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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » J ack right about Randi from the get go. (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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DJM
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So when people say things like: "Are you crazy or something?" does it mean they are making fun of all those in the world that have mental problems?

The joke was about Jim, not about the condition itself. If I thought that he really had that, then that's when things would be out of line. Believe me that I've heard famous comedians make jokes that are much more "offensive" than that, and they even get paid to say that stuff.

BTW, looks like it took 4 days until someone said anything about it, so maybe it wasn't that bad.
Scott Xavier
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J ack or Jim,

Maybe all this is my snide attempt at publicity as well, but lets try some open ended questions and cold reading:

I feel like you use to play the Dr. Zodiac character who was snide and some what wild so that people remember the name. Now that the sales are coming, you have to take a step back right?

So you say you never sell with out selling? How about Hoa X or what ever. How about all the little hints and dropping of info in posts? It seems like J ack and Jim start whole topics just to seed with little clues. It also seems like drama follows product releases for slim as an attempt to hype his products. Since you aren't slim you can't really answer, but it is a thought.

At one time you wanted the name Jim Callahan off of a magic board as you didn't want people searching for the name to find it here, what happened?

What is your Randi claim? Will you ever apply? I don't want how the test is biased, just the answers.

I feel as if reading your posts, I need to step back and realize that you are the same guy who pulled a humbug on thousands by dieing on the internet. Interesting, but you have to wonder what a mans intentions are when he has constant publicity stunts...
Tony Iacoviello
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DJM:

If you reread the Doctor's post, he says, "I happen not to like jokes that call other people "illnesses"" and then continues.

Personally, I share his loathing for that type of joke. Anything that mocks those who are suffering from a real affliction in an attempt to make humor is not very funny to me. Perhaps there is a sensitivity as I have studied this topic, and know people who suffer from several associated illnesses.

To me, there is little to know difference between this type of humor and the "dead baby jokes" popular in the 1980s. All seek humor is sensitive and painful areas and mock others tragedies.

Tony
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On 2007-02-14 11:17, Scott Xavier wrote:
J ack or Jim,

Maybe all this is my snide attempt at publicity as well, but lets try some open ended questions and cold reading:

I feel like you use to play the Dr. Zodiac character who was snide and some what wild so that people remember the name. Now that the sales are coming, you have to take a step back right?

So you say you never sell with out selling? How about Hoa X or what ever. How about all the little hints and dropping of info in posts? It seems like J ack and Jim start whole topics just to seed with little clues. It also seems like drama follows product releases for slim as an attempt to hype his products. Since you aren't slim you can't really answer, but it is a thought.

At one time you wanted the name Jim Callahan off of a magic board as you didn't want people searching for the name to find it here, what happened?

What is your Randi claim? Will you ever apply? I don't want how the test is biased, just the answers.

I feel as if reading your posts, I need to step back and realize that you are the same guy who pulled a humbug on thousands by dieing on the internet. Interesting, but you have to wonder what a mans intentions are when he has constant publicity stunts...


Scott you may hate this but I am in total agreement with you.

He and a couple others here are the "boy who cried wolf" of publicity stunts for a select few on the internet.

YOU sir are right on line with what I meant about lets get to the main event. I figured with Jim throwing arround Randi's name again, it was a build up to some sort of silly stunt to sell something.

Bottom line is this for Slim and Jack/Jim. Randi has ignored them both, along with aparantly Slims friend. They are completly under the radar no matter how hard they try and I think it frustrates them even more now that they didn't make the cut.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
DJM
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Quote:
On 2007-02-14 11:21, Tony Iacoviello wrote:
DJM:

If you reread the Doctor's post, he says, "I happen not to like jokes that call other people "illnesses"" and then continues.

Personally, I share his loathing for that type of joke. Anything that mocks those who are suffering from a real affliction in an attempt to make humor is not very funny to me. Perhaps there is a sensitivity as I have studied this topic, and know people who suffer from several associated illnesses.

To me, there is little to know difference between this type of humor and the "dead baby jokes" popular in the 1980s. All seek humor is sensitive and painful areas and mock others tragedies.

Tony


Tony, you can find something offensive in almost every joke in the world. People should understand the difference between that and actually mocking millions of people.

I've heard a lot of jokes that could also be "about me," but I never take that personally as long as it's clear it's only a joke. This world is pretty screwed up, we need to find a way to laugh about our problems sometimes.
Tony Iacoviello
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DJM:

The old, "it's only a joke" excuse, huh?

When a joke singles out a particular segment of the population and uses them, their characteristics (real or not), or biases about them as a standard to imply humor, it is prejudicial.

Having had different experiences, and being a different age I see this differently than you.

Tony
Dr Spektor
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Hello again,

The generic "crazy" - it still all depends on context. Schizophrenia is a bit more specific. Now, you are right - certain comedians thrive off using vulgar and inuslting techniques to generate a certain type of Humour (Andrew Dice Clay (say what happned to him))... while others use certain swears, etc. and yet come across as speaking in a way that conveys truths, gives them respect, and you feel they are Ok (e.g. I might be "crazy" but that would be Chris Roc (notice my use of the word crazy - it may offend some... but it does show me I got to reflect on that anyway)...

Now, if there was a joke involving the condition of schizophrenia etc. that has some human meaning besides a put-down insult... that might go over well.

