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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » New to magic? » » Mikame Color Vision, incorrect discription/ad? (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Mr. Ree
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Sedona AZ
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I just received Mikame “Color Vision”.
The blurb says:
===============================================================
Show an exotic wood box and lid, also a cube with 6 different colored circles screened on all 6 sides. Ask spectator to put a favorite color on the cube facing up and put the lid on the box. You name their chosen color without actually opening the box!
=========================================================
For those that know how this works, did I miss something,
or is this false advertisement?

(I'm new to reading an "effect" description and trying to figure out
if a trick is worth buying or not.)

But maybe I just don't understand something.
An idea can turn to dust or magic, depending on the talent that rubs against it.
---- William Bernbach (1911 - 1982) ----

(After 25 years of PCs, everything switched to Macs, June 2008)
chuckn34404
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Bend, Oregon
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If Mikame Craft discribes the trick as you have written, you should be able to perform it as described. They build a quality product.

I have a MC Prediction Board made by Mikame Craft(Mental Epic) and like it. Very well made and can be handed out for inspection before or after the performance.

Mikame Craft Magic is a quality producer of magical apparatus. Each and every piece is hand-crafted to exacting specifications.
Chuckn
Mr. Ree
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Sedona AZ
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I was going to save these comments for later
but as Mikame quality was mentioned I will
offer the following “personal opinion”.

Maybe the Mikame of old was ,
“hand-crafted to exacting specifications.

But of the items I have recently received
I would not consider all of them to be of the
same quality. So I am not offering a flat
statement about Mikame quality.

Here are the following Mikame products I own.

These are all “newer” Mikame products.
After I get back from vacation I will offer a more
detailed opinion on each.

But here is a quick overview.
==============================================
Very nice quality looks like they will last.

1. Table Hopping TOP w/ Drawer, MKE Wand INCLUDED

2. Mikame Color Vision (very nice looking, no flaws)
But effect cannot be done as advertised. I would not have
purchased if I knew “method”. (I thought this would be more
like Die Cipher )

3. Mikame Perfect Vanishing Box

=============================================
Nice quality, but will not hold up to really being used too much.

1. Mikame Silk Production Box

(The base was cracked when received, very thin wood.)
I have already carefully repaired the base. Mechanism very
nice, but wood very thin.
=============================================
Very poor quality if I saw this first I would not have purchased.

1. Mikame Mind Chips
Only the Box that holds the chips is wood.
This box is very nice.

The chips are plastic with stick on decals.
(Both front and back.)

When received:
1. Two of the decals were not even attached to the chips.
2. Half of the “color face” decals have bubbles underneath.
3. All of the “back” decals have bubbles underneath.
4. The blue chips are very different colors.
(It is important that they are the same color).

=============================================
Could be very nice but were manufactured with some
lack of care.

1. Mikame Photo Frame w/base
There is a rod in the base that holds frame, rod is too long and during
manufacturing process caused large bulge in wood on side of base.
(Split wood).

2.Mikame Sucker Die Box, gimmick chips in wood
(which I have repaired and re-painted. Otherwise this
item is very nice

3.Mikame Sucker Card Box light surface scratches.
(Maybe I am too picky on this one, but Mikame is
suppose to be for “collectors” right? .

=========================================
An idea can turn to dust or magic, depending on the talent that rubs against it.
---- William Bernbach (1911 - 1982) ----

(After 25 years of PCs, everything switched to Macs, June 2008)
chuckn34404
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Bend, Oregon
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I have not had the quality problems you are describing. Have you considered contacting the source where you bought them and ask for damage replacement. I have return several non-Mikame products and asked for replacement because of small defects. The items in these cases where replaced without questions. Sorry you are having these quality problems.

Chuck.
Chuckn
Terry Holley
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It seems to me that the ad may have said more than it should have and less than it should have!

Here's a blurb from another dealer for the effect:

"A small wooden cube is removed from an attractive wooden box. Each side of the cube has a different color gem embedded in the wood. A spectator is asked to select a color and place it face-up inside the box. This is done while your back is turned away. They are to place the lid on top of the box securing it from view. Place the box behind your back just for a moment. Place the box on the table and tell the spectator with the utmost confidence the name of the color that faces up. Remove the lid to show your divine mental ability is indeed accurate. They can examine the box and cube and will find nothing."

