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mook
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Quote:
On 2006-03-11 13:22, Unknown419 wrote:
You know Abracadizzle might just be Sal critiquing what ya’ll may be saying about his video and just happened to lose it (went out of his mind) when he thought someone was saying something about whatever?


"went out of his mind?!" If that's not speaking evil of another, I don't know what is. I think that remark is "TOO STRONG". Or maybe I DO need that Reading Comprehension 101 course. Can someone please send me a link?

I'm not perfect either. But just like those of you with close friends, I stand up for mine when someone trashes them, especially when they're wrong. I wish I could just sit back and read, but it's just not in the fiber of my being (just like Abracadizzle and Card Cheat). And besides, this thread wouldn't be 4+ pages with so much comedic value. I'm enjoying myself and hope that all of you are too.

PEACE AND GOD'S LOVE TO YOU, DOC.
mook
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Quote:
On 2006-03-12 22:58, rannie wrote:
Mook,

Kindly tell Sal That The Boss aka The Manila Enforcer sends his regards. I enjoyed his DVD and I'm looking foreward to do business in Manila. I emailed him. I know he is pretty busy as of late , but please send him my message.

Thanks,

Rannie


Sorry, Boss. Just had to speak my mind. I'll pass your message along when I talk to him.
tommy
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CC

Quote:
On 2006-03-12 01:43, card cheat wrote:


Why peek if you can stack?

Well, let's say that I spot a pair of Jacks and stack them up for the cutter. After I deal the cards, I get the signal from my man that he got pocket Js. Now, my job, is to see if I can get another Jack to hit the board (preferably the flop.) This is why I would peek even though I can stack. Someone as "knowledgeable" and as "experienced" as yourself already knew that though, and I am sure that this is why you asked the brilliant question that you did. Let's answer your other brilliant questions.

CC



Extravagant is another word that springs to mind: When you peek the top card looking to see if it is a Jack before the flop you are taking a risk of being caught cheating using that peek, that much is stating the obvious. However: Has it occurred to you, that 96% of the time you take that risk for nothing? You will be risking making that peek about 25 times before it does you any good. Only 4% of the time you see a Jack. The other 96% the time the top card will be insignificant cards that might just as well have been bunt without peeking them.
Much the same can be said if your still doing peeks looking for a Jack before the Turn or River. Peeking burn cards is risky and having to peek one 25 times on average before it does you any good, is just too extravagant.

And stacking is one thing but doing it without arousing suspicion is another.

And dealing seconds at the wrong moment, when all the heat is on cards before Flop or Turn or River is not good.

Anyway I think you must have bribed the previous examiner. Smile
But any one making this play gets 100% in the nerve category.

Later

Tommy
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
J Wessmiller
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Tommy,
Even if it's not a Jack, you benefit by knowing that you aren't burning a card you need -and how many more are in the deck (in that scenario). CC was just giving the basics of it. When you are dealt your two cards you can look for flushes or straight possibilities on the top, second from top, or bottom by glimpsing. And if CC is playing with college guys he never has to be worried about getting caught glimpsing. These kids think they have what it takes to be a pro, and the easiest sucker is one that thinks he knows everything. They have no patience and look immediately at their cards when they are dealt, and here you can glimpse away with almost no risk.
be well,
JW
Think you know Erdnase? Take my quiz

http://wessmiller.blogspot.com
KaydoWhoa
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Tisk tisk
bishthemagish
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Speaking as just a magician that has never cheated in a casino. I find this thread very interesting. What I also find interesting is the judgments and the banter between people that use a screen name and the way that it is judged that one can tell if one is a fake cheater or not just from the way things are posted in a magic forum.

This thread is quite a drama as it continues.

The interesting thing in magic is that there IS a lot of card guys with over the top opinions about themselves and others. Having listened to a lot of stories from a lot of magicians over the years with larger than life personalities. And some of them believed their own publicity I have this to say.

I have met up with a lot of magicians that do great card work some older and some younger. I have also met some magicians that could have advantage played in a real game of cards if they wanted to. I have met magicians that did and some card sharps that did over the years.

What I have learned that there are people in this big card world of ours that are always ready to challenge and argue little points - for some reason. In fact last week I was e-mailed an e-mail from a very well known magician who is sort of this guy that has hung out with card sharps. May have cheated in card games etc. I have met many magicians that play this part. Now he is an older card man that to my knowledge has great skill in the cheating moves but has never published a book and from what I have read that he has written - he has a larger than life personality as many older magicians seem to have.

