because todays audience has less attention span. TV shows still run 1/2 hour, just like they did in the 50's. A concert show will still last the same length of time as it did in the 30's. It's not attention span that an audience lacks, it is style and flair on part of the performer - todays audiences expect a faster pace with more flash.
My first rule is still the same ... I've posted it here before ... never ever under ANY circumstances do a street performance because you want to make money! If all you want is their money, then get a suit and tie and head to Wall Street where you'll find more than you can grab! There are a lot of easier and faster methods to making money than street performing. In fact, street performing could very well rank up there with one of the worse ways to make money ever! For the amount of work you do, and the amount of money you make ... there are certainly better ways to go about it. You can do one stage show and make well over $1,000 dollars - why are you wasting your time on the street if all you really want is the money?? You could get $150 a night *plus* tips working a resturant, and be in a nice comfy A/C environment with a free meal to boot! The purpose of a street performance is not about making money, the money simply enables you to do the street shows. Your first goals should be make people laugh smile and wonder how you did something ... once you get that down, the money will start flowing in all by itself. Street Performing allows nearly anyone to become an entertainer ... it doesn't matter if you are good or not. What you will get the most out of street performing is experience - in one summer you can do more street performances than David Copperfield does stage shows all year long! You will get good fast on the street, and it can lead to bigger and better things. As for my shows, they run anywhere from 5 minutes to half hour ... during the day when everyone is on the beach and it's slow, I do balloon animals for passing kids. After I do the animal ... I then offer a magic trick. I don't do this trick to get a tip (I already got that) ... I do it because there is no greater reward in life than making a child smile. That is what it takes to be a street performer - your job out there is to make people laugh and smile and have a good time, and it shouldn't matter if they can afford to tip you or not. Just do it! Worry about the money when you get home. JoeJoe
Amazing JoeJoe on YouTube[url=https://www.youtube.com/user/AmazingJoeJoe]
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cstreet_1986 Loyal user 263 Posts
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EvilDan, if such a times comes when attention span drops to 5 minutes (which I personally don't think will ever happen), then people will be happy to give you money... because obviously at that time 5 minutes was just enough - the rule still applies. They will put in money because they hada good time and would have got bored if it lasted any longer.
Also, nice post ChrisRKline and JoeJoe. People like a set of rules to follow and be able to deviate from something. Gives people an idea of where they should be going with their show. |
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EVILDAN Inner circle 1279 Posts
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No problem with all the answers and insight given here.
Just playing devil's advocate.
by EVILDAN....
"The Coin Board Book" - moves and routines with the coin panel board. - http://www.lybrary.com/the-coin-board-book-p-827955.html "SLASHER - A Horror Whodunnit" - a bizarre close-up routine based on Bob Neale's "Sole Survivor." PM me for more info. "Zombie Town" - a packet effect about how a small town turned into zombies. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nzJhcoJtyOM |
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24315 Posts
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Actually, Chris had a good idea. If you have rules, then when your show doesn't work the way you think it did, you can find something to blame it on.
Some rules are patently obvious to seasoned performers. But they break them, anyway.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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Kozmo V.I.P. 5473 Posts
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I can tell you right now that I do street magic all the time for money and not the love of performing....and I agrre you should not do this BUT its how I feed my family ...and sometimes I just don't want to be there...
the rules are : you have to survive and money makes that happen...its the level of survival that's at question, if you want to very simple by yourself then I could go out and just perform because of the love of it...but because I have a family I have to work even if I don't feel like it... theress no art with out money folks...so if you go off and get yourself that real job, you are not getting better at this...even when I don't want to be there I get a little better....doing the same routines 1000's of times makes them better because you take them farther... heres some rules for ya do what makes you happy, and don't do anything that doesn't....i'm not always happy doing this but I'm a lot happier than I was when I had to get up a 6 am to be at a job that paid less than what I'm making in the streets...and listen, I don't beleive that you cant make a great living street performing...much better than a restaurant will every pay EVER!.... if you can only keep them for 5 monutes then you might be in the wrong spot at the wrong time....dinner hour they aren't going to stay...they are hungry....in the sun, they hate the sun...or it just could be you that's making them leave... been working on this new coin thing...its about 5 to 7 minutes long and its good, real good BUT they don't stay after it to see whats happening next so my friend and I were out there talking about this one day and I said listen, I have this problem and showed him the effect...MAN that's great!...so I did it for a live audience and they all left ...then I said ok now I'm gonna stop 2 times in the effect and tell some jokes....BAM, they stayed and loved it...see, gazzos right less is more, they don't care about magic guys well very few do...its the truth, we can talk about rope tricks and coin tricks and this and that and it just doesn't matter..if its good magic is all that matters...its you that keeps them, making them smile and laugh...rememebr funny is money..thats what makes it happen and that's why gazzo is the best and that's why gazzo would blow cellini off the pitch...because funny is money and no one cares about magic...good solid magic and be really entertaining and they wont leave koz |
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cstreet_1986 Loyal user 263 Posts
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Evil Dan, its always good to have someone looking for problems - this lets people to look at the problems found and correct them. Its good to have a critic. Cheers Dan,
Chase |
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chrisrkline Special user Little Rock 965 Posts
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Thank you Bill, but I try not to blame things on the rule if I can help it.
