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Robert Apodaca Special user 504 Posts |
I've been browsing these forums lately and it seems like a lot of the gentlemen here have a contempt for magic. To be quite honest, I've read several posts where I got the feeling that the mentalist was far superior to the magician that just does "silly card tricks".
I'm I imagining this attitude or what? Why have an attitude like that on a forum titled the Magic Café? |
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chichi711 Inner circle 5810 Posts |
You are not imagining the attitude at all. It has always been my pet peeve with mentalists. It wont go away. Some people think they are superior, or need to feel superior. don't try to understand or fight it. Its just the way many are.
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The Wicked Mr. Grey Regular user Toronto, Canada 177 Posts |
This I think is an interesting phenomenon and I see various sides of it. I come from a magic background and still perform a lot of magic but under the guise of mentalism so I'm often caught in the two worlds. I see at the magic shop down here that a lot of the magicians (exculing the wiser, often older, ones) often have this very "wow" attitude towards mentalism... as if it really was a final frontier in magic. And they could never do it because they don't yet have the skills. Mentalists often reinforce this idea.
I think what it is is that many mentalists view mentalism as the ultimate frontier of magic, the last bit of magic that has not yet lost its mystery or power in the view of the public. This might be just my opinion but I think that many mentalists feel superior to "magicians" because mentalism, to the public, still seems like a real thing. Mind reading and not magic tricks. Thus they fight as much as they can to separate themselves from the magician so what they do isn't seen as "tricks." This is arguably a double edged sword.... much of mentalism's impact can be lost if the mentalist just goes up to the person and says here's a cool magic trick and presents it as many actual card tricks are presented: the cheeky, wise-ass, smart-ass, know-it-all magician who can do these things and you can't. Mentalism demands a certain presentation and thought for it to truly work. I've often presented thigns as magic tricks but people tell me that they were real.... it's the way the material is performed.... I'm just rambling I'm very sick with a cold and fighting and the drugs are making my head go all swirly. Dorian Grey
What you have seen this evening was real, though it may have nothing to do with reality.
A Life Among Secrets |
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chichi711 Inner circle 5810 Posts |
With everyone jumping ships and coming over to mentalism. It is only a matter of time until "magic" is the "new fresh" stuff.
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Josho Special user Albany, New York 758 Posts |
The next big thing is going to be called "Majalism." It will consist of effects like predicting that the spectator will have a big fake bouquet of flowers in his coat, or burning four of out five envelopes, only to find that the lone unburnt envelope somehow contains the spectator's borrowed ring...or finding a headline prediction inside of a freely selected orange.
--Josh |
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chichi711 Inner circle 5810 Posts |
I like majalism. Sounds crazy.
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The Wicked Mr. Grey Regular user Toronto, Canada 177 Posts |
Possibly perfromed by clowns in business suits?!
DG
What you have seen this evening was real, though it may have nothing to do with reality.
A Life Among Secrets |
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Dr Spektor Eternal Order Carcanis 10781 Posts |
I always thought magicians calling themselves magicians made fun of mentalists calling themselves mentalists...
Actually, Bizarre Magic is the Final Frontier - or the beginning again - depending how you look at it.
"They are lean and athirst!!!!"
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Tony Iacoviello Eternal Order 13151 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-01-09 18:27, The Wicked Mr. Grey wrote: There is the same attitude the thread is protesting. One form of entertainment mocking another. |
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Jerome Finley V.I.P. SLC 3419 Posts |
I don't hold any contempt for magic, only for 90% of the "magicians" that I meet.
Just because someone does card tricks, it DOES NOT make them a magician. Dr., I'm with you. I feel Bizarre to be both the beginning and the end of "magic" as we know it. -Jerome.
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Jerome Finley V.I.P. SLC 3419 Posts |
Tony,
It's not mocking, it is only a comparison, an observation, an opinion. Have you never seen a clown in a business suit? -J.
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Tom Cutts Staff Northern CA 5925 Posts |
Finding your six of clubs is inherently silly. Knowing the thoughts of another is inherently profound. From there the performers' job starts.
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Xiqual Inner circle Upper left quadrant 4935 Posts |
Mentalists look down on magicians, who look down on children entertainers,who look down on clowns etc....
I think the superior attitude is just a feeble attempt at covering serious character flaws. If someone is secure in who they are and what they do, they certainly don't run down other people's choice of performing style. James
Still with the Chinese circus
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Jim-Callahan V.I.P. 5018 Posts |
But what if the thought is of the six of spades Tom?
J ack H.o.A-X
“I can make Satan’s devils dance like fine gentlemen across the stage of reality”.
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Tony Iacoviello Eternal Order 13151 Posts |
TT2, Yes, I see that sight daily.
The complaint that started this thread of mentalists looking down on magicians can be changed to magicians looking down on clowns and be just as valid. Tell you what, many of us are so busy looking up, looking down, and following the one in front of us, that we are missing out on all the beauty. |
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Jim-Callahan V.I.P. 5018 Posts |
Were you looking in the mirror when you posted that Tony?
“I can make Satan’s devils dance like fine gentlemen across the stage of reality”.
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Xiqual Inner circle Upper left quadrant 4935 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-01-09 19:39, Tom Cutts wrote: That's like saying "Driving a truck is a mundane task, saving lives is a greater gift." How about rephrase, "Tearing little pieces of paper is silly, entertaining people using magic as the vehicle is profound." See Tom, I have Wonder Words too. James ps I love and perform all branches of magic. My pro show currently is general magic. I used to perform in nightclubs doing mentalism on stage and then walk around later. I can't really understand the whole "I'm better than you" syndrome.
Still with the Chinese circus
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Jerome Finley V.I.P. SLC 3419 Posts |
James,
Yes. Different strokes for different folks. I would not ever "run down" another true performer. At the same time, I cannot help but feel "mocked" myself when some kid goes to Penguin or Ellusionist for 3 or 4 or 400 tricks, and then stands next to me and calls himself a "magician". If I knew being a magician was that simple, I would not have wasted half my life on it. -Jerome.
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chichi711 Inner circle 5810 Posts |
Jerome. I agree with you.
My understanding of the thread was more about the art magic vs mentalsim etc. |
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Jerome Finley V.I.P. SLC 3419 Posts |
I'll add that I would have been super ****ed off to know that mentalists were looking down on me as a magician. I don't know that this is necessarily the case.
I wouldn't look down on a magician, as that is my own background. Personally, I find mentalism more effective than magic. It is not an opinion, but based on my own experience with each. There would be no mentalism were it not for magic. Of this I am certain. -Jerome.
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