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Vandy Grift
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Quote:
On 2007-09-13 11:22, Jheff wrote:
About the only other thing that I can say is this: Roulette is the only game whose outcome is determined by human interaction. A dealer throws the ball (much like a pitcher in baseball) and it lands on a number.


Who is throwing the dice at a craps table? A robot?
"Get a life dude." -some guy in a magic forum
tommy
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The edge multiplies the same as odds. This is why bookmakers like taking bets like doubles,trebles, four timers and so on. If I offered 3/1 and the thing was truly 4/1 I am stealing a point. However the true odds of hitting two winners on the trot is 5 x 5 = 24/1 but since I am giving only 3/1 it is 4 x 4 = 15/1 and I am then stealing 9 points on let it ride bets so to speak. That little edge you think your trying to beat is bigger than it seems so it seems to me but whatever it is you can’t beat it.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
Vandy Grift
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I agree with those that say stay away from roulette. I don't count cards, so I say go to the craps table and bet the pass line with odds. (The best bet in the entire joint). Put the 6 & 8 to work for you if want to, or even make a 22 or 44 inside bet. Stay away from the cornhole bets, be disciplined and try to grind out a few bucks.

If you are just playing for "fun", throw your money at any old game until it's all gone, then go home.
"Get a life dude." -some guy in a magic forum
KingStardog
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Quote:
On 2007-09-13 12:54, Vandy Grift wrote:
be disciplined and try to grind out a few bucks.


Correct. Bet with the house and do not take any of the other bets. Over time you can grind out the money....unless the house start making calls.(changing the rules for that table) Don't sit on the table when it is nearly empty and milk it. make sure everyone is making some and you will be welcome public and private.
...think not that all wisdom is in your school. You may have studied other paths,but, it is important to remember that no matter who you are or where you come from, there is always more to learn.
iamslow
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Quote:
On 2007-09-13 12:38, Vandy Grift wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-09-13 11:22, Jheff wrote:
About the only other thing that I can say is this: Roulette is the only game whose outcome is determined by human interaction. A dealer throws the ball (much like a pitcher in baseball) and it lands on a number.


Who is throwing the dice at a craps table? A robot?

what about manual sic bo?
"Everyone is tough till they get punched in the face" Mike Tyson
Jheff
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Quote:
On 2007-09-13 12:38, Vandy Grift wrote:
Who is throwing the dice at a craps table? A robot?

Thanks for those who wrote me offline. I'll just jump back in to clarify and correct. I'm not familiar with manual sic bo, so I may be incorrect on the statement that roulette is the only game with human interaction.

But, to that statement, Vandy, I meant dealer interaction. With craps, a player is controlling the dice. This is a player that usually does not play the game day in and day out and make a living from it. In truth, you're probably not far off by saying that the dice throws are by a robot (and I'm being sarcastic). This does not mean that I'm saying that it's beatable or that it is not a great game. I'm merely clarifying that I meant dealer interaction, not just merely human interaction. In that, craps is clearly not in that category.

-- Jheff
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h2o
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Jheff, I think you're talking about the "dealer signature" system.

On this link:

http://www.computeroulette.com/

A guy named Mark Howe is explaining how this system is being used by a scammer to sell his roulette electronic devices:
Vandy Grift
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No prob Jheff. I know what you were saying, I was just being a smart alec.
"Get a life dude." -some guy in a magic forum
KingStardog
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Quote:
On 2007-09-13 13:49, Vandy Grift wrote:
I was just being a smart alec.


You too huh...thought I had that angle to myself.
...think not that all wisdom is in your school. You may have studied other paths,but, it is important to remember that no matter who you are or where you come from, there is always more to learn.
iamslow
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On 2007-09-12 16:03, Vandy Grift wrote:
LOL! Thanks,I was just kidding.

I never play roulette, but I know about and understand odds. You'd be surprised how many people believe that kind of stuff though. Especially in games like roulette and craps. They think numbers are "due" and all that BS. And I would never really suggest betting half, or two thirds to half, of your bankroll on any single bet. I was just screwing around, sorry for the confusion.

I was hoping you were kidding..lol I feel the same way as you, I just bet the line with full odds and grind..
"Everyone is tough till they get punched in the face" Mike Tyson
Vandy Grift
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On 2007-09-13 13:57, KingStardog wrote:
You too huh...thought I had that angle to myself.


Heck no, this place is loaded with em, some are just better than it than others. Generally speaking though, I like smart alecs.

I thought I was better at it, but then I post something like "odds say that numbers come in threes" or "bet two thirds, to half, of your bankroll" and people think I'm serious. I thought my smartalecy rep preceeded me.
"Get a life dude." -some guy in a magic forum
iamslow
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Quote:
On 2007-09-13 13:39, Jheff wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-09-13 12:38, Vandy Grift wrote:
Who is throwing the dice at a craps table? A robot?

