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KiKi Inner circle GERMANY/ Hannover 1143 Posts |
Hi everybody!last night I did `bank night` (the osterlind version)! after the show a spectator came to me and said: "great show, but I know how it`s done the one with the envelopes! there is no bill in any of the envelopes. you have a bill somewhere hidden in the hand or sleeve, and put it somehow in the last envelope you hold!"
it`s the third time I used it in a show, but always spectator told me that. and it`s definately not the presentation nor the handling! did you make the same experience sometimes? best kiki |
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Ola Loyal user Australia / Sweden 245 Posts |
It is definately the presentations or the handling.
You laugh because I'm different. I laugh because you are all the same...
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cardiac Loyal user Reading, U.K. 250 Posts |
Yeah, watch the Osterlind tapes again, especially his audience management.
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Magic and Drums New user Germany 46 Posts |
Did you check your handling of that last envelope? I believe Osterlind uses a TT-method, doesn't he? Try your routine in front of a video camera and watch how smooth you handle the last envelope with the bill.
Daniel |
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Ken Dyne Inner circle UK 2268 Posts |
I has this once too,. and it was all down to the handling I just had to reexamine what I was doing. Now I have chnaged the method and the spectator takes my slip of paper out for me
Kennedy
MR GOLDEN BALLS 2.0: https://mentalunderground.com/product/mr-golden-balls-2-0/" target="_blank"> https://mentalunderground.com/product/passed-out-deck/
BAIRN: Named 'Best Mentalism Product Of 2014 by Marketplace of the Mind is my collection of more than 40 mentalism routines in a beautiful paperback book: http://www.mentalunderground.com/product/bairn |
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Richard Osterlind V.I.P. 2213 Posts |
Quote:
On 2005-11-28 04:42, KiKi wrote: I wrote about this in another thread, but let me first explain all the handling. The bill is folded 3 times with the loose edges on top and your thumb laying on top of the bill. When you open the envelope, the flap is towards you. You pop open the flap (remember to only lick them in the center!) and slide your thumb inside. You slide off the TT and start to open the bill another fold as you bring out your thumb. You turn the envelope towards the audience so they can see it coming out of the envelope. Now this is the important part. You CANNOT try to hide anything or do any fast moves. You must do everything DELIBERATELY almost as though you are proving the bill is coming out of the envelope! By drawing attention to your actions you will dispel any doubt that the bill was in there in the first place. See, KiKi, if they actually SAW the TT they would be telling you that. But they said it came from your sleeve or hand which means they DID NOT SEE IT. They SUSPECTED it because of your attitude. Don't be afraid. Just do it DELIBERATELY. Richard |
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100ch New user Sheffield UK 43 Posts |
Quote:
On 2005-11-28 04:42, KiKi wrote: mmmmmmmmmmm |
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Josho Special user Albany, New York 758 Posts |
Quote:
On 2005-11-28 04:42, KiKi wrote: If it is not the presentation, and it's not the handling, the only thing left is the method itself. But since many people utilize the method successfully, clearly the presentation and/or the handling are the problem. --Josh |
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RicHeka Inner circle 3999 Posts |
Kiki:If I may just add a little touch that I use along with Mr.Osterlinds fine handling:After you turn the envelope toward the audience,look down into it for a second as if trying to spot the contents.Then apparently you see it..now look up and smile..then as cleanly as possible and while still looking at the spectators slowly remove the bill.This(look and discovery) creates a little tension in peoples minds that hey, maybe he made a mistake!
I tend to do this with all 'revelations'.Another example is The Invisible Deck:I state there should be one card opposite the rest..and as I am slowly going through them ..I say "I don't see one"..then bingo! they will be 'telling you'that they see it.TENSION. All the best. Rich |
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Sven Rygh Inner circle Oslo, Norway. 1945 Posts |
Quote:
On 2005-11-28 04:42, KiKi wrote: It definately is! What else could it be? Let me tell you that I have used this as my opener since MM was released, and have only good things to say about it. It is great fun and audience involvement. Indeed, there aregreater mysteries than this in the world, but it is a perfect opener for my shows. ....and: the routine is great entertainment and an attention grabber. Isn't that what we want our things to be? Sven PS no one has ever come up to me after the show to tell me how they think this is done. Not once.