This one told me that my magic knowledge was good but my cheating methods would not work in the real world.

I found that really funny because he does not tell me what real world cheating is. But talks about a friend on the genii forum as to say that he could stack holdem in tournament play and talks about casino cheating.

I find this sort of thing amusing as to how my technique that I used for magic at this time in my life would be judged for real world cheating. As I have said over and over again in the forums that if one would cheat in a casino and get caught it is a felony in the USA. So, to cheat in the casino or as this magician said in his real world of casino cheating - it is useless info as far as I am concerned. Because I have never played cards in a casino and I never will.

Also in the genii forum this person talked about how the Erdnase kind of games were sort of small time cheating. Well to me in the small time games cheating happens more often than his casino real world cheating does. To me the small time cheating is the real world of cheating.

Again as I have said over and over in forums that I do not recommend cheating. Cheating has a risk of getting caught. In a casino it could be a felony record. In the smaller home games - who knows?

But what I find interesting is that there is always people out there in magic and in the card world that are going to make a judgment about who could do it. Who is the real deal. And if so and so's moves will or could fly in a real game.

The whole thing is rather silly to me.
Glenn Bishop Cardician

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Publisher of Glenn Bishop's Ace Cutting And Block Transfer Triumphs
Expertmagician
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Glenn,

Interesting thoughts....I also find it interesting that people would even admit that they have cheated in the real world.

I know that I would NEVER admit, nor deny my actions in my current or previous life. I am much happier being thought of as a person who is low key and to have people underestimate any skills which I may or may not have. Maybe I'm just lucky if I play cards for fun or money Smile

My ego does not need that kind of stroking. I know my strong and weak points and don't look to have them verified. Even though an objective viewing by my friends, camera and mirror are useful.

Bottom line: I appreciate all posted thoughts about gambling and cheating whether they may or may not work in the "real world" or just for magic. And I enjoy contributing to discussions. However, it will be up to me to decide where and when each move, strategy, technique and subtlety is appropriate.

That is my 2 cents for what it is worth.... Smile
Long Island,

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Quote:
On 2006-03-13 13:40, Expertmagician wrote:

I know that I would NEVER admit, nor deny my actions in my current or previous life.


I agree with the never admitting. But I disagree with never denying. As a matter of fact I think you should always deny everything. Just on general principles.

Vandy
"Get a life dude." -some guy in a magic forum
Unknown419
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Quote:
On 2006-03-11 13:22, Unknown419 wrote:
You know Abracadizzle might just be Sal critiquing what ya’ll may be saying about his video and just happened to lose it (went out of his mind) when he thought someone was saying something about whatever?


Quote:
"went out of his mind?!" If that's not speaking evil of another, I don't know what is. I think that remark is "TOO STRONG". Or maybe I DO need that Reading Comprehension 101 course. Can someone please send me a link?

I'm not perfect either. But just like those of you with close friends, I stand up for mine when someone trashes them, especially when they're wrong.


Might. 1. past tense of may. 2. an auxiliary with present or future sense, generally equivalent to may in meaning and use, expressing especially a shade of doubt or a smaller degree of possibility (e.g., it might rain) or permission (e.g., might I go).

May, v.; might, b) possibility or likelihood; as it may rain

Quote:
"went out of his mind?!" If that's not speaking evil of another, I don't know what is.


You’re twisting my words just like those who twist the scriptures and “you don’t know what is.” WENT OUT OF HIS MIND is used interchangeably with WENT OFF. I write 10 things that show that I was drawing a conclusion, I was guessing, might just be etc. while giving the dictionary meanings and you’re still knit-picking about “went out of his mind.” Here is what I wrote…next time don’t delete what I meant.

Quote:
You know Abracadizzle might just be Sal critiquing what ya’ll may be saying about his video and just happened to lose it (WENT OUT OF HIS MIND) when he thought someone was saying something about whatever? Do you remember when Andrew WENT OFF on my thread WITH HIS KNOWLEDGE…that was great. You know what? I DID TOO when I was confronted on MY PUNCH KNOWLEDGE and guess what no one besides who I taught still haven't answered those questions.