Here is a classic - it sounds like a terrible joke and yet when you look at it from the outside it discusses the real tragedies of life, horrible things happen, how a condition can actually help defend against horrible truths, and yet that condition will also lead to trouble...

e.g. Doctor has bad news for a person... "tell me doc, I can take it!" "Ok, sir... I have terrible news... you have cancer." "Oh my God... " "that is not all. You also have Alzheimer's disease..." "O my god - well at least I don't have cancer!"

Tasteless.. horrible... yet one could do an entire lecture on it or use it in the proper context to discuss suffering, acceptance etc. Note: I never use jokes like this anyway!

Now a joke like "How many (fill in the blank insult target) does it take to make a driveway?" "Depends how thin you slice them...." good for maybe a dark laugh - where the heck is the laughter's source? The dark reptilian brain perhaps...

In any case DJM, don't mind me - one of my tasks at my work is doing antistigma initiatives for mental health and addiction - just thought I would bring up something to ponder. I do not consider you some sort of maniac monster Smile... but I like to blab a lot.

Ciao

Dr S
"They are lean and athirst!!!!"
DJM
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Quote:
On 2007-02-14 12:08, Tony Iacoviello wrote:
DJM:

The old, "it's only a joke" excuse, huh?

When a joke singles out a particular segment of the population and uses them, their characteristics (real or not), or biases about them as a standard to imply humor, it is prejudicial.

Having had different experiences, and being a different age I see this differently than you.

Tony


It's not an excuse, it's an opinion. I think jokes could help making people stronger about their problems, and I'm also talking from experience. It's a matter of prespective.

And I don't see how age has anything to do with it, I can give you a list of comedians that make jokes about everything and anything, and some of them are even older than you.

That wasn't a remark against old people, and I apologize if anyone got offended by that.

Quote:

Tasteless.. horrible... yet one could do an entire lecture on it or use it in the proper context to discuss suffering, acceptance etc. Note: I never use jokes like this anyway!



It's too late. Smile But seriously, I didn't see anything offensive in your joke, because it was meant as a joke.

If anyone seen the movie Borat, he makes fun of everyone there, including some jokes about the Jews. That didn't offend me at all and even found some of that very funny. BTW, the actor is Jewish himself, and I don't think he offended himself either..

Quote:

I do not consider you some sort of maniac monster



Thanks! I think that's nicest thing anyone has ever said about me. Smile
Slim King
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Scott...Are you saying that I WANT drama to interfere with my already limited releases????? My Lawyer can assure you that I was the financial loser on any litigations. I won the battle but at a great cost.
What question do you want answered?
And Danny's post just proves my point.
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
Dannydoyle
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Tony in all fairness, MOST jokes fall into the catagory you mention. A group is singled out for humor.

I am not defending, I am not attacking, just mentioning.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Tony Iacoviello
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I'm not saying they don't, just pointing out why people are offended.
Dannydoyle
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Yep, but almost ALL jokes can cause offense. Can't really outlaw humor.

Most times it is when where and HOW they are told which makes the difference.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Jim-Callahan
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If nothing else my threads show people thinking and considering things.
And holding debates of value I think.

I will answer Scott tomorrow.
Danny also.

But right now I must finish the last bit on the short film by tomorrow.

-Jim
“I can make Satan’s devils dance like fine gentlemen across the stage of reality”.
Dynamike
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A joke or not, no one can offend me because I have a good attitude. Some people have tried before, so what, who cares. Smile
Dannydoyle
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Yea some do need to take more offence at times your right.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
lumberjohn
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Going back to some earlier posts, I don't believe it's fair to compare Randi to the Masked Magician. The MM was motivated by one thing: greed. His exposure was simply for the sake of exposure. It had no higher purpose. He chose the most well-known and often performed effects of his day, thereby directly hurting practicing magicians, apparently with no remorse. He exposed to make a buck and get a TV special, end of story.

I have met Randi and talked to him at length. I have also followed his career. There is no doubt in my mind that Randi believes he and the JREF are providing a public service. We can argue all day about whether the JREF's efforts are really making much of a difference, but I am sure that Randi believes the fight is right and worthwhile. Randi has tried various methods of exposing fake psychics who steal people's money and hopes, but the most prominent ones are still out there deceiving the public.

So he is modifying his tactics again. Now, he is aggresively going after the better known frauds like Uri Geller by, among other things, demonstrating how they are really doing what they claim to be doing through psychic powers. Randi is not exposing on a national television special effects commonly performed by practicing magicians. He is explaining how Uri Geller is actually moving a compass when he says he is doing it with his mind. The "exposure," if you would call it that, is limited, targeted, and narrowly directed to a specific public purpose. Also, Randi is not saying, "Here's how all the practicing magicians and mentalists perform their effects." He's saying "Here is how this fraud Uri Geller is deceiving people."

I believe this to be a major distinction and one that many on this board have completely missed.
Jim-Callahan
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And have you missed that he calls them simple magicians tricks?
“I can make Satan’s devils dance like fine gentlemen across the stage of reality”.
Dannydoyle
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Geller and his claims on the TV show have brought back Randi with a vengence.

Not a problem.

I will say this though. Exposure is wrong. BUT does not affect a serious working pro that badly. Unless Randi goes after you. Imagine doing the same type effect as is exposed, and fooling the audience with it. HMMM almost real magic isn't it guys?
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
entity
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Should we only be concerned with working pro's?

The vast majority of those in Magic are amateurs.

- entity
Dannydoyle
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Yes, which spawns another discussion entirley.

A fantastic point, though. One which I will gracefully step away from. It really is a hot button issue.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
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