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***Kev*** New user 90 Posts |
I need some help with creating a 10 minute long fire and card manipulation act...
The card manipulation will last around 4 minutes, but I am looking for a way of combining cards and fire together as one illusion. I will begin with some fire effects Then I would like to do some effects involving cards and fire Then do my card manipulation I am open to sugestions! Kevin. |
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Jeb Sherrill Inner circle Elsewhere 1161 Posts |
It sounds good, Kevin, and there are some effects that combine both cards and fire (like flame behind fan). Flash paper to card, or card fan, is very nice, and dropping cards into one of the "fire bowls" that are so hot now isn't a bad idea either. Cards/fans, could also be produced from the flames.
I do think four minutes of cards is way too much though. Perhaps if you're just wanting to show off all your sleights to a bunch of magicians, but otherwise I'd suggest something snappy, with three or four major sleights. Singles (one or two methods in dominant hand, one, maybe two in the recessive hand), splits, some scaling and room for something different and some flourishes. Anything more (with a few exceptions I’ve seen) and the routine will be monotonous. Good luck, Sable
I don't believe in reincarnation, but I may have in another life.
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Schaden Inner circle Purgatory 1253 Posts |
Well.... I've been working on fire tricks forever. I can't really get anything really magicial with just fire. You can use an inviso-torch to gaint card fan. Tony Marks also has a little fire in his act. I've also came up with a multplying fire balls. I would suggest getting some fire tips and fooling around with those. I think fire hasn't been tapped into because you can get burnt and it isn't the most practical. That is why it is used more as a way to produce something. Good luck. PM me if you want more help.
Lee |
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BenSchwartz Elite user Southern California 499 Posts |
I agree with Sable. 4 minutes is too long. Cut it to a little less than three. Like two and a half. Add some silks if you could. And then something original and offbeat.
"The experience of astonishment is the experience of a clear, primal state of mind that they associate with a child's state of mind." ---- Paul Harris
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Ben Simon New user Germany 50 Posts |
For the fire part of the act: Inferno by Steve Sheraton
- http://www.hottrix.com/html/Inferno.shtml |
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Cardjinx Loyal user 278 Posts |
goto http://www.superhandz.com and in the elemental page they do cards on fire manipulation.
Cardjinx |
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iwillfoolu Special user Upstate NY, USA 746 Posts |
I don't think a time limit should be put on this so early. There is a ton of possibilities just with a deck of cards. So ten minutes is possible, however there may be much more than 3 minutes. The problem with most manipulation is lack of motivation and endless repetition. Why are the cards appearing in your hand? Why are you pulling fire out of the air??
If you use all the fire in the beginning, what is your finale going to be? There are lots of problems with fire magic that must be solved. Plus it's dangerous. Start out with simple fire effect (self lighting match, vanishing candle) and work with it for awhile to see if fire magic is for you. Make sure you are not practicing or performing near flammable stuff. ALWAYS WORK WITH A FIRE EXTINGUISHER NEARBY. Read that last part again. Don't forget it. Also get insured if you plan on using any fire. Joe |
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Geoff Ray New user 58 Posts |
you could produce a candle at the end of your fire routine and light it then show your hand empty, produce a silk from the flame and produce cards from the silk. Voila
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zombieboy Special user Connecticut, USA 889 Posts |
Look at Colin Rose's act.
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Some great ideas and suggestions.
First though, I would not do the act for 10 mins. I would shoot for no more then a 9 minute act. The reason for this is that if you ever decide to compete with this new act, most contests have a maximum time limit of 10 minutes. I would do 9 so that you are safe with the time limits should you compete in the future. Also, and not to be a party pooper, but reality is, these days, that many theaters and locations for shows where you would do this act, have very stringent fire codes and limitations. Some acts that I know have not been able to use much fire at all and were told to compensate for it. You will really want to think of where you want to perform this act and look into what the codes are for these areas. It would be no fun to develop a great act and not be able to perform it because of fire codes and limitations on the use of fire. With that said, I also agree that 4 mins of straight card manip is way too long. The best idea is to make sure you add impact and interest through the use of transitions in the act. Think creatively and almost anything is possible. Hope this helps.
