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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The workers » » Thoughts of a confused newbie (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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dodgechargerrt30
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Kentucky
158 Posts

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Well...I didn't start the topic so I am not the one in need of help I am one of those trying to offer help...

I read most of the first page and then decided not to read the rest of it since I already had my opinion thought out....

Does this make any sense?


DC
I have enough money to last me the rest of my life, unless I buy something
fless
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68 Posts

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Thx DC. I keep on reading wilson, sure. Problem is I want more card stuff, and I must say wilson's card section is quite thin. As for myself, I find coin magic rather uninteresting. That's my personal preference, and probable due to the fact I've seen a good bit of poor coin magic from amateurs...
Cheers,
fless
Jonathan Townsend
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Eternal Order
Ossining, NY
27242 Posts

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I'm happy that someone is going through the Mark Wilson course.

The billiard section is very good.

Have fun, find what you like in magic.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Andy the cardician
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Inner circle
A street named after my dad
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Fless,
you will go full circle - sooner or later - and then you will really appreciate the course . . .
Cards never lie
scorch
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Inner circle
1480 Posts

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Quote:
On 2007-03-12 07:38, fless wrote:
Thx DC. I keep on reading wilson, sure. Problem is I want more card stuff, and I must say wilson's card section is quite thin. As for myself, I find coin magic rather uninteresting. That's my personal preference, and probable due to the fact I've seen a good bit of poor coin magic from amateurs...


Unfortunately there's no shortage of bad card magic from amateurs as well.

And I'm with you on the coin magic. Cards are so much more compelling for me, and of a more comfortable size for the hands. I think if we had large coins in circulation, coin magic would be more doable. But I don't want to have to raid my grandfather's collection of Eisenhower dollars, or find some old Mexican pesos or something just to find coins that fit will in the hands and are sufficiently sized so that my audience isn't squinting.
vinsmagic
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Eternal Order
sleeping with the fishes...
10881 Posts

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Having a magic teacher is the best way to learn.....
Come check out my magic.

http://www.vinnymarini.com
Bande
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415 Posts

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I have to believe you are right - -as it is generally the best way to learn anything (Calculus from a book a lot harder than calculus from a good teacher:)) So....where can one find a good teacher. I currently commute between Washington DC and Los Angeles, California and am interested in finding someone with a flexible schedule for obvious reasons. Any thoughts?
SIX
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New York City
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Im going to save ou a lot of time...Stay away from "E" because a lot of other "young" magicians do the same material. For some great proffesional yet easy material get THE EASSY TO MASTER CARD MIRACLES BY Michael Ammar...You wont regret it and will be a better magician and possibly more respected.

SIX
chr!s
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newcastle
163 Posts

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Don't buy the shapeshifter dvd,get desouzas deceptions instead.
that's not to say don't get anything from 'E',as a lot of magicians might tell you.they have some worthwile stuff on 'E'.
how new are you?
I read the magic book by harry lorayne when I was young,and I still recommend that to young guys I know wana get into the art.
if you have a local dealer,the best thing you could do is to ask the guys that work there.tell them what you want,what kind of stuff youlike,and they should be able to help you.
my advice to you is,a single trick is a purchase.but a book of magic is an investment.
chr!s
"you can't see your own rub-a-dub..."
-richard sanders
JoeHohman
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Erie
674 Posts

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Chris from Newcastle is spot-on -- Harry's book is a tremendous book, aimed at beginners, but with a lot of sage advice that you will refer to again later.

Fless, I am a little taken aback by your remarks about the Mark Wilson book. It admittedly does not contain a lot of knuckle-busting sleights, but there are dozens of good effects in there that I think you ought to look at again. Don't dismiss the book because it isn't "hard" enough; in other posts at this site you will see listings of the most important and useful sleights, and Complete Course has all of them. You can do dozens (if not hundreds) of very powerful effects with a control, a DL, a palm, and a good memory.

Earlier, you said you wanted to get more into card magic to become less introverted, and that you would settle for being an "ordinary" magician.

Do you know what the difference is between an ordinary magician and a great magician?

It is NOT in the encyclopedic knowledge of sleights -- it is in the ability to perform! Spectators don't know if you've used a Biddle, Hamman, or Jordan count, but they DO know if you were funny or boring; engaging or aloof; smooth or fumbling; confident or insecure.

How do you practice a Biddle count? That's easy -- you watch some television and you do it over and over again until it feels and looks natural. How do you practice being funny, engaging, smooth, and confident? Ah, that is harder -- you have to get out there and actually BE those things WHEN YOU PERFORM.

THIS IS A PERFORMING ART! If you just want to sit in your room practicing Faro and Zarrow shuffles all day, then that's your right; I am happy that you have a legal hobby that is keeping you busy and not hurting anyone. Go ahead, post a video of yourself on Youtube and call yourself a magician. But the only people who will care are all the other Youtube wannabes that sit in their rooms practicing Faro and Zarrow shuffles all day... Is that the audience you want to devote your time to? Really?

Mark Wilden, Vinnie, Chris from Newcastle, and both JT and Scorch have given you some wonderful advice. Follow it. But all these books -- none of them are really good investments unless you learn how to ACT magical, how to be entertaining. To my mind, for a beginner, you can get a LOT of good performance ideas out of the Wilson book. You don't have to use all Wilson's patter verbatim, and in fact you shouldn't -- but don't throw it out until you have effectively determined its value to you. (Here is a formula for calculating value: Value = potential effect on audience x number of potential performances. We can call it Fless' formula, my gift to you!)
ragingcalm
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Mr Townsend is completely right about the much neglected performing aspect of magic, and we could all do with some presentational teachings. Unfortunately, I disagree with the order in which he should learn the theatrical and the basics. There is little point delving into some of the finer emotive points of shakespeare if one is constrained by the depth of performance one can give by the arena in which the magician operates. Whilst, a pack of cards and an oil and water effect may provide for a good deal of presentational maneouvering, especially form a theatrically trained magician, it does not call on the requirement to express the pain of having a leopard eat one testes, which may be called on for a tv hopsital show, for example. My point is simply that much of the theatrical training could end up wasted. Technical Basics first.

secondly, his comments on scorch's analogy about music fail to recognise that when you're learning a musical instrument you are being guided/taught by another who has the benefit of hindsight and knowledge in leading you. They can chose which pieces of bach will be approrpriate for the beginner's level of expertise. Compare this to the newbie cardshark who has simply the raw material but none of the guidance.

To fless: by advice is that before you find how a trick is done, write down which are your favourite and why. Once the explanation is revealed the sense of wonder is lost. Thus, it becomes increasingly difficult to know which effects will most astound the lay person and what sleights may pass the lay person by, once one becomes an insider.

Never having delved into mentalism in any shape of form, I was moderately disappointed to find that from 2 of the ETMMM and the Unexplained dvds I knew how virtually every effect was done. THe difficulty for me therefore, is trying to guage how such an effect might affect the spectator.
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