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Profile of zimsalabim
Now that's interesting indeed. Did the theme park have any complaints about his choices? I also see he was asked back for a second year to do the job. Obviously hes doing somthing right. I'm not sure abu this choices either but you say its a childrens show in a theme park . Perhaps it would be better to call it a family show in a theme park. HOw did the audience respond?

Just curious

Joe Zimmer

"The Second Greatest Magician in the World"

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Bill Nuvo
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That is interesting. I find it an annoyance when customers label me as a children's performer which I am not. I make sure they know I am a family performer and my age group bottom line is 7 years old. Even with certain assurances, one can still be labelled as a children's magician, or be put in the "children's area" (I hate that one).
Red Shadow
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The theme park is targeted for 3-11 year olds, with just 3 rides for the adults.
He was playing the part of the court jester, and started working at the park 11 years ago. He started off serving fries in the restaurant and changed jobs each year. A few years ago, he was taken under the wing of the park magician, who taught him his tricks.
Two years ago, the park magician left and he took over the show.

You could argue that it was suppose to be a family show, but that still requires you to perform for children and it was mainly a children's show audience he had.

I had no idea what the management thought, but as I said; his personality and enthusiasm was top notch and so I doubt they had any complaints. Especially since he was a very long-term employee of the park, who has been with them for years. They probably see him as part of the family and give him lots of freedom to do what he wants.

Its just the tricks he selected were very inappropriate in my opinion.
Bill Nuvo
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Was the audience entertained? I've seen tonnes of children watch fire eaters, sword swallowers and such with no complaints from parents as the parents watch them too (obviously). This is something they enjoy together as a family as opposed going to see SpongeBob on Ice.
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How abot this, I know a guy who uses fire and a whip (yes a whip) in his kids show and thinks it is ok, nothing wrong at all.
Or is it just me?
Mike "Gus" Harvatt
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Profile of solrak29
On 2008-07-30 15:33, Bill Nuvo wrote:
Was the audience entertained?

Here is something I think should of been asked since the first post, if I missed it,
I apologize...but here is the case in point.

If the audience was entertained and saw magic then the show was good. No matter
what you think or say can not take that away from the performer.

Too bad, from our experienced eyes and not from the eyes of laymen, you see a dismal

I try my best to see any show from this point of view rather than from my view...
How is the audience reacting? How does the audience feel? I tend to ask these
question to other spectators who where watching the show to check my self before
I pass judgement on what I just saw.

Grant it, most of your views I read...I can only agree with....
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Kent Wong
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Wow, this is an old thread, but the event still brings back memories. I guess that means the show must have been good since I can't seem to forget it (LOL). As for the audience, there was only tempered, polite applause from the audience near the end of the show. For the most part, all I heard was painful silence. As I recall, three children actually LEFT THE SHOW before it was over.

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Rodney Palmer
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Since this post has been revived I have yet to see the obvious posted. He was hired for 3-years in a row. The audience must have liked him and so did the planners. Also in this day/age some people DO NOT care if you are a Professional or not. I have the Perfect example. For the past 4-years I have performed the Magic Show at our First Night Celebration. For those of you who do not know what that is, it is an alcohol free event for New Years Eve. Back to the story, for 4-years I performed six shows in one day at various times. My Fee was $ 2100.00 for all six shows and I always had a standing room only crowd. However this year they decided on some NEW Talent for the Magic Show. They found a Magician with less than 2-years experience to perform all 6-shows for $ 400.00 total. To put it mildly he was not good at all, but guess what they invited him back for 2009 for the same 6-shows at the same $ 400.00 price. I went to the head person and asked why I was cut and she stated "Rodney, you are a very good, very entertaining magician but we just cannot afford to pay your price" so we found this guy to perform instead of you and at a much cheaper rate. She agreed that he was not good but his price was good. So how do you compete with the z-list magician who does b-day parties for $ 50.00 and I charge $ 200.00 and up. He seems to be getting all of the work. I even had one parent who was a regular customer for years state that all they really need is someone to do a few tricks and they really do not care if he is good or not because his price is right.

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I have to agree with Captkid. Magicians are very poor judges, in most cases, of other magicians. Even on here with out even seeing another persons show I have seen mud slinging. I hate preforming for other magicians. Part of the entertainment value of magic is the not knowing. Its like listening to rock music without instruments. The singing may not be the best and if you are a classical opera singer you will think it's terrible, but add the drums and guitar back in it and the public loves it. I would hope that if my act was not good someone would tell me, I would want to know. But if it was another magician I would want a second opinion.

