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magicalaurie Inner circle Ontario, Canada 2962 Posts |
Thank you, George.
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George Ledo Magic Café Columnist SF Bay Area 3042 Posts |
Too much information???
That's our departed buddy Burt, aka The Great Burtini, doing his famous Cups and Mice routine
www.georgefledo.net Latest column: "Sorry about the photos in my posts here" |
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magicalaurie Inner circle Ontario, Canada 2962 Posts |
I don't mind. Elephants will be elephants.
Posted: Dec 9, 2005 11:15pm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Who likes ELEPHANTS? I wanna hear from YOU! |
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Autumn Morning Star Grammar Hostess Today, I corrected grammar in 1378 Posts |
Hey Laurie,
I was at a big top style circus in Las Vegas and sat in the VIP seats just behind S & R and several other celebs. At the end of the show, the ringmaster got the nine elephants to stand on their hind legs and tower over the VIP's for effect. I have never been so in awe and so totally frightened at the same time. I could sense the massive weight of the elephants above us. Some of the elephants looked down at us with their tiny eyes. I wondered what they were thinking and wondered if they were happy doing what they were doing. They held the pose for what seemed like forever. I kept thinking "One little slip and we are peanut butter between their toes." I could see the thickness of their skin, the details of their face and mouth and I could even feel them breathe. The one near me sure needed a tic-tac. After they went down on all fours and walked out of the ring, I noticed that many of the audience members in our section had broken out into a sweat. (Me too.) I never will forget it. It was amazing. That is my elephant story.
Wonder is very necessary in life. When we're little kids, we're filled with wonder for the world - it's fascinating and miraculous. A lot of people lose that. They become cynical and jaded, especially in modern day society. Magic renews that wonder.
Doug Henning |
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magicalaurie Inner circle Ontario, Canada 2962 Posts |
Thankyou very much, MorningStar- exactly what I'm looking for.
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SnakeBabe New user Las Vegas 90 Posts |
Maybe I can give you some insights as to what they are thinking.
Perhaps it is “if I don’t do this humiliating trick I will get stuck with a sharp steel hook” or perhaps it was to avoid getting beaten. Or maybe it is the only way to get fed. Like tigers, elephants do tricks only because someone has beaten or scared them to the point they don’t know they are stronger. Fear is the method of training. Elephants don’t do tricks for fun. They do it to avoid pain and for food. Even if you hate PETA they have enough evidence to prove abuse is rampant in the circus and in the world of entertainment. I too have my concerns with PETA so I ask you to view the video from the American Humane Society at this link: http://stream.realimpact.net/?file=reali......ew-bb.rm If you feel like reading look over this page at: http://elephant.elehost.com/News/General......ses.html Or this statement from some experts: http://www.elephanttrust.org/circus.htm lastly, just “Google” injured elephants in circuses. Just the fact that more than one page shows up is one page too many. That should be enough. I know many will have an opinion about this already but after you take and open and honest look at the animals side of showbiz you may be forced to re-think your position Hugs and Hissessss, Maria |
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Johnnie Blaze Loyal user 204 Posts |
Very sad to say in some aspects you are correct Maria . but not all trainers are bad not all elephants live brutal lives , NOT ALL REPTILE KEEPERS ARE BAD. get my drift. there are many diffrent training methods. Look up the story of the elephant sanctuary and you will see this facility exists because of horror stories like the ones you printed. as far as PETA goes Penn and Teller exposed there true colors. but yet so many wacko's still follow them. that in itself is disgusting...
just remember not all people in these feilds are bad , unfortunately the good ones just don't get the media on there training methods because people don't want to hear "good stuff" they just want the "dirt" just my opinion John |
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magicalaurie Inner circle Ontario, Canada 2962 Posts |
I agree, Johnnie. Interesting.