I try to learn from published routines that are well developed. I try to be as clear and as concise as possible. These sometimes conflict. Sometimes I say too much, in an attempt to be clear. Sometimes I don't say enough. But without those rules, it is hard to focus on how to fix a problem. When I first started to do Gazzo's cups routine, I had not seen him perform it. I knew he could spend a long time performing it, far longer then the "rules" would normally say you should. I also "knew" why he was able to get away from the rule saying, "forty-five minute long cups and balls is too long!" But I was frantic to make mine at least 20 minutes. I video taped myself and thought, "Not bad." But something was wrong. I turned the sound off and found myself yelling at the screen, "For god sake, shut up and do something you imbecile!" I began to really know why Gazzo could break the rule and get away with it. He was doing a comedy routine with cups and balls. He wasn't really breaking the rule. He was engaging his audience and his routine was exactly the length it needed to be to do that and maximize his hat. I did not have a comedy routine, although I could get some laughs. I drastically cut my routine to the bare bones and fleshed it out in areas that were needed and based this on the reactions of my spectators. It is now about 10 minutes long. I realized that I was ignoring the true rule which is to perform routines the spectators wanted to see, that I am capable of doing. I was pretending to follow the "Do good routines" rule forgetting that Gazzo's routine is not for me (although I follow the basic structure.) But I did remember that the core of his routine is great, and a good spot to start. The magic is still strong, but it has to be me doing the routine.
Chris
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24315 Posts
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I didn't mean that you would blame it on the rule, per se. I meant that the "rule" would tell you what needed fixing. Maybe the right term is "guideline."
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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EVILDAN Inner circle 1279 Posts
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Ah, guidelines. I like that.
Or sage advice from seasoned pros. Rules? Nah!!
by EVILDAN....
"The Coin Board Book" - moves and routines with the coin panel board. - http://www.lybrary.com/the-coin-board-book-p-827955.html "SLASHER - A Horror Whodunnit" - a bizarre close-up routine based on Bob Neale's "Sole Survivor." PM me for more info. "Zombie Town" - a packet effect about how a small town turned into zombies. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nzJhcoJtyOM |
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Zack Special user 553 Posts
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"The way of mastery is to break all rules. But first these rules must be fully understood."
--Aliester Crowley Quote:
On 2005-05-17 11:48, EVILDAN wrote: Good post Dan. I hadn't considered that there were actually TWO rules being expressed, and that they might contradict. Upon reflection, Don Driver's hankerchief bally definitely tests the limits of the audiences attention span. Some punters will grumble, and some walk off. that's OK...you didn't want those anyway. that's another It is essentially a long DELAY. You make promises, and keep delaying their fufiliment. When I was working as a pitchman in department stores, our bally had the same psychology: We would get on the loudspeaker and announce that we were giving away free gifts in LESS THAN ONE MINUTE! Then we'd hang up the loudspeaker and wait awhile and Give a second announcement making sure they under stood that there was only one gift to a customer: SUPPLIES ARE VERY LIMITED! Then I'd take a little break and come back on and give the LAST AND FINAL CALL! Were they grumpy when I got there? You bet. But they had already invested a good five minutes in getting this free thing, so leaving is out of the question. And they were curious as HELL. Like a gambler throwing good money after bad, they want to see the thing through. Most of the big earners in Santa Monica use a tactic like this. There's a Chinese circus guy (I guess you could call I'm a juggler, he balances a soccer ball on a tennis racket, and stands on a rola bola). He doesn't speak English so his bally is all silent. He blows a whistle, picks up a prop makes like hes going to do something amazing...changes his mind, adjusts the rola bola, goes into a ready position, as though about to do a handspring, then stops, moves a few people, and goes back into it, he keeps this up until he's satisfied with the crowd. Needless to say it tests there patience...but the ones that are still there at the end are QUALIFIED. |
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24315 Posts
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One thing to think about. The MTV generation's short attention span is affecting all of us. But it has less to do with the length of a show than it does with the space between new information coming in to the cerebral cortex. So, if you keep things happening, you can keep the audience where you want it.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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mplegare.gif "View Profile") Veteran user Forest Grove, Oregon 310 Posts
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The Mighty Bill Palmer Spake:
Quote:
One thing to think about. The MTV generation's short attention span is affecting all of us. But it has less to do with the length of a show than it does with the space between new information coming in to the cerebral cortex. So, if you keep things happening, you can keep the audience where you want it. That's about right. As Bill knows, working RenFaires, you have X amount of time to fill, and theorhetically you want more people standing and sitting and watching at the end than you do at the beginning. You *could* do a set that's X minus 5 minutes, or X minus 10 minutes if the crowd appears to be wavering, but I feel it's a matter of professional pride to keep them butts on them haybales the whole X minutes if at all possible. In my case, I do everything in my power to keep the dead air to a minimum. If the audience isn't busy reacting, shouting stuff back at me, or laughing, I'm not doing my job properly.
Matthew Legare aka Tobias the Adequate! - http://www.adequateblog.today.com - you know you want to.
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Bobby Maverick Loyal user 252 Posts
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Quote:
On 2005-05-17 14:16, Kozmo wrote: |
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Nick W Special user 515 Posts
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Also known as....................character
Kozmo, that coin trick your talking about...is it the one with a shotglass and boston box? you mentioned that last year but didn't have the shotglass...... Nickey Fynn |
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Posted: May 17, 2005 03:27 pm 
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