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Katterfel22 Regular user Greenville, NC 130 Posts |
This may not be the right place for this post. If it is not please forgive.
I was watching "Big Trouble in Little China" the other night. Near the beginning of the film there is an interview b/t a chinese mage and a police officer. The officer asks him what he means by magic. The chinese man holds his palms about a foot apart and electricity sparks b/t them. He tells the officer " That was nothing but that is how it always starts ...very small." I thought how impressive it would be to start an act, say in a parlor type atmosphere with this kind of effect. I have asked around but no one has any idea how you would do this type of effect without some kind of bulky device. I was wondering if anyone here had ever heard of the effect done in this context and if so, could they direct me towards the information on it.
Cave ab homine unius libri - Latin epigram
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weepinwil Inner circle USA 3828 Posts |
I think the operative word here is 'film' and not live. Many years ago, I knew a rock band that wanted a 'bolt of lightning' effect but none was available for an affordable price. However, my thought is that such a device may exist now. It would have to employ static electricity if you wanted to do it more than once.
Check the lighting shops for professional rock groups.
"Til Death us do part!" - Weepin Willie
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Mystician Inner circle Wallachia 3485 Posts |
There is no way to get electricity to spark across that wide of a gap (with air as the dielectric) without copious amounts of voltage - and current.
The only thing I know that could do that is a tesla coil or jacobs ladder - and trying to do that across your hands would probably result in death. Now, if there was some way to fake it, using light rather than true electricity, that'd be sweet - only I don't know of anything like that, nor any way to do it. The tricky thing is that electric arcs dance and fork about, it's very dynamic, and to get even a rope light or set of LEDs to convincingly mimmick that action is just unheard of, as far as I know - especially if you'd want the gimmick to be essentially "invisible", leaving only the light itself. However, I suppose I would start by looking at electroluminescent wire. Good luck with that !!!
Just hanging out with the rest of my fellow dregs.
http:// www . phrets . com Visit http://www.bizarremagic.net |
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Clifford the Red Inner circle LA, California 1941 Posts |
Quote:
On 2006-04-14 21:50, weepinwil wrote: Not that it hasn't been done before ;-P
"The universe is full of magical things, waiting for our wits to grow sharper." Eden Philpotts
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leapinglizards Inner circle 1263 Posts |
Years ago in the old Ghost Busters show at Universal Florida... They created a convincing effect of lighting coming out of their guns using Pepper's Ghost. Of course transporting a giant sheet of ***ss could get costly.
Leaping Lizards!!! Who knew it was possible.
<BR> <BR>www.LeapingLizardsMagic.com |
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Leland Stone Inner circle 1204 Posts |
If anyone watched "Wild West Tech" on [I think] the History Channel, they might have caught David Carradine doing an enjoyable, laconic interview with a woman who did this type of stunt. This lady was partially dressed in chain mail (to protect her head? To direct conductivity? Memory fails, sorry) and she sat on a some sort of pedestal that she EMPHATICALLY noted ISOLATED her from ground. Then, as Mystician pointed out, she allowed herself to be subjected with massive amounts of electricity. And yes, she created an impressive display of lightning!
Doable? Yep. But only by those eager to enter whatever lies beyond this world, IMO. Leland |
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Psy-Kosh Regular user Michigan 134 Posts |
Okay... yeah, with skin effect (short version is super high frequency won't penetrate as deeply) you can get away with some of this stuff.
Don't do it. At least, don't do it unless and until you understand the physics involved well enough that you _instinctively_ will spot the dangers. ie, that you're automatic reaction to contacting another object may be "uh-oh, capacitive coupling, may shift frequency...." etc... ie, you should know this stuff well enough to _know_ automatically all the ways in which it can go wrong, why it would go wrong, etc etc etc. Otherwise, if you don't have the physics involved completely mastered, I'd seriously advise against trying this sort of thing. But that's just my opinion. |
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Mystician Inner circle Wallachia 3485 Posts |
True, but even with the skin effect, there's still a risk of burns and whatnot.
RADAR was invented (partially) by a guy researchng a way to build Tesla's "Death Ray", after all. BTW, If you wore a kimono or whatever that's called, with the big wide open sleeves, and had a 3 foot forked "pattern" of electroluminescent wire attached to one wrist, with an elastic band on it's other end, and had the whole thing up the sleeve, maybe you could reach over with the other hand, grasp the elastic loop, and quickly extend your arms out, pulling the wire out of the sleeve, simultaneously powering it on with a toe switch or something. Might look close. Or totally silly. Or - I think I like this idea better: Intead of the EL wire, use something highly reflective, like the coating they used on the light sabres in the first Star Wars trilogy; there was optical dubbing later, but still in real life they say it looked pretty good. You would have small portable egg strobes on each wrist, facing in, which would flicker and reflect off the material. Pretty simple, with effective flickering. It might actually look decent from a distance, on a dark stage.
