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Jim Poor Special user Fairfax, VA 676 Posts |
I don't have one yet, but I'm wondering if I could set it up ahead of time, put a "table cloth" over it and use it to perform a few effects like PB&J on during the show.
Then remove the cloth and do the suspension as the finale. Thoughts? Thanks Jim |
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Great Wally New user 37 Posts |
On the suspension which I own, the surface is padded and, therefore, not perfectly flat. If you are doing a show, you want props to be reliable - predictable - confident in how they respond. I guess my main point is that a suspension is ok for resting props on prior to use, but is not really suitable as a performance surface.
Regards, Vince. |
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Vince raises one issue. That of which most chair suspenesions have a cloth that covers he board. This then causes the cloth to move forward and backward on the board. It may not be such a problem for you, but something you will want to consider.
The greater issue is that of making sue the non anchor chair and the board resting on it, does not shift forward or backwards. If it does, it can shift a bit too much cause it to not rest on the chair and this can cause the board to fall or sag under any weight placed on it. I have placed my polaroid camera on it during the show and such and that has never been an issue. I have just not tried using it as a table for a performance. It might be feasable, but there are concerns one must check and look into first. I hope some of these thoughts will be of help to you. Kyle
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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todsky Inner circle www.magicstore.ca 2354 Posts |
Jim, I often use my chair suspension to keep all my magic props on, and when all the props have been used, I finish the show with the suspension. Nice and compact set-up. I've never had any trouble with props moving around or falling off. I put the props on the 'blanket' that is already covering the board.
Todsky's Magic Shop: over 15,000 tricks, books, DVD s and Card decks. www.magicstore.ca
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
I think it can be done as long as you are careful with what you do and are aware of the way the chairs are set up. I have done it to a certain extent and it has worked out ok. Just be aware of how the board rests on the other chair, and you should be ok.
Kyle
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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Amazing Magic Co Inner circle 1712 Posts |
I use mine the same as Todsky. My chair suspesion holds all of my props. As they are used, each prop returns to my suitcase table or off to the side. By the end, all that is left is the chair suspension which serves as the finale.
Dan. |
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Dennis Michael Inner circle Southern, NJ 5821 Posts |
I often use mine as a table since I am a proppy guy.
Dennis Michael
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Yeah Den is so proppy we need a prop just to prop him up after bringing everything in. hehehe Just teasing ya Den. It's all good my friend. =)
Kyle
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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MagicRabbit Regular user 176 Posts |
I thought one of the strong points of the illusion was putting it together in front of the audience just before floating someone.
Doesn't that help convince them that there is only one board and not 2? |
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todsky Inner circle www.magicstore.ca 2354 Posts |
Good point, Magic Rabbit. I've thought about that, but what I do for now is to take it apart right after I take my final bow. But I suspect you may be right about assembling it before performing it. Any thoughts about this, anyone?
Todsky's Magic Shop: over 15,000 tricks, books, DVD s and Card decks. www.magicstore.ca
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Great Wally New user 37 Posts |
You need to be 100% certain that everything has been assembled correctly and then rechecked. I don't think you can be that thorough if you are being watched. I also like to dismantle without any witnesses as I don't want to "spoil the illusion."
Regards, Vince. |
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Vince brings up a very good point in which I cover off on a bit in the ebook on the chair suspension. If you are setting it up as part of the show, then you still MUST go through your safety checks to make absolutely sure that certain things are set in place the way they need to be. It can not be just a matter of you setting up chairs and dropping the board on top. You must be certain everything is right.
I always set up my chair suspension ahead of time and do a double check befor ethe show starts and recheck it before I am about to finish the show with the illusion performance. In this way, I have proper time to be able to set things right, check angles and make sure the chairs are resting properly etc. I can go through all my steps with out being rushed to do so. I also do not feel that I have to set up the chairs and such with the audience watching just to prove anyting to them. I think that is too much of an issue of us magicians overhtinking things more then we need to. It is almost like proving something that does not really have to be proved at all. If the chairs are performed corrctly, no one should ever suspect a second (prop) as part of the illusion. In regards to using it as a performance surface, one can do this if one is conscious of how the illusion is set up. If you know that the board can pivot and move forward and backwards, you can make sure to minimize this movement if using it as a table in your show. Also, if used as a table, you still want to keep in mind your overall weight you are placing on it and make sure you place your heavier props up towards the one certain chair. This will help distribute the weight out better for you and you run less risk of any problems. Hope this helps. Kyle
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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MagicRabbit Regular user 176 Posts |
Huh?
The version I have is so easy an idiot could do it. I know, because I can do it. Have performed it hundreds of times setting it up AT THAT MOMENT & without fail. The dismantle is nothing for me too. It's flawless. Maybe we have different versions? I contend that some kids will "guess" that there is another board unless you put it together in front of them. I know because the one time I decided to have it all set up was the only time they yelled, "there's another board in there!" Smart little boogers. |
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Jim Poor Special user Fairfax, VA 676 Posts |
Wow, thanks for all the replies. I would only be using it for PB&J and martian Rabbit Eggs. Not much weight to think of. Moving the thing around and causing the board to pivot is a concern though.
Thanks again Jim |
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
It is not a matter of how easy it is to set up. It is a matter of making sure it is set up properly. There in lies the difference. I too can set mine up blindfolded. However, since a child from the audience is going on this thing, I have to be absolutely sure that everything is set right. This means doing a few safety checks first. In this way it is much easier to set it up ahead of time to make sure everything is set correctly.
