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DP the Great Regular user CC, Texas 198 Posts 
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Greetings. I have had a lot of debates with my magic buddy about what the most important part of the routine is. I don't really know were I stand, but he insists that the middle effect or second to last effect is the most important effect in a set routine for walk around. I have always heard that your best is for last. But he states that the last effect should be a quick closer type routine or something to wrap the magic experience to an end after a high impact routine. I can see that being true, but I can't see a good chop cup routine being followed by any other routine, its that good. Any thoughts? -DP
D. P. the Great
www.dpandedmagic.com |
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S2000magician Inner circle Yorba Linda, CA 3465 Posts
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Conventional wisdom is that your closer should be your strongest effect, and that your opener should be your next strongest.
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Robert Apodaca Special user 504 Posts
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Your opener should be your weakest effect, while your closer should be your strongest. This creates build and a sense of progression.
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kammagic Inner circle 1304 Posts
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Most "important" does not mean "strongest". I would think that your first effect is the most important. This is the one they judge you on. This is the one that wins them over. The one that is selling who you are. If you don't grab their interest with that first effect you're in trouble. The first effect should be an effect that you can pull off 100% of the time. The strength isn't as important as the skill and confidence you use to pull it off. The first effect sets the stage for whats to come. You don't need to kill them with your first effect. But you do want them saying to themselves "Wow, this guy is good"
Whenever you approach a table with the offer of magic people already have an opinion of you and its usually not favorable. They are picturing some cheezy badly performed effect that they have seen their friends completly butcher at their last party. The first effect you do establishes at what level you perform. This is why I believe the first effect is the most IMPORTANT. |
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NJJ Inner circle 6437 Posts
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A routine should be judge as a whole and not by it's parts.
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Magic_Steve Inner circle Maryland 1476 Posts
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Quote:
On 2007-07-14 07:01, Nicholas J. Johnson wrote: By magicians, yes. But by an audience, they will judge you on your opener. Like Jonathan said, it sets their mood for the rest of the performance, and hopefully wins them over (if it's good). Also, it gives you credibility as a true professional. I always start off with a strong opener. Right now I'm using Tampa Opener as my first effect, and the reactions have been jaw-dropping to say the least. I almost think it's better as a closer, but so far my whole routine has been really clicking. I think I'll just leave it alone. 
Best, Steve |
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S2000magician Inner circle Yorba Linda, CA 3465 Posts
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Quote:
On 2007-07-14 07:01, Nicholas J. Johnson wrote: How it should be judged is not nearly as important as how it is judged. Alas, most audiences will never read your post, accurate though it may be. |
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Jerrine Special user Busking is work. 629 Posts
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Once again no definitive answer so do as you like and let experience be the judge for you.
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FredrikS New user 58 Posts
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I also think that the opener is the most important routine. You need to get them into that magic feeling... that make them want to see more...
"Fly me to the moon"
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JamesTong Eternal Order Malaysia 11213 Posts
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We do not have a second chance to create another first impression. The audience will judge us in totality from the first contact they have with us. Good or bad impression would be perceived within a minute or so. We either win them or lose them totally with the opener.
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RicHeka Inner circle 3999 Posts
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I agree that the opener is paramount.
James Tong..you stated the reason beautifully. Best. Rich |
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Bad to the Balloon Inner circle Clearwater Florida 2116 Posts
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Hmmm ....... how do you gage what is good, better, best?
By your likes and dislikes or the reaction of the audience? I feel in restaurant work each effect needs to be able to stand alone due to the chance of interruption. My sets are constructed to the feel of the audience; kids more visual, adults engaged more cerebral, drunks more dirty, blondes I go real sloooooow.
Mark Byrne
AKA Mark the Balloon Guy As seen on the TODAY SHOW www.balloonguy.net Creator of Bad to the Balloon DVD series Go to my store: http://tinyurl.com/Bad2theBalloon |
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S2000magician Inner circle Yorba Linda, CA 3465 Posts
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Quote:
On 2007-07-14 23:59, Bad to the Balloon wrote: That's mean. |
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David Tower Regular user David Tower 124 Posts
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I agree whole heartily with Nicholas J. Johnson who said “A routine should be judge as a whole and not by it's parts” and with Kammagic who said “Most important" does not mean "strongest".
