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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » When good tapes go bad (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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blindbo
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Bucks County, PA
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I have two videos in my library that will no longer play.
It doesn't seem that there are warranties on them, but they don't perform as they were intended to.
If they were lost, well that's my problem and I would expect to repurchase if I wanted to maintain them in my library. But they were not lost - just won't work.
Books don't suddenly have their words disappear.
This problem is unique to recorded media.
I'll probably just look around for these to come up used someplace, but wanted to post this to hear what others thought about it.
Vandy Grift
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I hear you Blindbo. With DVD the problem has been fixed to some extent. I also have a large collection of sports and magic tapes that I worry about. I don't think it's considered unethical(even by the most adamant among us) to make backup copies of your magic tapes for your own use. That may be something you want to do with your remaining tapes. Or have them converted to DVD. That what I intend to do with some of my more prized VHS tapes.

Vandy
"Get a life dude." -some guy in a magic forum
daffydoug
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They say they deteriorate after about ten or fifteen years, if I recall.

I have hundreds of tapes that I recorded off TV years ago, and I surely MUST find a way to convert these to disc so that I can preserve them.


When you say with DVD the problem is resolved somewhat, how do you mean? My impression is that if you take care of a DVd or a CD, not scratching it, or abusing it, it will indeed last forever, because their is no FRICTION involved. Just the laser light.

Am I on the wrong track here? Please let me know.
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
Vandy Grift
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When I say "resolved somewhat" I mean that DVD is MUCH better than VHS. But DVDs can be ruined if they are not taken care of, like you said. You are right, if they are properly cared for, you should have no problem. They are a lot better than tape at this point. The future may bring some sort of a hard drive storage system for these things, like on your CPU. But right now I like the DVD format.

Vandy
"Get a life dude." -some guy in a magic forum
daffydoug
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I did some googling here on the topic, and I was somewhat surprised to find that they tell me the DVds are NOT eternal!

I guess the maximum you can expect they say, is three hundred years..that's OK, I will be LOOOONG gone by then, as will all of us. But still, they don't tel WHAT the enemy is.

By that, I mean, with tapes and vinyl records, we all know the enemy was FRICTION. I can understand that with friction wearing against the source, eventually they would wear out. That is simple physics 101.

But with the advent of the disc, I was under the impression that they had vanquished that foe. 9No tape head, no stylus/needle..just pure light "touching" the surface.

Now considering that a person such as myself could conceivably handle a DVD with "kid gloves" for three hundred years, (were I to live that long), then I could keep the surface free of scratches, and dirt for all that time, (plus I use the "condoms" that they sell for discs), what then could possibly be the nemesis of these DVDs? Consider that if I DID happen to get a scratch , I can go down town to the PC store and get it resurfaced like brand new for under three bucks.

I know it's silly, but I have often wondered about this. I suppose I will never know.

Just ignore me. I'm thinking out loud. I'm exploring mysteries to which man has no answer. I do that often. We call it insanity.
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
Jaz
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Don't feel too bad Blindbo.
I've had sections of tape go bad too.

Also, I just recieved a magic DVD this past week and it played fine. A couple of days later I watched it again and at a certain point the thing pixelated, froze and went back to the menu. I tried a couple of more times, tried wiping it to no avail.
Close examination showed a thin scratch. AAArrrghh! No idea how it got scratched.

I prefer books. With those I can quickly access info and read them anywhere, anytime.
Michael Baker
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I wonder if someone could come up with a device to re-surface DVDs at a reasonable price? Kind of like having your brake rotors turned, only something that would work for plastic.
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The Magic Company
landmark
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At my local Staples office supply store, I've seen DVD plastic covers for sale. You slip them on the DVD and you can play them even with the slips on. The slips protect the DVDs from scratches. Or say they say . . . I've never tried them though I've been tempted. I think they were 3 for $5 but I night be wrong about that.


Jack Shalom
Micheal Leath
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Quote:
On 2006-01-07 18:47, Michael Baker wrote:
I wonder if someone could come up with a device to re-surface DVDs at a reasonable price? Kind of like having your brake rotors turned, only something that would work for plastic.


I believe they already sell devices that do that for around $30.
daffydoug
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Quote:
On 2006-01-07 18:47, Michael Baker wrote:
I wonder if someone could come up with a device to re-surface DVDs at a reasonable price? Kind of like having your brake rotors turned, only something that would work for plastic.


The computer shop around the corner from where I live does exactly that. Under three bucks will get any DVd or Cd completely re-surfaced...all shiny and new.

