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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Shuffled not Stirred » » Histed Heisted (2 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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BiGGoGiBBo
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Right I have finally had the pleasure of reading through this effect in 'Bound to Please'. Superb, though I doubt I would be doing any Parlour type performances which this effect seems most suited to. I would be more likely to perform this for family and friends and the walking through the crowd handing out cards to spectators wouldn't really work ( my family isn't that large!). To suit my requirements I have been playing with presenting this by dealing out 10 hands of poker and then asking the spectators to pick any two hands. I can then go into the effect as described, but using JanForester idea above of fishing for the card. This has the advantage of being to use the standard stack at the beginning rather than having to set up the 1,11,21 etc stack.
JanForster
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BiggoGibbo, I've performed Histed Heisted in front of 500 people; it's possible, only a question of staging and managing. That's why I (!) read out the cards while having one spectator next to me who can watch the cards also. You should read also Peter Tappan's booklet "The Impostress Princess" which takes a deep look at the underlying principle, presenting many variations and alternative handlings. It helps you to truly understanding the cross-referencing methodology behind all variations. Unfortunately Tappan's booklet is long time out of print and difficult to find. Jan
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Dennis Loomis
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I also recommend the Tappan Book. Pete was one of magic's great thinkers and everything he did was very special.

I also use Histed Heisted for large audiences. It's actually easier in one way. In informal or parlour shows, people are seldom seated in rows and it can be tricky to remember which spectator is number 6, for example. For big shows there are usually straight rows of chairs and you have little problem keeping that aspect of the effect straight. For the right audience it can be your opener and you begin by walking into the audience and distributing the cards. This is unusual and gets people interested in what is going to happen.

If you don't use the 1, 11, 21, etc setup, you're not really doing Histed Heisted. There are lots of variations of the effect and the general title seems to be "The Princess Card Trick." I personally prefer the Louis Histed/Simon Aronson verson which Simon dubbed Histed Heisted, although I have my own way of handling the prediction. Read about it on my website. (Click on the link below and then, on the site, click on the link to Memorized Deck Magic. There are 20+ articles there. Scan the list for the mention of Histed Heisted.

Dennis Loomis
Itinerant Montebank
<BR>http://www.loomismagic.com
Andy Moss
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What patter do people use to fish to the exact card from the two in your mind (assuming that you are using the five pile 1,11,21 set up). Ideally the patter should not appear to others to have led to an 'incorrect' answer.(?)

1)If both cards are black?
2)If one card is red and one card is black?

I have my own techniques like everyone else but would be interested to seek advice from others on this.I do feel that providing someone with a choice of as many as ten cards is the way to go. You could I am thinking adapt the number of piles and number of cards in each pile.Say:-

7x7 utilising 49 playing cards (no fishing involved and allows up to seven spectators).

5x15 utilising 75 tarot cards (fishing down from three cards with up to five spectators. A challenge for the brave memory expert only!).

However in both the above cases it could be argued that the effect then becomes almost impossible to perform in a real life situation due to the onerous memorisation/translation/retention involved.

The 1,11,21 set up with playing/tarot cards with a two card fishing seems to be the best compromise.
JanForster
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Andy, the fishing depends on your stack. I've to fish (reading out each time 10 cards) as I use 5 spectators, each one gets 10 cards, spec. #1 and #2 even 11 cards (#1: 1,6,11,16,21,26,31,36,41,46,51 - a.s.o. #5: 5,10,15,20,25,30,35,40,45,50). You are reading minds, so everything is possible, even improvisation. I have of course for each possibility a script, but I'm leaving it often. It depends also a lot the way you speak, your personal diction. Talk about your impressions, not only red or black, number or picture, odd or even, talk about shapes, draw a picture with your finger a.s.o. watch the reactions carefully. One example: If I have to find out (using the Aronson stack) whether someone is thinking of the 10S or 8C I draw a circle (finger in the air) and state I'm seeing something that looks like a zero, following the reactions of my spectator I will continue saying "with a 1 in front" or "but there are two zeros, one above the other one, it's an eight, right...". I hope you get the idea. Jan
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Andy Moss
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Thanks Jan, that was helpful advice. Your approach to 'feeling' your way forward with respect to fishing is exactly the same as my own way of thinking. While it is useful to learn structure for the fishing,at the same time, it also pays to be flexible and to be able to think on your feet! Any association between the cards can then be exploited. This reminds me a bit of the thinking behind Dai Vernon's 'The trick that cannot be explained' (!)
JanForster
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Andy, thanks... I pm you. Jan
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Dennis Loomis
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Andy,
Jan is talking about his version of Histed Heisted. If you do the original Aronson Version there is no fishing required. That's because you use ten spectators and each one gets five card. When you read the cards in groups of ten and ask people to raise their hand if they heard their card, you know the card selected immediately.

Dennis Loomis
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Dennis Loomis
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I must back track a bit from one of my previous posts. When I said that if you do not use the 1, 11, 21 etc setup you are not doing Histed Heisted. That was correct, but then I should have said that you are doing The Impostress Princess. This is the title which Pete Tappan gave the effect and also the title of his book. It avoids the problem that the term "Princess Card Trick" also applies to a totally different effect which does not use the cross referencing or intersecting sets principal.