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Autumn Morning Star Grammar Hostess Today, I corrected grammar in 1378 Posts |
I know this issue all too well, Snake babe. When talking about the "beauty" while contemplating what the animal was "thinking" I was hoping to stimulate thoughts on this subject. Sometimes people never examine these aspects from the animal's point of view. Now we have opened up meaningful and diverse dialogue. (Good links, too, SB)
I could not see bull-hook marks on these elephants, but I do not doubt the animals were trained this way as the circus took place about twenty years ago. Usually, trainers use this big hook behind the ear so the horrible gash will not show. I have talked to circus folk who just hate the way elephants have been "trained." I use doves, dogs, and snakes in my show. When I fell in love with my first snake it was hard to imagine I would have to feed them mice and rats because I have been a vegetarian all my life. I even tried shaving some hair off a mouse and rolling a veggie hot dog in it, but my snake would not eat it. Eventually I realized this was their personal circle of life and their balance in the world. PETA does make people think, but also does a whole lot to discredit itself. I joined years ago, but there were too many marginal folks and true freaks in the group. I promptly moved my membership to the Humane Society. Whatever we think, whatever our path in this world, we all need to closely examine our own role in cruelty toward creatures for which we are supposed to be guardians. We also need to remember that we "vote with our dollars." As for me, that was the last circus I ever attended. It was beautiful to watch, but I realized there was a very painful price to that "beauty."
Wonder is very necessary in life. When we're little kids, we're filled with wonder for the world - it's fascinating and miraculous. A lot of people lose that. They become cynical and jaded, especially in modern day society. Magic renews that wonder.
Doug Henning |
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magicalaurie Inner circle Ontario, Canada 2962 Posts |
I ALWAYS examine situations with EMPATHY for the animals involved. That's why I started the thread. The fact is it is NOT a one-sided issue. It is not ALWAYS negative for the animals involved. An open mind is a TWO-WAY street.
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Autumn Morning Star Grammar Hostess Today, I corrected grammar in 1378 Posts |
Glad you started the thread. You also seemed like you needed to hear a story about elephants and I am glad I told it to you Storytelling makes me quite happy and plays an important part in my show.
You also opened up a dialogue and that is good. I know most of us magicians treat our animals like gold, so it is hard to open our eyes and imagine that elephants could be treated any other way. It is easier to romanticize the exotic circus life of elephants than to examine the darker truths which lie just under the sequins and satin. I believe there are a few small family circuses that treats their animals like members of the family and the occasional trainer who protects them like babies. I also believe, from a well-researched point of view, that this situation is not the norm. Even if elephants are treated well, nomadic life in a closed trailer is not like roaming the wilds of their native land. Especially for such a magnificantly large, intellegent animal. By knowing that elephants are in vulnerable situations we can all work to protect the elephant and other animals we dearly love instead of romanticizing them from afar. We can donate to the Humane Society and to the Elephant Shelter in Tennessee or other shelters. As human beings we should all look to ways of making this a better place for all living beings. Here are a couple of "Animal Planet" links regarding elephants which you will enjoy, Laurie. You could spend all day on these links. The first is about a lady who built an elephant hospital in Thailand: http://animal.discovery.com/convergence/......ert.html The next is about some people in Tennessee who love elephants enough to set up a habitat-sanctuary for rescue. There is even an elephant cam! http://www.elephants.com/
Wonder is very necessary in life. When we're little kids, we're filled with wonder for the world - it's fascinating and miraculous. A lot of people lose that. They become cynical and jaded, especially in modern day society. Magic renews that wonder.
Doug Henning |
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magicalaurie Inner circle Ontario, Canada 2962 Posts |
Thankyou for the links, MorningStar.
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Autumn Morning Star Grammar Hostess Today, I corrected grammar in 1378 Posts |
You are welcome. Love that elephant cam!
Wonder is very necessary in life. When we're little kids, we're filled with wonder for the world - it's fascinating and miraculous. A lot of people lose that. They become cynical and jaded, especially in modern day society. Magic renews that wonder.