Posted: Jan 8, 2006 3:00am
Quote:

On 2006-01-07 19:03, landmark wrote:
At my local Staples office supply store, I've seen DVD plastic covers for sale. You slip them on the DVD and you can play them even with the slips on. The slips protect the DVDs from scratches. Or say they say . . . I've never tried them though I've been tempted. I think they were 3 for $5 but I night be wrong about that.

Jack Shalom

The brand I use are called D_skins....But I prefer to call them condoms.

The laser plays right through the clear protector, and scratches are history.
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
Jaz
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Thanks for the info. I'll have to look into those DVD repair ideas.
Partizan
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Firstly, DVDs/CDs of a certain age can react with types of vynil/pvc's to create a gas that degrages the disc.
All VALUBLE DVD/CD's should be duplicated and the master stored correctly and only used to remaster.

VHS's come with no guarantee as the lifespan depends on storage and usage and the machine used for playback.

If your VHS's are looking bad then remaster them ASAP. You will need to find someone with a professional VHS machine, It will have a better chance of a good quality playback and will play tapes that most domestic machines will fail.
I have remastered a VHS with mould on the tape itself. I had to clean the whole 60 mins and then rehouse it in a new case before I could even put it into the machine.

A friend of mine masters onto removable hard drives, he works at a place where they scrap a lot of dives so he takes them home and uses them to store his films. He has a stack of over 30 drives, all of them 20gb upto 80gb.
"You cannot depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus."
- Mark Twain
daffydoug
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I am learning a lot of new stuff here.
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
blindbo
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Bucks County, PA
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Quote:
On 2006-01-08 08:54, Partizan wrote:
Firstly, DVDs/CDs of a certain age can react with types of vynil/pvc's to create a gas that degrages the disc.
All VALUBLE DVD/CD's should be duplicated and the master stored correctly and only used to remaster.


Duplication makes great sense and I have a library of DVD's that I surely don't want to ever lose, but how would I duplicate a copy protected DVD? Seems the legitimate action to prevent piracy also prevents the honest protection of the investment.
The plot thickens...
Micheal Leath
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The copy protection is only good if you don't know how to get around it. There are free programs that do just that and they are so simple to use. Everytime a new copy protection is created there are updates to the programs to get around the protection. Of course, they would only be ok to use if you are backing up DVD's or CD's for your own use.
daffydoug
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Reminds me of police radar guns..they make them better, then someone comes up with an anti radar device that one ups that, ad infinitum.

Or that Bugs Bunny Cartoon where Elmer pulls a gun on Bugs, so Bugs goes off stage and comes back with a rifle, then Elmer goes off and comes back on with a cannon, and you know the rest! Funny stuff!
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
Partizan
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A very good and simple program is DVDShrink. This seems to ignore copy protection and region codes.

I do not advocate piracy but something needs to be done to protect our investments.

http://www.dvdshrink.org/
DVD Shrink is free software. You should never pay for DVD Shrink.
Quote:
As seen on CNN. Our reviewed DVD Software even Copies Protected DVDs
"You cannot depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus."
- Mark Twain
brokin6
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Also, I would like to add that their is a misconception about copying discs. The law that prohibits copying states that it is illegal to crack the encryption not just copy the movie. As I recall their is a stiffer penalty for cracking the encoding and a youth from Sweden (i believe) was the one who first cracked it and he was in court for quite awhile. The best combination of software I have found have been AnyDvD and Clone dvd used in tandem. Very rarely do I encounter a problem and it is a fast easy four step process. http://www.videohelp.com is a great resource for anyone wanting to learn about DVD structure and copying. Any other questions feel free to P.M. me.
Why does coin magic make my head hurt!?!
blindbo
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Bucks County, PA
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Brokin6, that leaves me quite confused.
It sounds like its illegal any way you slice it, yet you go on to point to the software that facilitates the copying. Is it that the illegality is directed only towards uses other than personal backups? Sort of "Don't remove this tag under penalty of law", but you the owner can mutilate the mattress any way you'd like?
irossall
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Snohomish, Washington
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Comercial DVD's and CD's are aluminum disc's that are pressed then sandwiched in between clear plastic disc's which are then glued and pressed together. Most commercial disc's (name brand) are rated for 200 years.
The disc's that we "burn" at home are not aluminum pressed disc's but are dye's that react to the laser. Blank disc's for home use generaly have a minimum of 40 years of life and can be as high as 100+ years if you purchase the more expensive "Archive" disc's (from a name brand company). Some of the very inexpensive (no name) disc's can go bad in as little as a year or two, that is why I no longer purchase anything but recognised name brands.
Different dye's are used as well as different glues and that is where most of the problems come from.
I have tried most of the brands available in my area and I have had good results with Memorex and the more expensive Kodak Archive Disc's.
Iven Smile
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