I clearly clarified what I meant by this here statement by giving examples when I said that Andrew W. went off (went out of his mind) on my thread (meaning declaring his skills and knowledge) and that I did too (went out of my mind/went off) regarding someone questioning my punch knowledge (meaning declaring my skills and knowledge).

Likewise I was stating that this individual who I believed to be Sal went off, went out of his mind and started declaring his knowledge and that he spoke TOO STRONG meaning showing one in authority or that he knew what he was talking about.

Quote:
1. First off your words are too and I mean TOO STRONG (meaning one in an authoritative position), THIS MEANS TO ME THAT YOU ARE AN INDIVIDUAL WHO REALLY KNOWS WHAT HE (IS) TALKING ABOUT and can do what he says he can do.


I clearly clarified what I meant by this here statement by giving my meaning.

Misquoting Can Lead To Disaster

I love God but hate the Devil. (Now let me delete part of this sentence).
I love…the Devil. (This person did not say that they love the Devil but by deleting important text can lead someone to believe a lie; a lie?…Hold on definition time again).

Bearing False Witness. This commandment may be transgressed (by) Whoever tampers in any way with the exact truth, in order to gain personal advantage or for any other purpose, is guilty of bearing “false witness.” The suppression of truth that might result in injury to oneself or others…this too is bearing “false witness.” {7th Day Adventist Bible Commentary Gen. To Deu. Page 607}

Mook you deleted pertinent things regarding my statement that made you try to have a personal advantage in this disagreement…suppression (a) to prevent information or evidence from becoming known, or written material from being published. b) to resist particular thought or feelings consciously as they arise, and try to banish them from the mind) of truth that might result in injury to…others.

You read and quote what you want which is wrong and this is exactly why I said reading comprehension 101 is definitely necessary because I gave you my meaning and definition right beside what I wrote and you still failed to comprehend what I was saying.

Don’t let me have to bring out my Dunce Cap again?

Quote:
I'm not perfect either. But just like those of you with close friends, I stand up for mine when someone trashes them, especially when they're wrong.


You may be a friend but I’ve seen many incidents and in movies when a knuckle-head (a not too educated or smart guy) stood up for the boss and the boss (the intelligent one) told him to sit down (for whatever reason).

You stood up for Sal but Sal didn’t need anyone to stand up for him because nothing was said to or about him. Abracadizzle has vindicated Sal’s integrity (the quality of possessing and steadfastly adhering to high moral principles or professional standards) and clarified my wrong conclusion when he stated that he was not Sal; and I openly admitted to Andrei that I was wrong about my conclusion and asked Mike for help.

Quote:
Hmmm. Peculiar... I recall on another thread that you said Sal took the easy way out and went to work for the casinos. One might infer from that, that you meant Sal isn't street. Or maybe I'm just "reading between the lines..."


Hmmm. You and anyone else can infer if you want to, I said what I said and I stand by it. I said Sal is street…what about this you don’t understand? Did not Abracadizzle say that Sal might just drive to your house? So what is this telling you? He’s street confirming what I just said.

Taking the Easy Way Out

Sal took the easy way out…I said it and still stand by my words. Sal knows the pressure of being in the streets and told me straight out when I was at his house that “what I do is much more dangerous than what he’s doing.” Now since you talk to him a couple of times a week call him and ask him did he tell me that?

Readers the streets are not a nice place to be and to be honest with you I don’t want to be in the streets either especially playing with black drug dealers etc. it’s just too dangerous. Now I’m not saying that playing with the whites is much different but I felt more at ease playing with them than my own race.

A Short Story

I was just in Detroit for the Super Bowl Game and a guy that we were playing dice with (my friend who’s a dice hustler was losing about $9,000 at this time because he didn’t practice his dice shot that I know he can do) said after seeing about 7 – 8 different thugs in this strip club after it was closed said “Yo, if you want this money just take it but don’t take my life.”

Those were some powerful words that went right through me and I know that those guys were going to stick him up because the guys told me and the girls who weren’t playing to leave because something was about to go down. I couldn’t leave because I was riding with the dice shooter and the girls and the dice shooter who was still playing didn’t know what was about to go down.

