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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Grand illusion » » Blades Zig Zag (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

robert bianchi
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New Jersey
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Does anyone have any suggestions where I can get a set of Zig Zag Blades.

Is there a illusion maker that you know of who will make the blades only to your knowledge.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Bob
Jack Murray
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St. Petersburg Fl.
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I will! Contact me.

Jack
Blair Marshall
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Montreal, Canada
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Is this because you want to build the illusion, or you already have one and need new blades.

I ask because if you are building, you can modify your work to the blades you buy.

If it is for an existing unit, you may want to send one of the blades to them.

I think a couple of the guys here can turn out a set of blades for you. But do remember there are several different designs, and even some mechanical ones out there. Straight, curved, off set to handles etc.

Let them know what you want.

Blair Marshall
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robert bianchi
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New Jersey
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Hey folks, I appreciate your responding to my post.

Here's the deal with this situation. I have a Zig Zag, and the blades are designed to slide from side to side in the handle. This was designed to make the illusion look more pronounced, if you know what I mean. The blades are also curved.

It is not fitting my routine, however for a number of reasons. First, I like to do the effect as Harbin did it, so that when the middle box moves out, I am on the tray side, which to me is the wrong side to manipulate blades sliding action. I also do not feel that it really improves the illusion that much. Also, although I do not allow the spectators to view/examine the blades for too long, I am always afraid that someone will notice that thre is a slit on the handles that allows the blades to slide.

So, I figured that I would go with blades that did not move. I am pretty sure that is how Harbin did it. This is why I posted.

So, in addition to asking for someone who can make non-moving blades, I am curious if any of you have ever heard of the kind of blades that I have, and if you have any opinion as to their effectiveness. If you think that they are effective, do you have a technique of how to move them keeping in mind that I am moving the box from the tray side, while I have a spec "assisting" me from the other side, as Harbin did.

BTW, "mechanical" blades??? That is one that I have never heard of. Could you provide a description of this.

Thanks for the help.

Bob
Blair Marshall
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It was my belief that the handles were slid over as they were pushed through the box. In this way when they settled against the box they were already offset and giving the illusion they were designed for.

Many builders just make the blade off set to the center of the handles, and I do not think anyone really notices this. If they are shown held together as a set, this also supplies more cover.

Blair Marshall
"ShaZzam!"
ClintonMagus
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According the The Magic of Robert Harbin, his blade was not curved. The sides of the blade are parallel, and the "far end" is cut at a slight angle. The blade is slightly off-center in the handle.

It seems like I have seen this mentioned somewhere as a modification, but I can't remember for sure.
Things are more like they are today than they've ever been before...
Blair Marshall
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The curved sides allowed for a wider blade to show on both sides of the box, the entry point and on the backside when the box is turned.

Blair Marshall
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robert bianchi
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New Jersey
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Dear Blair:

I am curious. Are the blades in your opinion moved toward the tray when they are put it, or are the slid in the other direction. I know that that may sound stupid, but I can see advantages to doing it both ways.

For example, if they are slid away from the tray upon entry, than when the middle box is pulled out, it will appear that the blades are further from the middle box, which is how I think it is supposed to be.

However, if the blades are slid toward the tray, it somehow makes it appear that it is more natrual. It is really hard to explain, but after looking at this for hours, both my assistant and I are dumbfounded, which again makes me think that it is not really necessary

Also, are the blades slid over when the box returns, or are they simply pulled out.

I really do appreciate your help, because I have analysed this for so long that I am no longer objective about it any longer.

Bob
Michael Messing
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Knoxville, TN
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Bob,

I have a Chalet Zig-Zag. The blades are curved and slide in the handle. They are meant to slide toward the toward the tray. The reason is to make it look like the blade is centered in the main box and not offset. The original Harbin blades did not were permanently offset, which looks odd when you display them. The ability to make the handle slide makes the blade look more natural when displaying it. (It will be centered in the handle.)