I have seen way too many magicians perform the illusion and set it up on stage and are in so much of a rush to just perform the thing that they become careless of the safety elements. They tend to perform the illusion for themselves and NOT for their audiences. You can never let your love for an effect overcome your own common sense. So yes, it can be set up in front of an audience. I just choose to set it up before hand so that I can be comfortable in knowing everything is correct and the way it needs to be. I have performed this illusion probably more times then any other effect I do and feature it in all my shows as well as all my festival shows through out our festival season. I have never had a single child or person ever question or say anything about a second board at all. It is in the way you present it and the way you work the routine that can make sure this never happens. Just my opinion is all. Kyle
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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MagicRabbit Regular user 176 Posts |
And your opinion is well respected by me and many others here.
I can only tell you what I know. There is only one way to attach mine, yours may be different. My suspension is overly-simple to put together, yours may be different. What do you mean Rush? My way takes about 10-15 minutes to perform this illusion. Any longer and I would have to wake them up for the actual suspension. And what do you mean you safety test it? Do you put your wife up there first to see if she takes a header into the chair? I attach it in front of the audience and press down on the board as a double check. What else is there to do? It's not a thermo-nuclear reactor. I admit it is important to know that it WORKS, but to me, setting it up beforehand does nothing to prove that it will work when the little floatee gets up there. I am not convinced that I have done anything wrong in the last 200 performances of this illusion. And by the way- they don't always say with their mouth what they think of your illusion. They might very well believe you have something else under that cloth. Putting it together from the beginning, to me, clearly shows it is one piece, obviously one board under the cloth. I have the cloth wrapped tightly around the board when I bring it out, the anchor chair is setting at just the right angle to invisibly put it together. Taking it apart afterward helps the appearance as well. I'm not trying to sell you on my way, I just don't get the whole Inspector Gadget bit about setting it up beforehand? |
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Great Wally New user 37 Posts |
In the U.K. we have an expression: 'Better to be safe than sorry.'
Regards, Vince. |
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todsky Inner circle www.magicstore.ca 2354 Posts |
I don't think there should be any problem setting it up in front of the audience, as far as safety checks go. The board does indeed clamp quite simply onto the chair, and it's just a simple matter of making sure it's firmly in place, which shouldn't take more than three seconds to confirm. I think I have to agree with MagicRabbit that the effect will present itself more strongly this way. In fact, I have had children on several occasions guess there's a second board, and I suspect they might not have thought that if I assembled the chair in front of them.
For me it's not a safety issue to assemble it in front of the audience; it's more a convenience issue (a place to already have my props, and not having to bother with the set-up in front of the audience and worrying about flashing the gimmick). However, I am going to try setting it up in front of the audience next time I perform this one, and see how that goes. Always good to experiment with new ideas.
Todsky's Magic Shop: over 15,000 tricks, books, DVD s and Card decks. www.magicstore.ca
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
It is great that we can agree to disagree. I do respect your comments and your opinion and I thank you for writing your thoughts here. Let me try and dive deeper into what I mean and answer some of the questions you have asked.
First off, there are many different ways in which someone can perform this illusion. There are also many diffferent presentations and set ups. I am only expressing what I know to have worked the best for me and for others that I have taught over time. In most chair suspensions (not sure which version you have) there is actually several ways to attach it. Now this may seem bizarre and dumb to you or others, but you could mistakingly attach the board and gimmick to the wrong chair. I have seen it happen. Also, in haste your attachment could not be lined up properly on the correct chaircausing the illusion to be non-balanced and the link-up to be off. Ther also is the fact that the chairs should and need to be open and flat and resting on a sound surface. These are just a few of many ways in which the illusion should be properly set up and someone (in haste) might overlook these items. In regards to rushing, I am refering only to the initial settting upof the prop and not the overall routine or presentation itself. If I was doing this and setting it up as part of my show (which I used to do a long while back) then I would still have to add in the safety ideas and checks as part of my routine. My safety checks are as follows: - I check the stage area and make sure that if I am on a platform stage or a plank style stage, that the chairs are not positioned on to two diferent sections. If they are, these styl;e of stages tend to separate a bit during performance and this can cause problems. Because I work a lot of festivals, I run into stages all of types of construction. - I check for a level surface. The chairs must be sitting level and knock rocking back and forth. their must be a firm, solid and level surface areas for the chairs to rest on. - I examine the chairs briefly just to make sure everything looks good and that thereis no noticeable wear or cracks in the welds or any partof the chairs. I want to be certain that everything still looks good and in working order. - I then set up the chairs and make sure they are open all the way. I pressdown on them a bit to make sure they do not rock. - I then attach the board to the chairs and double check my hook up to make sure it is aligned as it should be. - I then go over to the other chair and align the board on it so it is resting properly and check my alignment. I press down lightly on the baord to make sure everything is sound and no major movement of the board or chairs is taking place. - I then check my hook up of the two boards to make sure that is aligned and ionserted correctly and that the cloth is not covering this area up that is may interfere during performance. - I then check my cloth and properly position that This is all done before the show starts. During the show and performance, I will glance at the hook up again and just visually make sure my anchorage alignment is still properly in place and nothing has shifted. This is my double check. Now I am not saying that a person can not set it up as part of the routine. You can do this, but you just have to keep safety and such in mind if you are going to perform it this way and make sure that is included as part of your presentation. Overall, any time you are placing a person or a child on an illusion that can potentially risk their helath to any degree, one must keep that always in the forfront of their minds. Kyle
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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Christopher Special user 531 Posts |
I always used mine this way. In fact, I had the cloth stitched with my logo, name, and contact info. This way it appeared to be part of my "table" and also worked to advertise the show.
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