Doug Henning |
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Johnnie Blaze Loyal user 204 Posts |
Great site Morning star ty for the link that was actually the place in which I was speaking about the elephant sanctuary.. Once upon a time I was going to be there at the opening , that of course was when it was going to be opening in Costa Rica . Now I am sure you can see why all my stories about elephants were all good ones . and you can surely see why I say Carol Buckley and Scott Blaise are the top facility and handlers of elephants and all living creatures. good stuff
thanks again John |
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Autumn Morning Star Grammar Hostess Today, I corrected grammar in 1378 Posts |
Glad you liked the link, John. It takes a lot of time, patience and love to care for elephants. My hat is off to Carol Buckley and Scott Blaise.
Wonder is very necessary in life. When we're little kids, we're filled with wonder for the world - it's fascinating and miraculous. A lot of people lose that. They become cynical and jaded, especially in modern day society. Magic renews that wonder.
Doug Henning |
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Crispy Loyal user Louisville, KY 207 Posts |
When I was a little boy, we used to have elephant rides and camel rides at the zoo. I have pictures of myself riding both as a child. Then, one of the elephants at the zoo got out of the elephant riding area (it had apparently left to go get a toy in the elephant's living area), and attacked several visitors in the zoo before handlers got control of it. Our city prompty banned any animal rides where patrons or non-employees are the ones riding the animals (with an exemption for pony rides).
We heard nothing about this for years, but last year when the popular Shriner's Circus visited out city, they were upset they were told that they could not have their elephant rides. So now there are actually debates going on in our Metro council over a proposition to once again allow elephant rides. I have to saw it is surreal to watch excerpts from the discussions on this porpositions with middle aged men in fex hats testifying to the council about how much income the elephant rides make for things like the Shriner's Children's Hospital, and council members asking about differences between Asian and African elephants. (One amendment proposed being added to the amendment is allowing rides on on female Asian elephants). Who ever thought that elephant rides would be such a pressing issue in a Kentucky town? Cris |
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magicalaurie Inner circle Ontario, Canada 2962 Posts |
Thank you, Cris.
Posted: Jan 23, 2009 12:55pm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=cBtFTF2ii7......hp?tab=1 Agent61 has posted this great link in the Not Very Magical, Still... section of the Café. I think it's a great fit here. Would love to hear more elephant stories. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
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Vibono Magic Special user Växjö,Sweden 647 Posts |
AS a member of the Swedish Circus Academy I have to state a few thigs. Most Animaltrainers that work in the circuses love there animals and wouldnt hurt them in anyway. Trraining is not about forcing an animal to to something it's afraid of or that is un natural. The German animal trainer Gerd Simonite- Barum comended on that once when a person told him that the "classic" type of tiger act had the tigers jumping thou a flaming ring but you tigers only jump though a normal ring. Gerd awnserd that animals are afraid of fire and my animals won't hanve to do something they are afraid of.
I have knowtised that animaltrainers that misstreat there animals while working in a circus work very long as circuses don't want to hire them, partly becuse youl never know what will happend with the animals and partly if a trainer miss treat an animal and it got out it would be bad publicity. If you want to learn more about good elephant training you should visit Dan Kholes website http://www.elephant-news.com Dan has several years experience of elphant training both from zoos and in circusses.
Vibono Mirage
Magic entertainer and Balloon artist |
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Vibono Magic Special user Växjö,Sweden 647 Posts |
Ok it's not realy a story but at least it's something, a picture of me preforming with one of Sonny Frankellos african Efephants in Cirkus Arena (Denmark) back in 2003
If you want to know more about Sonny Frankello, one of the best elephant trainers in the world, visit him at http://www.elefantenhof-platschow.de/ to see his elephant park/farm.
Vibono Mirage
Magic entertainer and Balloon artist |
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magicalaurie Inner circle Ontario, Canada 2962 Posts |
Thank you very much for posting, Vibono Magic.
I've got another video link - filmed by a nature guide, I believe. Elephants know how to work together. Check it out: http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=5O-BFMcwiY8 |
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