Thanks for those who wrote me offline. I'll just jump back in to clarify and correct. I'm not familiar with manual sic bo, so I may be incorrect on the statement that roulette is the only game with human interaction.

Jheff, Sic bo is the game played with 3 dice and theres many different betsdepending on what outcome the 3 dice might be....its where the dealer has a cup and saucer and the dice are shaken in the cup... I also wanted to mention the money wheel which is probably easier to scam than roulette and the dealer spins the wheel day in day out and only has to control one object?
"Everyone is tough till they get punched in the face" Mike Tyson
Dannydoyle
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[quote]On 2007-09-13 01:28, Dannydoyle wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-09-12 16:03, Vandy Grift wrote:

As for anyone else who cares to disagree, feel free to do so. Facts are facts. Math is math. Take your computer and try, but like I said you have a negative expectation on each bet, you will lose in the long run.

This does not allow for a crooked dealer, past posting or any other sort of cheating. Roulette is simply a losing proposition.


Jason the LAST 2 sentences need to be read. A guy using a computer is cheating. I am speaking of not cheating.
Danny Doyle
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Jheff
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Iamslow: You're right about the money wheel. Hmm, perhaps I should look into that . . . Smile

h20: It is a dealer signature method, but the one I use is not the one described on the page you linked to. Not even close. It's an interesting link, though. Thanks for it.
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tommy
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Judging the speed of the ball and wheel and guessing where the ball will drop it is not cheating unless you use a device and not even then in England. Without a device I see hundreds of professional roulette players using it every night. System going well, send more money!
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

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JasonEngland
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[quote]On 2007-09-13 17:26, Dannydoyle wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-09-13 01:28, Dannydoyle wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-09-12 16:03, Vandy Grift wrote:

As for anyone else who cares to disagree, feel free to do so. Facts are facts. Math is math. Take your computer and try, but like I said you have a negative expectation on each bet, you will lose in the long run.

This does not allow for a crooked dealer, past posting or any other sort of cheating. Roulette is simply a losing proposition.


Jason the LAST 2 sentences need to be read. A guy using a computer is cheating. I am speaking of not cheating.


I understand. I also understand that Thorp created his computer system in the 1960s. The Nevada device law wasn't passed until 1985. That's a 20-year period when beating roulette with a computer was perfectly legal. And visual prediction remains perfectly legal, if very hard to implement and make money with.

The point is, there are exceptions to every rule, and a way to beat almost any game for those with the proper dedication and know-how.

You made a blanket statement, I just pointed out the (highly unlikely but never-the-less possible) exceptions to that statement.

Jason
Eternal damnation awaits anyone who questions God's unconditional love. --Bill Hicks
Dannydoyle
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I find it highly amusing actually.

The fact of the matter Jason is this. My BLANKET statement that every bet has a negative expectation, and barring cheating it is not possible to beat the game. It is as it works out 100% accurate. No matter WHAT little things you want to claim my statement that if you don't cheat, you can't as it is now beat roulette.

Save your goofy arguements for another thread. In this case a blanket statement is right.

By the way the tense of the verb is presant, not past. (is not was)
Danny Doyle
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JasonEngland
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Danny,

I was just trying to be helpful. If you wanted to be added to the "don't waste your time with this guy" list, all you had to do was ask.

Jason
Eternal damnation awaits anyone who questions God's unconditional love. --Bill Hicks
Dannydoyle
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Helpfull?

By trying to show how smart you are by simply creating a situation that does not exist, and then smashing your view into that straw man arguement is helpfull how exactly?

Yep don't waste your time with me. You are not helpfull, just trying to show that you can make up a fake situation in which you think that this may apply. MY contention is 100% accurate. Roulette is a series of negative expectation bets. NO SYSTEM can beat it. Now you want to show how smart you want everyone to think you are and make up some silly situation. Go ahead, ON EARTH (where most of us live) roulette can not be beaten by a system. Now you say a computer. That is not a system now is it Jason? SYSTEM was asked about.

So yea put me on your list of pay no attention because it really makes no difference, no matter what you think.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Vandy Grift
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Hey Rt you jagbag!

I'm posting your PM so everyone can see what an idiot you are. Next time read the entire thread before you send me your dumbass comments. I'd have to be almost as dumb as you to believe that the odds change depending on the previous outcome.

"I just read your post on this subject about the odds going up when one color comes up several time in a row. Where in the world do you get your information? From some magician that has never played... each spin is completely independent from any other spin.... Geeeez...."

Then when I asked the ****head if he had bothered to read the rest of the thread he says; "Still another stupid statement from another wannabe. Many show up here... I won't show up here again... This is it..."

To which I say "Good". If your too stupid to read an entire thread before you start shooting off PM's to people you don't know, you shouldn't be reading any forums.
"Get a life dude." -some guy in a magic forum
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