After we all left (walking fast) to our car and SUV I was extremely happy to get into the SUV. I don’t know what happened after that but while going back to my friend (dice shooters) cousin’s house the driver who I don’t know got out of the SUV, went to the back of the truck and pulled out a sub-machine gun and took it back to a house and then came back out and drove us back to my friend cousin’s house. Now do you really think that I would have gotten in that SUV if I knew that? Yes. Why? Because I had no other way home in a town that I knew nothing about. I just have to thank God that police officers didn’t pull us over for anything.

Back To Reality

You think that I want to be in the streets? Hell no I don’t, I want to be in Sal’s position but I’m not. I said that to say this I WISH that I could be in Sal’s position. Sal’s road is not all that easy either but it’s definitely easier than mine.

Quote:
PEACE AND GOD'S LOVE TO YOU, DOC.


Nothing More Need Be Said Except may PEACE AND GOD’S LOVE BE TO YOU ALSO AND YOUR FAMILY.

Signed

Still Your Friend

The Doctor
bishthemagish
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Quote:
On 2006-03-11 13:22, Unknown419 wrote:
P.S. Doc why do you sometimes call yourself a fellow student? Because as long as you’re a student YOUR TEACHABLE AND YOU HAVEN’T CLOSED YOUR MIND TO LEARNING NEW THINGS.

I would like to start off with this conversation about this thread by summing up my last post with what Doc said above. Because I feel the same way about card magic, card work and magic in general as Doc said this above about cheating. I make no claim at being an expert in casino cheating, advantage playing or even magic. I am just a student and what I have to say is linked to my own personal experience about these things.

One of the reason's I found the e-mail that I got that I mentioned above so interesting is that I sent this guy 2 sets of my DVD's one to give to a friend of mine that he knows and I have lost touch with and one just because I thought he might enjoy it. Please understand that I don't consider what he said about me as an insult in any way just an observation of the truth. My Stuff on my DVD projects are me using ideas that were used in card sharking like the punch and then using it as a magician would do it to do card sharp demonstrations.

I think that he might have mistook the punch DVD as a way to cheat instead of a teaching a magic use of the punch.

I understand that Sal's DVD is teaching about cheating and how people cheat but my DVD is taking a cheaters tool and then using it for magic and demonstration card sharp magic routines. That is the difference. To use the ideas on the punch DVD for cheating the moves would have to be modified so they would work at the gaming table.

I demonstrate how to deal seconds with the grip that I learned in one of the Mickey McDoogle books card mastery. With tips from Jack Pyle. The grip is a good way to deal seconds for a magician but it would be a tell if used at the cheating table.

The funny thing about all this is that I do not really care if the moves work at the card table because I do not play cards. And what I do works very well in shows and that is what I use it for. If the info were to be used for cheating it would have to be modified as all moves need when they change the use and the venue of which they were originally designed to work.

The other funny thing is that we have in this big card world of ours people like card cheats that say things about magicians - being bedroom cheaters we have magicians saying magicians are bedroom cheaters.

I find that interesting because to me it has little to do with doing shows and more about the ego of the other guy.

Expertmagician and Vandy sum it up when they say they don't tell the world if they have moved in a real game or not. Jack Pyle said it this way - "I have always made my living with a deck of cards - ONE WAY OR ANOTHER"!

