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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Ever so sleightly » » Ball under bell (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

cupnovice
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I'm trying to put a cup and ball act together. Earlier this year I saw a guy do a move where one of the balls ended up under a bell. I wold really like to put this move in my act but reading a lot of posts here I am afraid that this is unethical unless it has been published in a book or DVD.
Does anyone know if this move is published anywhere. Is it OK for me to use this?
Dave V
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Las Vegas, NV
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That move was part of Jason Michael's Cups and Balls routine. The bell is an integral part of his Ren Faire act. He won second place in the IBM Closeup Competition with this routine.

I doubt that it's published, but the right thing to do would be to contact Jason and ask him. He lives in Gallatin, TN.
No trees were killed in the making of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
Payne
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Seattle
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I've been doing a ball production from under a bell in my Mediaeval style act for nearly a decade now. I'm away from my books at the moment but the production of a ball from under a candlestick is in either "Hocus Pocus Jr." or the "Art of Jugling" I'll check when I get back to my library. Anyway it is from the idea of a incorporating a candlestick into the routine that I decided to use a bell in my cups and balls act.
If you want to use it in a routine your creating feel free. If anyone questions you tell the you got it from me. Just don't steal my line From the "nimbleness of my fingers and the slowness of your eyes" which I saw you reference in an earlier post on this subject.
"America's Foremost Satirical Magician" -- Jeff McBride.
sethb
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The Jersey Shore
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I think producing balls from underneath anything is pretty much in the public domain at this point. Even producing a ball from beneath a bell is not that far of a stretch. However, if you completely imitated the other fellow, got dressed up like a pirate and used a bell with nautical-type patter, I imagine he'd be plenty upset, because you would definitely have "pirated" his act (no pun intended.) Even dressing like a Colonial town crier and using a bell might be a bit close for comfort, but at least it's a halfway inventive adaptation.

It's true that when you're just starting out, you need role models because you have nothing else to base your magic on. There's nothing wrong with looking at other great magicians for inspiration. But you also need to remember that doing someone else's thing does not automatically make your own act great. You can copy the tricks, the patter, the little bits of business, but you can't copy the delivery or the personality of another person. Ultimately, you need to find what works for you and develop your own clever presentation. The answer is already there, inside you, but it may take some time and thought to bring it out -- time well spent, by the way. SETH
"Watch the Professor!!" -- Al Flosso (1895-1976)
"The better you are, the closer they watch" -- Darwin Ortiz, STRONG MAGIC
Jonathan Townsend
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Eternal Order
Ossining, NY
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Quote:
On 2005-09-16 13:15, cupnovice wrote:
... Earlier this year I saw a guy do a move where one of the balls ended up under a bell. I wold really like to put this move in my act ...


Good idea to START by asking the guy. Since you are a novice in this field, it seems impudent if not outright imprudent to go looking for published sources so you can feel better about copying something you saw. Try working the OTHER way and READ Conus, Decremps, Hoffmann, ... and find out about what has been done so you can then consider what might work for you. Seems a shame to simply point you to Gertner's Silver and Steel book when there is a whole world of literature full of other goodies to explore. If you get down to reading, you will find Tommy Wonder's amazing idea for how to manage large heavy cup loads with greatly reduced fussing and strain. Now there's a goody folks can enjoy when they find it.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Payne
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Seattle
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When I constructed my routine I read and watched virtually everything I could find upon the subject. Though my finished routine is basically Vernon's (which is strangly quite close to many earlier routines). I also have a Gazzoesque type ending but produce a wide array of articles instead of oranges.
I pulled moves and bits of business from Aldo, Gertner, Read, Amar and many others.
After I had devised the original routine I showed it to a friend who had the gumption to tell me that while it was structurally good, there was no me in the routine.
So it was back to the drawing board to make the routine my own.
This is one of magic's biggest secrets. People can steal your tricks and lines but they can't steal you. If you make something truly your own no one will ever be able to do it except you.
"America's Foremost Satirical Magician" -- Jeff McBride.
Vandy Grift
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Milwaukee
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Quote:
On 2005-09-16 15:23, Payne wrote:
This is one of magic's biggest secrets. People can steal your tricks and lines but they can't steal you. If you make something truly your own no one will ever be able to do it except you.


Didn't you just ask a guy not to steal a line from you three posts up? If it's "truly your own" who cares if he steals it? Smile
"Get a life dude." -some guy in a magic forum
Payne
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Seattle
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Quote:
On 2005-09-16 15:40, Vandy Grift wrote:

Didn't you just ask a guy not to steal a line from you three posts up? If it's "truly your own" who cares if he steals it? Smile



Because it more than likely won't work for him.
There used to be a guy up here who tried to do my stuff. Actually surreptitiously tape recorded my act so he could mimic the lines. The end result wasn't pretty.
I'm not married to any of my lines. If someone wants to use 'em, and they fit their performing style go ahead.
All I was trying to say is that it's a bad habit to get into. The more time you spend mimicing someone else is less time you can spend trying to find out who your performing character is.
"America's Foremost Satirical Magician" -- Jeff McBride.
Vandy Grift
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Milwaukee
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Payne,

I was just screwing around with you. It just struck me as funny because I read the whole thread at one time.

I agree with you about personalizing material. Also, since the posters name is "cupnovice" I don't know if that means he is a novice to magic all together. But I'll offer a bit of advice for what it's worth. Just ask before using anything. A line, trick, a move, whatever. It's just a good idea for so many reasons. It was nice to see the guy ask about using the move in the first place. Shows a heart in the right place.

Vandy
"Get a life dude." -some guy in a magic forum
Bill Palmer
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Eternal Order
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Actually, Joro worked out a balls and bell routine a long time ago. It is published in his book Kleines Becherspiel-Kompendium. This was published in Germany in die Magie in 1998 and in the aforementioned book in 1999.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
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