Being a good magician does not make you a good business person. If you are being undercut or priced out of the market you have three choices to make. Gripe and complain about it, lower your prices or (and this is the one I suggest) find your market. A place where low talent won't come close to cutting it and the pay is on par. Not many people have a Porche although they are great cars. However I see a lot of Fords around that people are happy enough with. Just my 2 cents.
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I once did a show for a friend and the children of a fellow magician were in the gallery and as I bring out tricks, they repeatedly shout on top of their lungs "my dad has that one" and even tell the kids beside them how it's done. The parents were there...yes both the mom and dad are magicians and they never bothered to tell their kids not to do so. I had to bring items I was certain their dad does not have and everytime I perform such trick, I end it with "Your dad does not have that, does he?" which gets a big laugh from the audience. I did feel bad doing that...but well that was years ago and during then I tought the kids got what they deserve, if the parents who are fellow magicians cant even discipline their kids...or at least teach them how to respect a fellow magician when performing, then I really think they got what they deserve.

I trained my kids how to watch a magic show...btw, I have 8 kids Smile They just keep quiet when the magician shows a trick they know and really appreciate seeing stuff they have never seen before. Smile

I admire fellow magicians who know how to teach their kids how to behave as spectators in a magic show.

Now back to the topic:

If this happened in Manila, I would have also kept quiet and left without saying anything. In fact the same thing has happned to me several times in the past...and I did exactly so, I left without saying a word. Not because I don't care but because I think there is a "proper venue" for everything. I may turn out to be the bad guy if I approached him right there and then and told him he *ucks Smile The kid might just feel bad. Eventually, that kid will join our IBM RING (IBM Ring 322 Manila, Magfi) and being one of the founders of the group, that is where he will hear a lot from me... Smile
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Rodney: That is very unfortunate and I'm sorry to hear it happened to you. Some people are going to buy only on price. But if everyone bought only on price, everyone would shop at Wal-mart and no one would shop at Nieman Marcus.

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On 2006-08-29 12:17, magicgeorge wrote:
I can never decide whether bad entertainers make the good ones look good by comparison or wether we all get tarred with the same brush and they're bad news for all of us. I'm afraid it could well be the latter.


If you add mud to water you do not get cleaner mud, you get dirtier water. The latter is what it is.

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Rodney, I hate that happened to you. Been there before. Some people don't care what they get, as long as they can say "magician". Here in the South, sometimes they won't hire you if you're local, either, they figure people are more impressed if the entertainer is from way out of town. We also have some guys nearby who will work for next to nothing..hard to compete when all the customer cares about is price.

Terry Owens
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JLibby, by the way Nieman Marcus sales are way down, but Wal-Mart's is up...lol

I've actually had other performers complain about me charging too much...I told them you charge what you're worth.
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On 2009-02-08 01:42, First Class Magician wrote:
Since this post has been revived I have yet to see the obvious posted. He was hired for 3-years in a row. The audience must have liked him and so did the planners.

Rodney, the original post features this...

On 2006-08-28 15:55, magicman845 wrote:
I did some checking and understand that he has only been into magic for just over a year.

So he wasn't hired for three years in a row. I think you are confusing my post with the original. But since you mentioned it, I will say that I did find something odd about your post. You mention specifically that "He was hired for 3-years in a row. The audience must have liked him and so did the planners." But then immediately after that comment, you tell a story about how you (an accomplished, entertaining performer) lost a gig to another (poorer performer) simply because the price was right.

Seems contradictory, no? You state that since the guy in my example was hired three years in a row, he must have been liked. But in your case, when you lost your gig, you admit that there are other, more important factors in the eyes of a planner trying to save money, than talent and being liked.

Like I said before - if a magician that was randomly selected one year, fits the budget, shows up on time, is not drunk, doesn't swear, and doesn't injure anyone - then they will often get an invite back the next year, because it's easier for the planner to get "the guy they had last year", as opposed to going through the searching process again and taking another chance on a new magician.

My point is that an invite back to an event, year after year, does NOT mean the show is necessarily good. It just means it was at least good enough.
You don't drown by falling in the water;

you drown by staying there.

- Edwin Louis Cole
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