The blade is slid toward the tray when you put them in the slots. The blades are then slide back when you pull them out. There's no reason to adjust the blades when pulling the center box or pushing it back.

Since you have to be in front of the box when inserting the blades, the movement of the handle is covered.

Michael
Peter Loughran
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You are supposed to bring the off set blades out by holding the long side of the handle blades by the long side. Bring them out together with one hand, Then use the other hand to take them apart, give a toss, and smash them together, and then start sicking them in. No one will ever ever notice they are offest, and if they ever did(which they won') it appears as though the longer sided acts as a handle for the magician to hold onto, I mean you wouldn't want to cut yourself on those deadly sharp looking blades right? ;-)

I wouldn't bother running when you are not being chased. I used a zigzag in my show for about 10 years, from the time I was about 13 years old till I was about 23 or so, and this was never ever an issue. I had people come up to me after the show and say things like, I think you used mirrors, or things like that, never did I have anyone ever question the blades being offset. Infact when I first purchased the prop from gerry frenette and went to house to pick it up, he never told me they were offset, he just told me to put them in screw head side down, and it wasn't until later I realized they were offset, and why.

P.
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robert bianchi
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New Jersey
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Thank you everyone for your help!

Bob
Michael Messing
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Quote:
On 2007-03-07 11:47, Peter Loughran wrote:

I wouldn't bother running when you are not being chased. I used a zigzag in my show for about 10 years, from the time I was about 13 years old till I was about 23 or so, and this was never ever an issue. I had people come up to me after the show and say things like, I think you used mirrors, or things like that, never did I have anyone ever question the blades being offset. Infact when I first purchased the prop from gerry frenette and went to house to pick it up, he never told me they were offset, he just told me to put them in screw head side down, and it wasn't until later I realized they were offset, and why.

P.


This makes sense but the sliding handles really aren't any problem to use. They work quite smoothly so I think it's a nice, if minor, improvement.

Michael
Starrpower
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I use blades that slide in the handle. Okay, maybe I'm not "being chased," but every little deceptive piece adds up to one HUGE deceptive illusion.

Harbin had a GREAT creation; so did the Wright Brothers. Both can be improved, or at least adapted to individual needs. Imagine if, over the past 100 years, aviators had the opinion, "The Wright Brothers knew what they were doing. They did it right; who dares to question, change, or challenge their great invention?"

I like sliding blades. Honestly, until now I thought I was the only one that had them!
Peter Loughran
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All Im saying is that they are not neccessary. I know I used the prop for 10 years and having sliding blades never would have made a difference from an audience perspective. Im not saying they take away from the illusion, and if you have them, great use them. I was just letting Robert know that if he needed blades, they didn't have to be sliding ones, that's all.
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Starrpower
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I didn't mean that to be critical of you Peter. I was just supporting my opinion. I was anticipating the onslaught of "Harbin didn't do it that way" posts, so I was simply giving some insight into why I think the way I do.

BTW, I respectfully disagree with you -- I think many audiences DO analyze the way things look, and a sliding blade can create a logical doubt in their mind about the method. I've done it for 18 years now, so I, too, have a little experience with the trick.

The bottom line, though, is Robert now has a bunch of views from people who own the trick so he can make an informed decision.
Peter Loughran
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Oh I understand Starpower, I got the feeling I was upseting people who had sliding blades...lol. Perhaps audiences have changed since I performed it, or perhaps it is the way one may perform it from another, but in my honest opinion if you handle the blades properly it would never be an issue. Yes he has opinions from lots of different people to make an informed decision. Thanks for the imput.

Peter.
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Starrpower
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Honestly, it probably doesn't make a lick of difference. There's a lot of stuff that likely shoots right by audiences. For example, when doing an Elmsley count to show 4-as-4 but you are "hiding" one card, how often to people realize that they've seen the same card twice? It's probably the same with sliding blades (but I still like 'em!)
Peter Loughran
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Smile
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