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Jim-Callahan V.I.P. 5018 Posts |
I stand by my statements Steve.
My first post is quite clear about how I feel. http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......;start=0 Thanks J ack H.O.A-X
“I can make Satan’s devils dance like fine gentlemen across the stage of reality”.
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Harry H Inner circle 1526 Posts |
What are we thanking him for exactly? Bending a spoon? Do we really think no one in history bent a spoon before Uri?
I thank him for making me laugh at his pathetic attempts to claim psychic powers! |
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howdoidisconnect Elite user Just outside the cafe window 429 Posts |
Jim, do you not read what you posted.
1) Oh they make the cash off of his work but I don’t see them quoted on his site and I am sure he would post it if they did thank him - incorrect it is not his original work he borrowed it as much as anyone else did. 2) It is his (Uri's) it has been ripped off and it is blatant. - incorrect again, it is not his effect by his own admission 3) The world knows of mental bending because of Uri the guys that taught you how were doing so because of Uri. - no complaint there, and David Blaine made card magic popular again, Criss made levitation's popular again and the list goes on. 4)All recognize it came from Geller and all these other guys sell it as their work. -wrong again 5) C'mon guys do what the people who stole from him did not do. again incorrect, no one can steal from someone who didn't own it in the first place. And the list can go on ...all your posts Jim, all on the basis that Uri metal bending is original and his. If this is your opinion then fine, however you didn't keep it like that you clear state on your thread, that your opinion is the correct one even in the face of evidence Uri own site. So if you want to thank Uri that's fine, but no-one else has an moral or ethical obligations based on your reasons given, and it is your reason we are discussing here. And if you want to side with tony on the reason we should thank him is one popularity, then I say why shouldn't you and anyone who use any effect that has been made popular by the likes of Angel, Blaine, Copperfield, Daniels, etc., etc., be thanked as well. Their is an issues here you are trying to prove for your own ends that I am happy to claim in writing. But your facts about Geller are wrong. So do you now admit that Metal bending isn't Geller original work and by his own admission was being done previous. Now if you want to admit this then this thread can move onto the shifted reason now which appears to be because he made it popular.
I do look forward to the day when you post something constructive.
-Tony Iacoviello |
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Jim-Callahan V.I.P. 5018 Posts |
Gellers presentation, choice of objects, etc are his.
Up untill him no one else did what he did. His site proves that.
“I can make Satan’s devils dance like fine gentlemen across the stage of reality”.
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Arnon Inner circle 1320 Posts |
Jack/Jim:
What disturbs me is that Uri Geller broke presentational ground FOR URI GELLER'S SELF-GAIN, and not for the sake of elevating the art of mentalism. Why thank him for something he had no intention of doing for our art's benefit? The value of the "gift" is measured by the thought behind it. And as of late, he appears to have sabotaged what took him years to establish as a "real" psychic. How sad and self-defeating, but why thank him? Arnon |
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patrick66 Veteran user The Netherlands 384 Posts |
Jim, your choice of words is very slick. It's still not clear to me if you believe he has real powers of any kind. Maybe it's my "bad" English, but even from Uri's site it's still not clear to me WHAT you believe of Uri.
Let me say that although there are many fakes and frauds, I do believe in the paranormal. I also believe that it will never be proven in a scientific way. Start laughing at me now and throw the tomatoes |
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mindpunisher Inner circle 6132 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-06-26 14:14, arnon wrote: What distrubs me is that you don't realize that is behind everyone's motivation. The more I read this thread the more I see it from Jim's point of view. Not that you have to thank anyone, but that Geller did give something to this "art". Whether you like him or not many of you are copying him. But will never come anywhere close to what he achieved. |
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Arnon Inner circle 1320 Posts |
Mindpunisher:
While self-promotion is ALWAYS a successful performer's motivation, it is not the SOLE motivation of a truly great contributor to the art. Anneman, Banachek, Osterlind, Cassidy, Lesley - they all have GIVEN to mentalists and mentalism, having DISCLOSED their techniques to those that truly care. Has GELLER ever authored a book on his techniques, or come out with a DVD, etc.? Will he go down in history as a contributor to the body of knowledge called "mentalism," or simply as a self-promoting, egotistical and HUGELY successful charlatan? Even Jack/Jim has contributed! Thank the genuine contributors, not the unintentional donor of a presentation that has been copied simply because of its appeal. |
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Malchat Special user The Kingdom of Croiset and Wonder 885 Posts |
This may require a topic of its own, but I find arnon's observation fascinating: is our worth as mentalists or psychic entertainers really determined by how much we give back to fellow performers?