The opening is important but if you have a knock out opening and then everything else that follows is poor the audience will not leave with a favorable impression. On the other hand someone like Simon Lovell may do a fantastic set and then end by twisting a paper flower out of a rose. Although it may be cool it is not “blow them away” magic. But the overall impression is what audiences walk away with. Most people will not remember your opening a week from now but they will remember their overall impression. Most magicians have a hard time getting away from the trick and into the experience. It is a demon that I think every professional has to deal with at some time in their carrier. David Tower
David Tower
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Justin Impossible Veteran user Distant Land Of Shmooo 328 Posts
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I agree with many of you and especially performing in a restaurant atmosphere you need to hit them hard upfront so that they are thinking "ok this kids got some skills lets see what else he has". I think if you started with something weak their interest level would really diminish. I think closing is very important as well. I close with something that is pretty much impossible and that way they remember it. But tricks aside I think magicians in general or at least they should, try to create a story with their magic. I remember having a conversation with Mark Kalin about leaving the audience with a memorable experience so that they do remember you for time to come. So many new effects say "leaves a lasting impression". I don't really think that is true. You as the performer leave a lasting impression by what S2000Magician said above "conversational wisdom" of creating something wonderful that the spectator can take from your show. that's enough of my ramblings!
Peace J
Justin Impossible
www.justinimpossible.com www.facebook.com/magicianjustinimpossible A pretty assistant is the most effective form of misdirection. |
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Lash Regular user Lansing, MI 161 Posts
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I was always taught that you start with something flashy or visual and somewhat quick to grab their attention. You want something to connect with the audience right away. Then you want to end with your strongest effect to leave them with. This is what they go away remembering the most. This is the way I have always tried to structure my routines and it seems to work well.
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DP the Great Regular user CC, Texas 198 Posts
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Quote:
On 2007-07-15 12:54, Lash wrote: That's pretty much what I have been told too. The problem is that usually things which a quick, flashy, and visual are limited. Not everything can be under that category. I tried chameleon silks one night, and it is very visual, but it can be somewhat slow and not all that amazing. But then again, that is the fun in creating a routine. -DP
D. P. the Great
www.dpandedmagic.com |
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kammagic Inner circle 1304 Posts
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Quote:
On 2007-07-14 23:59, Bad to the Balloon wrote: Very true! With a new audience my opener is always the same. Because I trust it. But after that I may do 2 more effects. Each effect is complete in itself with a beginning middle and end. Each effect is what ever feels right at the moment according to time restraints, audience reaction and interest. I am very choosy about the effects I do for that very reason. They must be able to stand alone and must be very impressive in case I choose just to do that single routine. Unless you work in a quieter restuarant where you can do a parlor type act stringing more then two routines together that feed each other is not that practical. Some places may be better for set routines of 3 or 4 effects but the chain restaurants are usually way to busy for such scripting. Many times its one effect and off you go. , Jonathan |
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korttihai_82 Inner circle Finland 1880 Posts
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In a way I agree on Jamy Ian Swiss and Bob Kohler on this one. They have both wrote or said that in walk around performances there really isn't room for middlers or even openers but just for closers. In real world enviroment I find that I very very rarely have enough time to do more than 3 routines per group and in busy enviroment it can go down even to 2 or 1 routine. Therefore I just perform pieces that could anyone be used as a closer. I might aswell mention that I am a firm believer in what Michael Close has written that there is no need to do a trick immediately at the table or group but get to know the people and get them interested about you. When you can do that you don't have to open with something flashy and short.
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Justin Impossible Veteran user Distant Land Of Shmooo 328 Posts
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Just a thought: I always open with a fire trick to produce my business card. I do this for two reasons. One is everyone loves fire, I don't know what it is but people love fire and especially when someone can manipulate it. The second reason I use fire is that everyone else sees it and then they want to see it too. As soon as you pull it out, you have just gained all the attention of the room; plus I love when the room is silent and all eyes are on you!
Peace J
Justin Impossible
www.justinimpossible.com www.facebook.com/magicianjustinimpossible A pretty assistant is the most effective form of misdirection. |
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Posted: Jul 14, 2007 01:12 am 
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