Dennis Loomis
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<BR>http://www.loomismagic.com
Andy Moss
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Ah yes I got myself a bit confused for a minute.The original Histed/Aronson effect involves ten spectators with five cards (1,11,21).Therefore no fishing is necessary.I remember you saying that this is to be recommended especially where there is a structured seating plan such as a stage environment.The advantage of the Aronson original is that things are kept as simple as possible in the heat of a performance.

The adaptation Jan was outlining-if I understand correctly- involves five people with ten cards (1,6,11).This involves fishing down from the two cards to the one. With this later approach there is perhaps more potential to be flexible with respect to the presentation but there is also more 'heat' on the performer.

For example for the magician who is able to retain information well in the heat of a performance each spectator might well be allowed to choose their own pile from five batches placed on the table.The magician might call the spectators up one by one according to their left to right seating position to make it easy.The magician then remembers a simple five digit number to remind himself as to which spectator has which pile.

The cards for each spectator are presumably taken off nonchalantly in batches rather than dealt.Therefore the stack is not the 'regular' Aronson stack at the oft but becomes so after the switch (if one chooses to make the switch that is).

I do hope that I am understanding correctly now. Many thanks Dennis for the clarification.

Best wishes Andy.
JanForster
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Andy, yes, your understanding is right. Again, in my adaption spectators #1 and #2 are getting 11 cards. You've to fish for one of two cards. In my opinion no problem, we talk about mind reading, plus we've the advantage to distribute the entire deck and same time working with 5 spectators only. Also each spectator has a quite big pile therefore. Jan
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Dennis Loomis
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Jan is absolutely correct. Fishing for one of two cards is really a piece of cake. On the other hand, Histed Heisted is ideal for larger audiences and there is something to be said for involving 10 spectators in a routine. And something to be said for revealing every one of their cards with no questions other than if they heard their card called in the particular group at hand.

There a great deal of emphasis on the Café about which prop or performer or procedure is "better." Often this is a meaningless question because there are different tools for different jobs. Don't think that I am saying that the original Histed Heisted is better that Jan's version. That judgement is not only personal and subjective, but depends on the performing circumstances.

I don't do the original Histed Heisted either, but my version has to do with my own preference as to the prediction finale. Simon Aronson strengthened the routine by giving it a socko finish, and I have taken his idea. But, my prediction can be in full view from the beginning. However, it requires that the prediction be in the form of a playing card sealed in an envelope, not a written prediction sealed in and envelope. And, Simon's version is better in one sense because it can be opened by a spectator. I have to open and display mine.

If you want to know more about my version, it's available for free on my web-site. The link follows the words "Itinerant Montebank" below. Once you're at the site, click on the link to the Memorized Deck area and scan the articles for the one on Histed Heisted.

Dennis Loomis
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<BR>http://www.loomismagic.com
bunkyhenry
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Quote:
On 2008-01-20 13:37, JanForster wrote:
Try this what I sometimes do: Let the cards collect by a spectator, take him with you, switch the deck to your stacked and memorized deck and do then the calling. No miscalls necessary. The spectator can even look over your shoulder. At the end give him the deck as present. And: Use 5 spectators, each is getting 10 (!) cards, sp.# 1 and # 2 11 cards. Order: sp. #1 gets stack # 1,6,11,16,21,26 a.s.o.up to 51,
sp.# 2 gets 2,7,12,17, a.s.o. All in 5 steps, think you get the idea. Your calls: 1st stack # 1-10, 2nd stack # 11-20, 3rd stack # 21-30, 4th (if necessary) stack # 31-40.
Of course you've to do a little fishing to get the correct card as there are always 2 possibilities. I think that doesn't matter, after all we talk about mind reading. The advantage: the entire deck is distributed, each spectator has a "full hand" of cards.
Jan
http://www.janforster.de


With this 10 card/5 person method you do not use the prediction ending right?
JanForster
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Yes, I do... just needs more outs... Jan
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baobow
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Just an idea...

Would you guys consider just using an invisible deck wrapped up in a parcel as the finale. This would give you any of the outs that you would need, just move the 5-10 possible selections to the middle of the deck. Just give this wrapped up parcel to the forced spectator at the start of the routine and then you are set.


Alternatively use David Regal's Special delivery as your finale.
Dennis Loomis
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To baobow,

This is a good idea. It's been suggested that you can use the Invisible Deck as a finale or out for lots of things, although I don't specifically recall it being suggested for that purpose with Histed Heisted before.

When doing card magic, you might have an Invisible Deck in a handy location as an out or "kicker" when a card has been selected. This could be a running gag in a close up act. Have several cards selected at scattered times during the act and locate them in different ways. But then, take out the Invisible Deck and show that the same card is reversed in that deck. This could build over time, in the hands of a good performer. As a capper, the last card that appears reversed in the deck would be SIGNED. Not a hard effect to achieve, perhaps. I know how I'd do it.

Dennis Loomis
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<BR>http://www.loomismagic.com
bunkyhenry
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You could address spec #3 BEFORE the cards are passed out and say "I have a premonition about you,I am going to turn one card upside down..." and leave the deck in plain view. No outs needed and prediction is made before the card is even selected. Negative is not all the audience could see the ID card revealed. Is there a jumbo ID deck made?
Dennis Loomis
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Yes, there is a Jumbo Invisible Deck available. One source is:
http://www.loomismagic.com/products/invisjumb_blu/

Dennis Loomis
Itinerant Montebank
<BR>http://www.loomismagic.com
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