I mean, how many techniques have David Berglas, the Amazing Kreskin, Marc Salem, and Derren Brown shared with us? Just looking at that list convinces me that amazing audiences > giving hard-won secrets to us lot.
“You are what you pretend to be.”
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Jerome Finley V.I.P. SLC 3419 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-06-26 02:06, HollyMental wrote: . . . wow . . .
"Join my update list here!" http://eepurl.com/uE3Jf
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Arnon Inner circle 1320 Posts |
Malchat:
I don't know about Kreskin, but certainly David Berglas and Derren Brown have shared greatly with us. And the point is GIVING THANKS, not deciding who's the greatest. P.S. For example, I don't think that GIVING THANKS to David Copperfield is in order. On the other hand, Max Maven/Phil Goldstein surely deserves our thanks. |
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Malchat Special user The Kingdom of Croiset and Wonder 885 Posts |
I get your point perfectly arnon; I just find fault with the single argument that Uri Geller is undeserving of respect because he never taught us how he does it.
To be honest, I'm not particularly interested in whether we should pay hommage to Geller or not (that's a personal choice I have no need to figure out by brainstorming on the internet) but that one notion -'you must share your secrets or the community will not respect you'- struck me as worthy of debate. Every once in a while, a 'greatest mentalists' thread pops up, and these lists are filled with performers who have put out best-selling DVDs, as if those are the only ones that the larger community takes note of. I find that interesting, but I admit it's off-topic for this thread.
“You are what you pretend to be.”
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Arnon Inner circle 1320 Posts |
Malchat:
That is NOT my notion - I simply addressed the TOPIC of this thread, namely, the propriety of giving thanks to Uri Geller. Personally, I don't think one MUST give back to our community; I surely would not do so simply to gain respect; however, I feel it important to be grateful to those who have come before me by contributing in my small way as they have in a BIG way. |
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Malchat Special user The Kingdom of Croiset and Wonder 885 Posts |
My bad then - I was sure you were faulting Geller for not disclosing his methods a few post back and went on a tangent.
“You are what you pretend to be.”
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Arnon Inner circle 1320 Posts |
I surely respect David Copperfield, but I'm not about to give him my thanks.
:D Arnon |
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Tony Iacoviello Eternal Order 13151 Posts |
Malchat
That's how it read to me too. Tony |
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AJX New user 65 Posts |
This thread is ridiculous. Have I thanked Uri indeed. This genre of conversation is embarassing in the extreme.
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Arnon Inner circle 1320 Posts |
I'm grateful that Copperfield popularized magic so much, but that was merely a byproduct of his self-promotion.
I'm not about to thank him for that. Arnon |
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Jerome Finley V.I.P. SLC 3419 Posts |
If one does not wish to give back to the community, I wish they would GET OUT!!!
It takes a true POS to take and take and take and never give back, never contribute and never give thanks. This is a community. It continues to thrive based on the hard work and effort of many people, past and present. If everyone made it a point to give back as much as they have received, magic and mentalism would be a lot different. Instead, we have people who view the field as their own personal resource to exploit (and slaughter, they do the damage but don't help with the repairs), and who have nothing to contribute in return, nor do they intend to. It makes me sick. -J.
"Join my update list here!" http://eepurl.com/uE3Jf
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Arnon Inner circle 1320 Posts |
Bravo, Jerome!
And why thank an ingrate? Arnon |
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