False advertising? You might have a case here, but the problem with descriptions is deciding if they are from the spectator's viewpoint (the effect) or the performer's viewpoint (the modus operandi).

Terry
Co-author with illusionist Andre' Kole of "Astrology and Psychic Phenomena."
Mr. Ree
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Chuckn34404: I have fixed what I can and will be contacting
dealer for replacement of item(s) that cannot be fixed. The
tough two are “Color Vision” which is done in a way that does
not seem consistent with the “ad”. The second is “Mind chips”.
The “exotic” wood box and the pressed on decals on plastic chips
seem like a oxymoron.

Terry Holley: Thanks for the direct answer. Yes I am finding
it difficult to decide what are good effects and what are good
ads.

Of the (6) Internet sites I found selling this product,
(4 ) have the “You name their chosen color without actually opening the box!”

(2) have: “Place the box behind your back just for a moment.”

If it is only from the spectator’s view any ad becomes possible.
Who knows what a “good” magician can get a spectator to see.
The Hindu rope trick becomes possible. Maybe the spectator
Is “hypnotized” and the spectator thinks he has become a dog.

All of this aside some of the Mikame pieces are the highest quality
effects of their type that I have been able to find.

It is the inconsistency between products that is bothersome.
An idea can turn to dust or magic, depending on the talent that rubs against it.
---- William Bernbach (1911 - 1982) ----

(After 25 years of PCs, everything switched to Macs, June 2008)
Billgussen
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Central Japan
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I don't have Color vision, so I don't know how inaccurate the description is. But the English instructions for my Mikame Demonstration Table (a beautiful piece, btw) were not written by a native English speaker. Is it possible that Mikame is using a translator for their advertisements who is not completely familiar with English or with the effect itself? If that is the case, it may be neither false advertisement nor you missing something, but rather the translator missing something.

(I am a Japanese-to-English translator by trade, and I know that the translators are usually simply given text to translate. Although it would be better if the translator had access to the aparatus itself, that often doesn't happen. Another problem with translating is that the companies who hire freelance translators usually don't have the resources to evaluate the translation -- they just assume the translation is accurate.)

So it may be a simple case of bad QC.

Bill
Mr. Ree
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Hello Billgussen

Very good idea. (ii kangae)

In this case they also show pictures (zuga) that talk about
the method.

But you are right some of the translation is hard to understand.

Regards,
An idea can turn to dust or magic, depending on the talent that rubs against it.
---- William Bernbach (1911 - 1982) ----

(After 25 years of PCs, everything switched to Macs, June 2008)
Hideo Kato
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Tokyo
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Although this is an off-topic, Mikame-san visited our office yesterday. He showed us (me & Mr.Maric) a prototype of his new creation. For me, it is a first trick you can produce a real birthday cake in whole shape. We discussed ideas to make it more effective.

He is about 70 but very young in creating work so that you can expect more of his wonderful crafts.

Hideo Kato
rmendez
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San Antonio, Texas
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I own several of these, and it is nothing more than a gorgeous rendition of the trick we all know and love.
rmendez
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Check out the Viking version which is my favorite.
Mr. Ree
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Quote:
On 2008-02-08 15:40, rmendez wrote:
Check out the Viking version which is my favorite.


Thanks for the tip. I have been happy with my
previous Viking purchases.
An idea can turn to dust or magic, depending on the talent that rubs against it.
---- William Bernbach (1911 - 1982) ----

(After 25 years of PCs, everything switched to Macs, June 2008)
Don Sautter
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Flagstaff, AZ
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I second the suggestion of the Viking version - it is well crafted and beautiful.
gaddy
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Quote:
On 2007-08-11 11:28, chuckn34404 wrote:
If Mikame Craft discribes the trick as you have written, you should be able to perform it as described. They build a quality product.


I love blanket statements of faith like this one. So telling... Smile

ANYHOW... the description of the trick as it appears to the spectators IS correct, but it sure doesn't seem that way on our end...