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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zombieboy Special user Connecticut, USA 889 Posts |
Well said. You should have a long act of varied material, i.e. cards, billiard balls and coins, instead of a long act of just one material. Look at Shimada and Salvano's acts. They are long, but varied and entertaining.
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RandyStewart Inner circle Texas (USA) 1989 Posts |
Quote:
On 2003-07-05 12:34, magic4u02 wrote: magic4u02 you are right! Codes are becoming increasingly stringent and even a lit vanishing candle may soon become a thing of the past (unless you have the licensing and $ to satisfy Fire codes). I've done away with all of my fire effects and replaced with equally flashy material. I just don't want to become accustomed, over a period of future years, to a act and material that may not be allowed in future locations. The recent "Great White" concert disaster has pushed for future legislation. Many died in that close range pyro and rock show gone terribly wrong. |
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Zombie:
Thank you for your kind words. You are corrrect and give great examples. Indeed the acts of Silvano and Shimada are perfect ways to see how a manipulation sequence can be paced and varied to achieve great resukts and reaction form an audience. They both transition the effects and put the right pauses into the act. Randy: Thank you also for your kind words as well. I teach kids magic at one of the 5 largest SYM assemblies in the country here in Philadelphia. Every year kids want to do acts with fire or Fantasio Candles. I have learned to try and stay away from this the best I can as Fire codes are becoming incredibly stringent in years past. You must meet the proper fire codes of the place you are performing for as well as carry insurance and in some cases have a pyrotechnician's license. For me it is just not worth developing a full fire act if I can't perform with it.
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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zombieboy Special user Connecticut, USA 889 Posts |
You might want to get some of those card cigarrette lighters from Hocus-Pocus. They keep with the theme.
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-The Scot- Special user 726 Posts |
Interesting topic guys, does anyone know what that effect is Doug Henning does, he shows a large cloth empty, drapes it over his arm and shoulder (like a cape) and produces a metal bowls of fire, he does this 3 times.
Impressive stuff! |
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zombieboy Special user Connecticut, USA 889 Posts |
I saw Mac King do something similar in his show.
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-The Scot- Special user 726 Posts |
What was Mac King's version like? Doug Henning had large bowls, which he sat on elevated platforms. It was impressive because each time he showed the silk empty.
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zombieboy Special user Connecticut, USA 889 Posts |
Mac King had a large bowl which instantly filled with fire. Then, he shoved the whole thing, fire and all, into his jacket. "Don't worry, it's a smoking jacket. But soon it will be a blazer!" A very startling sequence.
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Ty Argo Special user Columbus, Ohio 525 Posts |
This sounds like a take-off of "Modern Production of a Bowl of Water on Table". Lance Burton uses a variation in his act to produce a bowl of water with jets streaming up. It sounds like Henning and King just made the bowl a fire bowl. The effect can be found in Tarbell - Volume 5, page 387. Nice effect! Hope this helps.
Dyslexics UNTIE!!
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paraguppie Elite user Forsyth Montana! 411 Posts |
Hi guys, great topic.
A couple of notes on the fire items. I work as a career Firefighter in Rapid City SD. A couple of months ago David Copperfield was here and his stage hands had to demo all of his pyro prior to use with a crowd in the theatre. He hardly had any at all in the show, but we (the FD) had to see it and okay it first. I was fortunate enough to tag along. There were no problems, but if it had been bigger pyro, or not as stable, the FD has the right to say "no" on it. You may have to demo it for someone, so keep that in mind. They may be a bit more willing to let you do it if you show an extinguisher, good distance from the audience, and finally above all, skill with the fire (don't drop anything!) Hope this helps, any questions let me know. Keith
Check me out at www.magickeith.com
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