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Drs_Res Veteran user 325 Posts |
He's not selling cars, or paint, or hardware, or MP3 players, or guns, ect. either. So he's not selling cookies, so what?
If you want to know why he has it for sale, why not send him an email and ask? Make your objection known.
( / ) The Bunny
(O.o) Add him to your signature. (> <) Help him rule the world. /_||_ Prosper at his side. Scott |
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entity Inner circle Canada 5060 Posts |
Since Andrew Mayne works for the JREF, or at least, he used to, I suspect that Mayne offered to sell his DVD on the site to help raise money for the JREF.
A number of Skeptics have a passing interest in conjuring, or are actually performing Magicians. The DVD would be of interest to those people. - entity
email: tomebaxter@icloud.com
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Tony Iacoviello Eternal Order 13151 Posts |
Public exposure of magical methods, even if unrelated, reduce the impact of magical effects as people seem to relate these methods to whatever effect they see. (Yes, even if it is totally unrelated, even if they don't remember the method exactly.)
I've also said that what diminishes one, diminishes all. This is how I feel. Go ahead and that I have not answered the question, and I will say you are dead wrong! I had no family members or friends in the twin towers on 9/11, you could say that what happened there did not affect me, personally, but I again would say you were wrong. A part of me was damaged, a part of who I am, where I come from. what I do. When parts of my craft are exposed on national television, part of my art is damaged or distroyed. You might say this is an extreem parallel to draw, yes it is. I've tried more subtle examples, but they sneak by and are not understood. To be quite honest, I don't expect you to agree with my arguement. You say that exposure is bad, but Randi did it for the greater good (at least in his mind). Well, So did Hitler, so did Osama, so did Valentino. Excuses all. MY OPINION! Tony |
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jimtron Inner circle 2039 Posts |
I don't believe Randi has exposed anything that would harm any magician or mentalist. If someone has evidence to the contrary, please post it. Tony, I'm not sure if you were addressing me, but that's not an argument I support (that Randi is guilty of "bad exposure," but it's OK because it's for the greater good). I don't believe that Randi is guilty of "bad exposure."
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Harry H Inner circle 1526 Posts |
Sorry Im drowning in a sea of ethics here,but what secrets of magicians has James Randi exposed? He exposes psychics,clairvoyants,wacko healers,girls with X ray vision et al, as far as I am aware.Magicians who perform these stunts are maybe exposed by proxy.But I don't see Randi on national TV exposing Hippity Hop rabbits or centre tears.Its a contextual thing as far as I see it,if he shows Syvlia Browne using pre-show work to con an old lady into thinking her dead husband is sending a message then good for him!
Ian Rowland "exposed" IT and a spoon bend on a TV show in the context of exposing psychics,but as far as Im aware he still fools the pants of his audiences. The Randi Forum has a Conjurers section where exposure is forbidden under the rules! So soemhow the cries of exposure are very tenuous and misplaced IMO. |
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Tony Iacoviello Eternal Order 13151 Posts |
Jim
Who does key bending, spoon bending, or uses a thumb tip? Oh, wait, many of us do. (Nova, 1974. Available for purchase at Amazon.com., and through randi.org. Also Nova, 1993) Can you say Daja Vu? Tony |
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jimtron Inner circle 2039 Posts |
Tony:
Do you think that the Nova show hurt any magicians or mentalists? I highly doubt that any good magician or mentalist would be harmed by this. |
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Tony Iacoviello Eternal Order 13151 Posts |
Jim:
I've stated this over and over again. In my opinion we were all hurt by this. Tony |
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entity Inner circle Canada 5060 Posts |
Tony: While I would agree that ANY exposure diminishes Magic, I find your tossing Randi in with Hitler and Bin Laden to be extreme to the point of sillyness.
Life is not black and white. We must examine motives, the nature and extent of the deeds in question, and the effect of those deeds on others. You reaction is, in my opinion, unwarranted. It seems motivated more by your personal feelings at being slighted by Randi, than by any real injury done by his exposures. - entity
email: tomebaxter@icloud.com
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J ack Galloway Inner circle 1309 Posts |
Jim I find it telling that you cannot see this from the side of a mentalist or magician.
Tony gives you an answer he works as do I to make a living as a performer. We stand on the inside and you yap about you cannot see how it would hurt anyone what Randi does. I am telling you it does. Randi degrades magic in my opinion and is of no value to perfromers of the magical arts. I would also like to add that creating a non-profit is a scam. Most clever guys know this. And I never said he was not clever. Of course all of this is my opinion. Jack |
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Tony Iacoviello Eternal Order 13151 Posts |
You could be right. He did not show up at my house for Christmas dinner. Maybe I am holding a hidden resentment for that. Come to think of it, he did not come for Christmas dinner last year either. Heck, he didn't even send a card! You might be on to something.