If you would like to look at an AMAZING handling of this wonderful trick, check out Docc Hilford's "Sign of Four". A wonderful pamphlet on a few of our favorite "tricks gathering dust on the shelf" redeux...
*due to The Magic Cafe's editorial policies, words on this site attributed to me cannot necessarily be held to be my own.*
Mr. Ree
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Quote:
On 2008-02-14 19:15, gaddy wrote:
ANYHOW... the description of the trick as it appears to the spectators IS correct, but it sure doesn't seem that way on our end...

If you would like to look at an AMAZING handling of this wonderful trick, check out Docc Hilford's "Sign of Four". A wonderful pamphlet on a few of our favorite "tricks gathering dust on the shelf" redeux...


gaddy:
You are correct it is not "that way" at all from our side.

I have learned a lot in the 6 months since I first ask the question that started this
thread. (Ads for magic products typically count for nada.)

I have also learned not to be so shocked about misleading or
outright falsehoods (lies?) in product ads.

But more importantly thanks for your helpful comment. I have just sent a request
to one of my favorite stores about seeing if “Sign of Four by Docc Hilford – book”
is in stock. Your willingness to share based on experience is what makes the Café
an exciting place.

Time to make some lemon aid out of these lemons.
An idea can turn to dust or magic, depending on the talent that rubs against it.
---- William Bernbach (1911 - 1982) ----

(After 25 years of PCs, everything switched to Macs, June 2008)
Dave V
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Las Vegas, NV
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Mr. Ree,
Part of the fun of all this is trying to "read between the lines" to figure out what they're not telling you.

Did you end up getting Color Vision? I've found the "placing it behind your back" can be easily disguised by some performance changes. You turn your back, and take the box while your back is turned. By the time you've turned to face the audience, the "dirty work" is done. This does exactly the same thing, but doesn't look like you hid it behind your back for no apparent reason.

If there's any left, I'd like some of that lemonade please.
No trees were killed in the making of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
sethb
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Mr. Ree -- In all fairness, I think you are being a bit too tough on Color Vision. This Mikame version is simply a nice upscale (and more expensive) version of something that has been around for many years, and has been included in zillions of children's magic sets (in inexpensive plastic versions).

This doesn't mean it's a bad trick, far from it; done neatly it can still be a very good fooler. But it does mean that you aren't getting a space-age radio-controlled effect or some precision-made gizmo with secret sliding panels. What you are getting is presumably a lovely wooden collector's version of a trick that is customarily made in plastic and sold for under $5.

Along these same lines, you can buy $50 brass Snappers that work just like the $1 plastic ones, and $100+ ball vases made of exotic woods that work just like the $1 plastic ones. They may be more appropriate in certain performing venues, or more desirable as collector's items, but they all work on the same basic principle as the inexpensive plastic ones. You pay your money and take your choice.

As for the dealer's description, I think it's a fair desciption of what the spectator sees, that is, what the trick "looks like." If all descriptions were written from the magician's point of view, there wouldn't be too many secrets to sell.

In saying all of this, I'm not condoning deceptive advertising by magic dealers, of which there is plenty, or passing off one effect as another, also a common occurrence. Certainly there is much that could be improved in this area. But I just don't think that was the case in this situation. SETH
"Watch the Professor!!" -- Al Flosso (1895-1976)
"The better you are, the closer they watch" -- Darwin Ortiz, STRONG MAGIC
Mr. Ree
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Dave VanVranken:

Yes I did buy Mikame color vision and it is one of their
best made pieces.

Thanks for writing up some details. I do have the spectator place the box in my hands while back is facing them. And I think that the handling that you have shared is very good.

Do you prefer normal, pink, or raspberry lemonade?

sethb:

I do appreciate the detailed response that you took the time to write.
You are right I got a bit too tough on Color Vision but here is why.

There were several other versions of this product I could have bought but I passed on them as their ad was written in a way that I knew that the “covert move” was used. I knew how they were done because I had the “kids” plastic version over 40 years ago.

