Is this the right forum for that?

I have some old video clips of Harry Blakstone (with the handkerchief) and Fred Kaps etc.

Is anyone collecting those old video clips?

I know there are clips of Al Baker and Del Ray,Dai Vernon(Not in the revelations series) Slydini and so on.

I will be glad to get comments.

Have fun
ROi

Roi, I would love to see your footage of Blackstone.

You may be sitting on a goldmine!

Posted: Sep 15, 2005 10:22pm
Where are you going to release this info?

Posted: Sep 17, 2005 10:25am
Word from a close friend is that you may not be able to release this stuff without some kinda permission.
I'll look into this over the weekend!

Posted: Sep 17, 2005 8:26pm
Word up!
Inconclusive


A.

What do you have these clips on (film, video, dvd)? I would love to see them. What do you have Harry Blackstone doing with a handkerchief?

I've got a lot of old material from the old guys (Downs, Kaps, Marvelli, Blackstone sr., Dante, ....) on DVDs (!). Too much to be listed here.
Some of that material is free and other stuff is still protected by a copyright - so I can't share, but if you are interested in the 'free' stuff send me a pm or even better a direct mail.

I also have run upon 2 VHS tapes that I have in the collection of old masters. Some of the action is from OLD magic conventions. I don't think there's sound on any of them. I think each tape is 8 hours. I believe that none of it is copywrited and is public domain. It's probably privately filmed. I have it on VHS, but I'm planning to dupe it to DVD in the next couple weeks. Anybody interested? Email me at: stevethomasmagic@aol.com and maybe we can make a deal.

Steve Thomas

I just came across a box with a bunch of magic on VHS. Copperfield Specials,a bit of Doug Henning, some old Dick Cavett and Mike Douglas shows with guest appearances by Frank Garcia, Mark Wilson etc....and a Jimmy Grippo appearance on Carson.

My question, what would be involved in getting this edited and transferred to DVD and what would the quality be like? Much of this is 25 years old now, don't want to risk losing it!

Any advice or comments would be most welcome.

Jim

There are a number of clips out on various DVD's of Uncle Harry doing the dancing handkercheif as well a the buzz saw illusion and the vanishing birdcage. I've seen it on a number of sites too.

The show I'd most like to see again is the memorable Dick Cavett Show c. 1974 with 3 fairly well-known Canadian magicians: Derek Dingle, the Professor and Doug Henning! Does anyone know how access to that show could be obtained?

Posted: Aug 13, 2006 1:30am
I found this site on the Web: http://www.magicvideoarchives.com/

You might find it interesting.

Hmmm, not to rain on anyone's parade, but I'm not sure the material on that site is legal. It looks to be a collection of aired magic. Copyrights would belong to either the producers of each show or the network (depending on production details).

However, works that are filmed by a private indivdividual (ie: video camera at a show or convention) would be easier to work with. The person shooting the camera and taping it owns the copyright, not a network or corporation. So to release this material, you would still need a written release from the camera operator.

Here's a general rule: if it was produced after the 1920's give or take, it's pretty much got a copyright on it that is still in effect. This dates back to a recent ruling exending copyrights in a case with Disney (they gotta protect the mouse - it's their cash cow - er, mouse!).

It states that copyrights extend from the moment of creation (the minute it is shot on film) until 75 years after the copyright owner's death. THEN it is released into the public domain if and only if it is not transferred to another copyright owner (typically the estate).

So even 8mm camera footage from the 50's or 60's would need clearance from the copyright owner, since those copyrights would still be in efffect.

In each case, you still would need actor/model releases from the magician giving permisssion to BE recorded.

Just don't want to see anyone get in any trouble.

Warm regards,
Scott

I see old clips in show dealing with the history of magic. How on earth do they find out if it is copywriten and who still holds it? And that makes me start thinging about effects. If someone goes and makes his/her own Zig-Zag is that protected under a copyright

If your Zig-Zag is substantially different, and those differences are original and can be proved to be original, it can be protected. If it looks like a traditional Zig-Zag, it probably would not be different enough to worry about protecting. I am, however, NOT a lawyer, and I don't play one on TV.

Steve

Penbrock, I'll try my best to answer your two questions.

First, regarding footage on shows regarding the history of magic. Many times, they do research to find out where the footage came from. Watch the credits some time. You'll see, "Footage of X Courtesy of Y." Often it is something like "Footage of 1974 Tonight Show Courtesy of NBC."

Someone owns the copyright. If it is produced/broadcast without permission, it opens the door for litigation. This is why release forms, contracts and TONS of paperwork go into any production using non-original footage.

As I stated above, if it was aired after the late 1920's, the copyright is more than likely owned by SOMEONE, especially after the copyright laws where revamped in the 1970s to extend to 75 years beyond the death of the copyright owner.

Unfortunately, the "free for all" attitude promoted on sites such as YouTube create the impression that if it's on the Internet, it's free and anyone can use it. Copyright laws hold true for all mediums, not just broadcast.

Regarding your second question, since the Zig Zag was invented by Harbin in the 1960's, if you go and make a ZigZag, you had better own the manufacturing rights. If you purchased The Magic of Allen Wakeling, for example, you own the rights to manufacture and perform The Wakeling Sawing.

If you "improve" the effect, you could still be in violation. If a work is a derivative work based on a copyrighted work, then you must secure permission from the original copyright owner. For example, if I wanted to write a book based on R2D2's life, I'd need permission from LucasFilm.

I hope this helps.
Scott

I have a DVD (started as VHS) with over 4 hours of old magicians from magic conventions and other performances. Most are billboarded with the name of the performer (on a board with the letters stuck on). It's completely silent. There's some Blackstone on there, some Houdini and others. Mostly from the EARLY 1900s, but there are a couple of color scenes. I don't think this was made for television or airing, mostly shot by individuals.

Whom would be the copyright holder on footage shot at magic conventions a hundred years ago?

Steve