Just hanging out with the rest of my fellow dregs.
http:// www . phrets . com Visit http://www.bizarremagic.net |
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Psy-Kosh Regular user Michigan 134 Posts |
Yeah. But minor burns, well, that wasn't my concern... It was more along the lines of, "see? I'm safe, now I'll just go touch this virtual grou...AAARRRRGGGHHHH"
Hrm... wait... what about this: a lower energy tesla coil (so it won't actually hurt you much), a wire from it through your sleve and so on into your other sleve, and a tiny canister of helium/neon/argon/whatever gas in your sleve. when ready, whatever hidden activator turns the thing on and also starts the gas spraying out... |
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cocomax Loyal user North Fork, CA 289 Posts |
Howabout
A few 10 million candle power lamps up the sleeve along with a 10 foot rope covered in christmas tree tinsel and a heavy duty reel. Have it so that the lamps trigger when the reel starts pulling the rope from hand to hand and the lamps go off when the rope reaches the other hand. It would look weird! The rope would sorta move like an electric arc. Tim |
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Almost Amazing Doug New user Pullman, WA 78 Posts |
Quote:
On 2006-04-16 20:51, Mystician wrote: Mystician, Great idea, but I've tried that material (3M reflective tape and/or glass-beaded paint), and unfortunately it doesn't work in this sort of an application. The light source has to be coming right from the viewer. Now, with hat-mounted strobes for all the spectators it could be fantastic...but would take a lot of audience management skill Doug |
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Psy-Kosh Regular user Michigan 134 Posts |
Quote:
On 2006-04-17 00:01, cocomax wrote: Hrm... That might work... but the bright lightsource itself may be a bit of a giveaway... maybe have the tinsel coated with some UV reactive stuff, and use a UV lamp? |
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Bill Ligon Inner circle A sure sign of a misspent youth: 6437 Posts |
Quote:
On 2006-04-17 00:01, cocomax wrote: If you are going to do this, it would seem easier to simply use a white "rope light," sold around Christmas time, pulled rapidly from sleeve to sleeve with a reel. The flexible plastic tubing would prevent it from catching on anything (like your sleeve), unlike a rope covered with tinsel. You wouldn't need "10 million candle power lamps" up your sleeve, which would get a mite uncomfortable, I think. If you could make the lamps blink (not difficult), it might look even better.
Author of THE HOLY ART: Bizarre Magick From Naljorpa's Cave. NOW IN HARDCOVER! VIEW: <BR>www.lulu.com/content/1399405 ORDER: http://stores.lulu.com/naljorpa
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Bill Ligon Inner circle A sure sign of a misspent youth: 6437 Posts |
Quote:
On 2006-04-16 22:27, Psy-Kosh wrote: Use hydrogen and get a flash effect. Talk about minor burns! --------> Disclaimer: DO NOT do this! It is a joke! <----------
Author of THE HOLY ART: Bizarre Magick From Naljorpa's Cave. NOW IN HARDCOVER! VIEW: <BR>www.lulu.com/content/1399405 ORDER: http://stores.lulu.com/naljorpa
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Psy-Kosh Regular user Michigan 134 Posts |
Well, if we're going to do that, may as well do it right... have a second canister with fluorine...
Disclaimer: Do this even less than the previous. |
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Bill Ligon Inner circle A sure sign of a misspent youth: 6437 Posts |
Myst, I know you shot down rope light above, but I think as the thing flexes as it goes from sleeve to sleeve, it just might imitate to some degree the branching effect of an arc. Gotta try it to see!
Author of THE HOLY ART: Bizarre Magick From Naljorpa's Cave. NOW IN HARDCOVER! VIEW: <BR>www.lulu.com/content/1399405 ORDER: http://stores.lulu.com/naljorpa
<BR>A TASSEL ON THE LUNATIC FRINGE |
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Mystician Inner circle Wallachia 3485 Posts |
Anything's work a shot, Bill !
I had another brain fart: Since the main problem to doing this with real electricity is the nonconductivity of air, let's change the air. Maybe there's something that could be sprayed into the air immediately before a safe electrical discharge, that would allow the current to spark all the way across, jumping from particle to particle; either an atomized solid or liquid of some sort. It would look like electricity, behave like electricity, hey, it would be electricity ! ( Even taste like electricity -- good thing we didn't step in it ! )
Just hanging out with the rest of my fellow dregs.
http:// www . phrets . com Visit http://www.bizarremagic.net |
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The Wizard of Hearts Veteran user Tulsa, Oklahoma 323 Posts |
Let us solve this exercise simply, thus.
FISM flash is in your shirt. The working area rests in a lightproof enclosure (somewhat like a flattened bag), which has a lightning-like design cut out of it, and covered with some sort of transparent plastic tape. I imagine some sort of bright-white gauze could be laid in the bag to help with light dispersal. That way, when the flash flashes, when viewed from the front, a bolt-like flash appears between two appropriately-placed hands. ...that is how it always starts ...very small. |
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Harley Newman Inner circle 5117 Posts |
You're looking at doing a thing from the sideshow tradition, called the electric chair, only probably a higher-powered unit than is generally used. Expect to spend 10K dollars, if you want to throw off bolts a couple of feet long.
Also, don't expect to have them go from hand to hand. That's not how it works. The chain mail mentioned above (though I'd have to see it to be sure) is probably acting as a Faraday cage.
“You can’t depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus” -Mark Twain
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drwilson Inner circle Bar Harbor, ME 2191 Posts |
Harley is right, of course. The chain mail is a Faraday cage to protect the performer from having the current go through, and stop, the heart.
Slymenstra Hyman (Danielle Stampe), formerly of Gwar, has a big Tesla coil and the rigging to do this act. The cost is $20K - $25K. The bolts don't go from hand to hand, but up in the air, as long as the hands are held over the head. If the hands are held below the head, the bolts go up in the air from the top of the head, probably not a great sensation. She sits on a really tall insulating platform. The principal risk here is death. If you did this on stage, and there were grounded pipes in the overhead rigging, a bolt connecting to the overhead pipes would kill you. This has happened to at least one performer of this act, a long time ago. Hey, if you have a credit card with a high limit, check out where she gets her gear: http://www.teslacoil.com/html/frame_page.htm Or, you could work on a different act. Yours, Paul |
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