6 months ago I had only been doing magic again for a couple of months, new to buying magic, still am.
But I thought I was getting something different when I ordered the Mikame product.

So there is a bit of an uneven playing field when it comes to product ads. The upsetting part for me is that the “more honest” dealers/ads did not get my money when in fact they are the ones that really should have.
In some small way I feel that I “rewarded” the wrong guy with my purchase.

As “Terry Holley” mentioned an ad for Mikame Color Vision at another site gave a “more fair” description.

The other problem that I have is that if all ads are written from what the spectator
sees I have no way of telling which version of trick I want to buy.

How would ever tell if I want:

One man dancing hanky.
Steve Dusheck’s Waltzing Matilda.
Sean Bogunia ultimate dancing silk
Or the method Blackstone Sr and Jr used?

The spectator sees a dancing handkerchief.
If that is all the ad says I may have to buy 2 or 3 versions before I find the one I really want.

Unfortunately for me, the magician, I may be able to “dance” the hanky by myself
or I may need two other people to help.
(But the aid doesn't need to mention that if it is only given from the spectators vantage point.)

The above example may not be the best but I hope you get the general idea of what I
am trying to say.

I have learned quite a bit since the Color Vision purchase around six months ago.
I have also be “stung” much worst than in the case of the simple Mikame Color Vision.
But I have also gotten some really great products especially from Schoolcraft,
Viking/Collectors workshop, and Owen.

I now search out dealers that are willing to talk to me on the phone from time to time.
But I still can’t do this for every $35 purchase.

The best thing I have learned to do is spend a bit of time doing some searches here
at the Café before making a purchase.
An idea can turn to dust or magic, depending on the talent that rubs against it.
---- William Bernbach (1911 - 1982) ----

(After 25 years of PCs, everything switched to Macs, June 2008)
sethb
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I agree that if you are comparing methods, dealer's ads will often be of no help to you. However, as you noted, many if not most, magic dealers will be glad to discuss certain details of an effect without revealing the method, such as whether an assistant is needed, how the angles are, what level of skill is required, etc., so that you can make an intelligent decision before buying. Most legitimate dealers want satisfied customers and repeat business, and will make an effort to answer appropriate questions prior to the sale, if they know you are serious and not just "secret-shopping."

As for comparing methods, I also agree that the Café' is an invaluable resource, and you can obtain the benefit of many others' experience before buying. Of course, one person's satisfaction with something does not always mean that it will be satisfactory to you. I think that having some purchases end up in a bureau drawer is one of the occupational hazards of being a magician!

As an example, I recently purchased a $20 CD-ROM, which turned out to contain just four pages of information about a certain effect, and most of that material was either redundant or irrelevant. If there had been some golden nuggets of handling, patter or presentation, it would of course have justified the price, but there really were none, and it was pretty pedestrian stuff at best. I complained to the dealer about it and received no response, so that's the last order I'll place with that firm, even though I have used them fairly often in the past. On the other hand, I once purchased an effect from another magic shop, which clearly could not be performed as described in the ad. I e-mailed the dealer with my concerns and he promptly wrote back, telling me to return the item at his expense for full credit. I continue to order from him to this day.

Anyway, I think we all understand and appreciate your concerns a lot better now. Welcome back to the world of magic, and may your future purchases bring you and your audiences more satisfaction. SETH
"Watch the Professor!!" -- Al Flosso (1895-1976)
"The better you are, the closer they watch" -- Darwin Ortiz, STRONG MAGIC
Mr. Ree
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Quote:
On 2008-02-14 19:15, gaddy wrote:

If you would like to look at an AMAZING handling of this wonderful trick, check out Docc Hilford's "Sign of Four". A wonderful pamphlet on a few of our favorite "tricks gathering dust on the shelf" redeux...


Gaddy: Thanks for pointing out "Sign of Four". I received this a couple of days
ago. What a great example of the "performance" making the trick. Even the "old"
imp bottle is made interesting.
An idea can turn to dust or magic, depending on the talent that rubs against it.
---- William Bernbach (1911 - 1982) ----

(After 25 years of PCs, everything switched to Macs, June 2008)
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