Just some thoughts.
Glenn Bishop Cardician

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Publisher of Glenn Bishop's Ace Cutting And Block Transfer Triumphs
The Dowser
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Holey Smokes ! ... I step away from the computer for a few days and look what I miss !
I'm sorry I wasn't in the middle of it ( how exciting if not just a little unfortunate for those involved ) . I will now throw in my two cents even though I fear everyone is now "spent" !
Mook : In my opinion , since you are " tight " with Sal , it is perfectly respectable for you to voice your opinions here especially since you do not hide your association with him . However I also believe that pretending to be someone else in order to comment on or inspire discussion of your own work ( especially when presenting forcefull and passionate arguements ) is far less respectable ... and for that reason I am very sorry that you had to defend against such allegations on your own . For what ever measure of credibility it is worth I can say that I know both Sal (whom I can't seem to get interested in this or any other forum) and Mook personally . They are two quite seperate people with very FUNDAMENTAL differences . I realize that after both Mook and Abracadizzle ( whom I haven't the faintest idea about ) answered the "question" that it was not pursued further but I didn't want Mook's integrity to go without witness .
Having said all that , this thread is loaded with quick trigger fingers :
First Card Cheat's initial remarks were meant to be helpful and I believe the reference to the less than obvious search function was a statement of circumstance rather than an address on how lazy or ignorant Mr. Dizzle was .
Then, I believe from what I've read , that Doc thought he was doing a favour for his friend Sal when he made his mistake because Mr. Dizzle said " I will leave it to others to straighten you out " (may not be exact words as I am too lazy to go back to check) . I believe Doc took this as a hint and attempted to back up Mr. Dizzle by sharing that he was someone " who knows " i.e. Sal .
In both the above situations it is easy to see how anyone ( used to the goings on of this forum ) may have jumped to defensive conclusions and counter-attacking to inspire the defensive attitudes of the original innocents who were only trying to help .
Hey we're all human (regardless of any alleged superhuman skills and abilities) and I must say about this thread what someone once said about the Professer : ... I wouldn't accept a million dollars never to have read it , but I'll pay a million never to read another like it . ( paraprased of course and no promise of actual payment intended )
As for the irrelevant attack on Card Cheats integrity (or anyone elses for that matter)...at the very least this is the subject of another thread , but more likely is not appropriate at all unless specific claims relevant to the topic are being challenged .
I have a confession to make :
My user name says Dowser but I have no idea how to find water (or oil) with a forked stick or two copper wires ... (ace rich slugs , maybe) .
Get it ?
Dowser
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Here we go again....

CC
tommy
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Heigh-ho, Heigh-ho
Heigh-ho, Heigh-ho
Heigh-ho



The wicked Queen had no sooner reached home than she went to her mirror, and said-

"Mirror, mirror upon the wall, Who is the fairest fair of all?"
And the mirror answered as before-

"O Lady Queen, though fair ye be, Snow-White is fairer far to see. Over the hills and far away, She dwells with seven dwarfs to-day."
The blood rushed to her face as she heard these words, for she knew that Snow-White must have come to life again.

"But I will manage to put an end to her yet," she said, and then, by means of her magic, she made a poisonous comb.

:)
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
KaydoWhoa
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Maybe you guys should take this somewhere else and quit puttin Sal's name on a little girl's hair pulling match..really
tommy
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Kaydo

That is what I said. Smile
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
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I think, as I have said before, that this thread never had anything to do with Sal. Not as far as my involvement in it was concerned, anyway.

While I have never seen any of Sal's work, I have heard nothing but nice things about him.

For the Record,
CC
bishthemagish
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To sum it up on this big old card world of ours we have - Card Cheats that say magicians are bedroom cheaters and don't have the nerve to move in a real game. We have magicians (bed room cheats) calling other magicians - bedroom cheats and say that some magicians moves won't work in a real game or "Real World Cheating".

And to top it off we have bed room cheats calling others bed room cheats and say that others don't have what it takes to move in a real game or real world cheating.

It is always about the ego of the other guy! Isn't life funny?

Just some thoughts.
Glenn Bishop Cardician

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Publisher of Glenn Bishop's Ace Cutting And Block Transfer Triumphs
Silly Walter the Polar Bear
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Quote:
On 2006-03-13 01:40, mook wrote:
Quote:
On 2006-03-12 22:58, rannie wrote:
Mook,

Kindly tell Sal That The Boss aka The Manila Enforcer sends his regards. I enjoyed his DVD and I'm looking foreward to do business in Manila. I emailed him. I know he is pretty busy as of late , but please send him my message.

Thanks,

Rannie


Sorry, Boss. Just had to speak my mind. I'll pass your message along when I talk to him.


Does Sal know Fernando Keops and have the two of them ever thought of teaming up? I think that would be awesome. I heard that Sal invented the English language and then invented the Japanese language just so he could translate it back in to English.
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What in the hell are you talking about Silly Walter?
To the others,
I love it when people talk trash and then try to sugarcoat it later. Why don't say what you mean and then stick with it?
Sal's a friend of mine, some of you guys (and you know who you are) are not, and I don't know you all that well. In fact who would want too? Pompous, arrogant, and petty. These are the words that come to mind.
If you havent said anything against my friend, then this isn't for you. But if you have been talking trash, well stay tuned kids because sooner or later things always come back to get ya.
I am truly blessed to have a job where people are laughing all the time and everyone believes in magic....Come to think of it, I'm blessed to even have a job.
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That's so awesome that you are friends with Sal. Sal Piacenta is the only person that ever defeated a brick wall in tennis.
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