WWW.SVENRYGH.NO
"Keep it as simple as possible, - but no simpler" http://www.svenrygh.no/sven-rygh/presse/nrk-forst-og-sist/ http://www.svenrygh.no/video.html |
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Ken Dyne Inner circle UK 2268 Posts |
Let's be honest mentalists and magicians have gotten away with far more than this in the past, all with good presentation and handling.
The method is always secondary. Kennedy
MR GOLDEN BALLS 2.0: https://mentalunderground.com/product/mr-golden-balls-2-0/" target="_blank"> https://mentalunderground.com/product/passed-out-deck/
BAIRN: Named 'Best Mentalism Product Of 2014 by Marketplace of the Mind is my collection of more than 40 mentalism routines in a beautiful paperback book: http://www.mentalunderground.com/product/bairn |
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Gianni Special user WILMINGTON, DE 993 Posts |
There are many on this thread who vouch for this effect, and state that the handling is the key. Of course, all respect must go to these people, especially Richard Osterlind. I have total respect for performers with experience under fire. Nevertheless, I am of a different, admittedly minority view here.
I assume the handling is flawless. (I have Mr. Osterlind's DVD with this effect.) To me, however, you simply must get at least a small, but significant percentage of people in the audience that simply will figure out that the effect can be accomplished exactly the way it is actually done. Let's not pretend otherwise, and smugly agree amongst ourselves that the handling will fool everyone. Gianni |
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RicHeka Inner circle 3999 Posts |
Gianni:I respectfully..totally disagree.
Rich |
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EscapeMaster Loyal user 296 Posts |
Let's not fool ourselves here.
Any half-intelligent person who thinks about how this might be done (unless you offer a convincing pseudo-psychological explanation) will suggest that all of the envelopes are empty at the beginning. This is not at all to say the trick/effect is poor. Certainly, with all the excitement of a performance when the spectator is unlikely to be thinking about method I am sure it would fly by most people. But anybody watching analytically who wants to work it out does not need to be a genius. Do they? |
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KiKi Inner circle GERMANY/ Hannover 1143 Posts |
Hi guys! maybe I know what the problem is!
all the spectators who came to me after the show, knew that I started as a magician. I did `finger flicking`stuff with cards, coins, bills and everything. they know that i`m good with sleigh of hand. maybe they thought that was just that! the other spectators who know me as just a mentalist never mentioned anything. kiki |
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Gianni Special user WILMINGTON, DE 993 Posts |
Quote:
On 2005-11-28 17:01, KiKi wrote: Yes. Maybe that was it. Gianni |
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RicHeka Inner circle 3999 Posts |
I believe routines like Bank Nite when presented in a lighthearted and fun /casual way will greatly 'limit' backtracking by 'self styled genuises'.Hey, sometimes even a 'smarty pants' wants to just have fun. ;0
Rich |
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Snail Regular user UK 163 Posts |
I think you need to present this as a psychological exercise. Not as a magic trick. You have to get the audience to believe that the money is in the envelope before the routine starts.
One point on the handling. When you're practising this, get rid of the TT, stick the bill inside the envelope, and practise taking it out exactly as you do when using the TT. How does it look? Use this as your model for using the TT. Also, how slowly can you extract the bill? Do it as slowly as you dare! |
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DonMarco Regular user 187 Posts |
Hi Kiki and others!
Snail, great idea for practicing without the TT and modeling it! Another thing, while working in front of the mirror, play with different sizes and types of envelopes to find what works out to be the most dramatic-looking. Cheers! DM
"Imagination is the Only Reality"-- Marquis de Sade
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Richard Osterlind V.I.P. 2213 Posts |
Quote:
On 2005-11-28 16:44, EscapeMaster wrote: Why? If you have empty hands and an empty hand is seen going into the envelope and comes out with a bill, why would they think you somehow put it in? Sure, there might be some who will think "he somehow put it in there", but there are just as many others who might think, "they are all stooges" or "he switched the envelope" or some other lame explanation. But yes, if the presentation is strong and people are entertained, they won't be in the mindset to try to deduce each and every thing you did. Also, let's not forget about the misdirection of naming one of the envelopes and the fact that the specatator ends up with the lottery tickets. One hour after the show people will be swearing that not only did you keep the envelope with the bill, but that you mentally caused the other person to get the lottery tickets! Richard |
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