I told you that the example I used was extreme, but it was that to illustrate the problem with your argument. (Some times it takes a silly example to get the point across.) You say what does exposure do to you personally, my point is that it diminishes the are, even if just a little bit, and it hurts us all. I have stated this point several times, yet you keep asking the same question. I just wanted to be sure to get the point across. Tony |
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chichi711 Inner circle 5810 Posts |
I feel fairly confident in saying a true exposure shows has not cost magicians money. Most people can't even remember what they saw. The reality is the average layman does NOT CARE. They see magic as a fun fifteen minutes and they are on with life. If they cared much beyond that they would be MAGICIANS. I dare say most magicians got into magic trying to find out how somethng they saw was done. They tried it out on a friend and next thing you know you are getting paid. In a lot of ways small exposures gives layman interest. In my opinion Randi gives out small exposure. That is what I see. Yes the masked magician probably went to far on a few things, but overall not a big deal.
osted: Feb 6, 2006 2:03pm Just to pre answer. I personally would not give away secrets. |
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Tony Iacoviello Eternal Order 13151 Posts |
Chichi
Please don't take this wrong, but do you perform? Do you support your family with earnings you make from magic? Tony |
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Slim King Eternal Order Orlando 18031 Posts |
It is absolutely no stretch to compare Randi and The Masked Magician. They both expose magic. GUILTY! They both make money doing it. GUILTY! They both have stupid reasoning behing their betrayal. GUILTY!
They are the same in too many ways. If you can't see that, then you have been blinded to the truth. And Entity....Where's the answer to my question??????? All you do is spin!
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
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entity Inner circle Canada 5060 Posts |
Slim: If you'd stop blathering long enough to read what other people have to say, you'd see I've answered your question several posts back.
...and I thought that one of the knocks against Randi by you guys was that he set himself up as judge and jury. Look at the above post to see real hypocracy at work. The big lie technique, over and over by you, Slim. Say it loud enough and often enough, and perhaps some people will start to believe you. I actually give people credit for being smarter than that. - entity
email: tomebaxter@icloud.com
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Tony Iacoviello Eternal Order 13151 Posts |
Entity:
As psychic entertainers, I guess we all look alike, but: The judge, jury, and executions thing was mine. Slim has always been in the background screaming, "Off with their heads." I think his favorite card is the Queem of Hearts. And Jack, Well, he is the other guy. (Ever hear of Jack the Giant Killer?) Tony |
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chichi711 Inner circle 5810 Posts |
Quote:
On 2006-02-06 14:04, TonyEye wrote: Do I have a full time Job? Yes. Do I perform Magic and get paid well do to so? Yes. I have three shows this week. I have not lost one cent as a result of exposure. Could I try and go full time to support my family. Yes. Do I want too? No I don't. I like my full time job it is flexible and I make good money doing it, so I have no need to "run my own business". Posted: Feb 6, 2006 3:04pm I see where you are coming from Slim and Tony. I don't ever want any magician to lose money. I wish we all could be filthy rich by doing what we love. I am not a supporter of exposure by any means. I am just saying overall I wouldn't think you are losing money or shows as a result of Randi. Now if you have a little store somewhere that says "palm reading" or "fortune teller". And you are robbing people out of there hard earned money then yes Randi will take cash from you, which I don't call these people magicians, so I don't feel bad about that. |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21245 Posts |
Tony I work only perfomring magic.
so do Penn and Teller, and many other of Randi supporters. (I am neither a supporter or detractor) You are talking about if Randi hurts your bottom line as is J ack. Isn't that a little selfish. The arguement is if it hurts magic in general right? That can be argued, but you and J ack are personally mad because it seems to hurt you in the bank book. I am not saying either point has merrit or does not have merrit, BUT can you see the difference? Would you and J ack rather have no exposure, to the detriment of innocent people? Should others be ignorant so you can profit? Again selfish in the extreme. And like I said Darwin exposes, Bob Arnot exposes, many many many magicians and mentalists do gambling routines to expose, Ricky Jay for example. Exposure VS education is really the line. It is a fine line.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Slim King Eternal Order Orlando 18031 Posts |
Sorry Entity, I was wrong, I did miss your post.
You said: Answer: I don't know. I've only been around a few of those years. I haven't seen one, and I've been looking for one for about 35 years. I suppose "The Big Bang" if one believes the theory, comes as close as anything to a "Supernatural Event", although if, in the end it is a part of nature, then it is hardly "supernatural", is it? Now, how does that help in a discussion of the merits and accomplishments of James Randi? - entity How convienient...I DON'T KNOW. Then a stupid disclaimer....Anything that happens can't be Supernatural, since it happened, naturally. Boy...some deep thinking there. What a crock! Just like you guys, Randi included.....With the presupposition that anything that happens is "Natural" then there never can be anything "Supernatural"... Get the problem with this catch 22 thinking?
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21245 Posts |
Another wordsmith in our presance.
Slim can you prove it yes or no? Wait never ask a mentalist a direct question. Soooorrryyyyy
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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