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Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On 2007-10-25 21:02, Jared wrote:
I agree tboehnlein that it took guts for these performers to perform in this difficult envirnoment but fame and fortune always has a price tag doesn't it? Somebody on this show is going to walk away from this wreckage and stand to gain significant financial rewards. It's a risk that the majority of us would probably take if given the opportunity.

-Jared


Here is where I disagree.

Yep win and you have financial rewards. But I would NEVER risk this sort of thing and it has nothing to do with guts or not.

It has to do with knowing the limitations that they are slapping you with. It is why so many of the "names" have avoided this like the plague. Why risk anything under these circumstances.

Whoever said we are entertainers is rigth. BUT these guys did not manage to entertain. I think that the medium that they are thrown in cuts the legs out from under them. It is not really fair.

I would hesitate to judge any of them as entertainers based ONLY on this program. Good or bad is tough to tell.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
HeyLockwood
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As arnon mentioned earlier, it would be interesting to see what Osterlind would have performed, and I even wonder how he would have been as a judge. His name was the first thing to pop into me head when I first heard about this show - now I couldn't be happier that his good name is nowhere near this debacle.

Incidently, I'm not convinced that mentalism wouldn't play well on TV - while I've never seen Derren Brown (where can I find him?), I think Osterlind is quite entertaining even just on his instructional DVD's, which, of course, are viewed on a TV. I've shown the perfomance segments to close friends, who have confirmed my suspicions that they would find it entertaining...

But, the format of the show, the over-the-topness of it all, well, it was just lame. I certainly don't feel it's the fault of the performers, but ultimately, this show was not good television. My girlfriend (who is definitely a layman, except for the TT she found in my pocket while washing my jeans - what a sweetie)thought the show sucked. So did my co-worker who told me about the show in the first place.

For the folks who haven't seen the show - you really should watch it. I'm not saying you'll be entertained, but you should at least see it so as to know what the general public is being exposed to as far as mentalists go. (By the way, I don't think the lay audience knows or particularly cares about the distinction between "mentalist" and "magician." What they do care about is "entertainment." We shouldn't forget that.)

I really can't say anything about Chris Angle (yes, "Angle," as in camera angle)that hasn't already been said. His "look what I can do!" attitude is so lame. Some of my lay friends think he's simply an arrogant pr*ck. I've never met the guy, but I agree that he comes off that way. I thought entertainers were supposed to be likable? Oh, wait...that's just for entertainers who want to actually have lenghty careers. Let's see how long Mr. Angle lasts in the public eye. I for one hope I never again have to look at him trying to cover the camera lense with his mouth. Dude, quit biting the camera! Save that view for your dentist, weirdo!

-Mike
Why doesn't it tickle when I tickle myself, but it still hurts when I stick a fork in my eye?
Jared
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"Yep win and you have financial rewards. But I would NEVER risk this sort of thing and it has nothing to do with guts or not."

....Good point. Everyone should be entitled to decide what's best for themselves. We all have are own personal goals. These performers however elected to take a chance and with that comes some risk.

-Jared
HeyLockwood
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Quote:
On 2007-10-25 21:09, Dannydoyle wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-10-25 21:02, Jared wrote:
I agree tboehnlein that it took guts for these performers to perform in this difficult envirnoment but fame and fortune always has a price tag doesn't it? Somebody on this show is going to walk away from this wreckage and stand to gain significant financial rewards. It's a risk that the majority of us would probably take if given the opportunity.

-Jared


Here is where I disagree.

Yep win and you have financial rewards. But I would NEVER risk this sort of thing and it has nothing to do with guts or not.

It has to do with knowing the limitations that they are slapping you with. It is why so many of the "names" have avoided this like the plague. Why risk anything under these circumstances.

Whoever said we are entertainers is rigth. BUT these guys did not manage to entertain. I think that the medium that they are thrown in cuts the legs out from under them. It is not really fair.

I would hesitate to judge any of them as entertainers based ONLY on this program. Good or bad is tough to tell.


As usual, Danny - well said.

-Mike
Why doesn't it tickle when I tickle myself, but it still hurts when I stick a fork in my eye?
Marc Spelmann
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Dito, the format is flawed and makes mentalism something to be judged when the reality is mentalism is to be experienced..

Well said Danny..

Spelmann
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Slim King
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Lot's of Armchair Quarterbacking by those who are not playing the game. The first quarter isn't even over yet. Hide and watch......
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
Dannydoyle
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Slim I have to say this.

I have offered to eat my words and I will do so gladly.

Unfortunatly it has not worked out that way and it is unfolding exactly as was expected.

Funny part though is when people like the defenders say things like you just did you do it in such a demeaning way, and you want to sound so superior, but oddly enough when you are wrong, as with the premier, where is the "Sorry I was wrong"?

You can't wait to call others names and say things like "armchair quarterbacking" thinking it is clever. BUT when those are proven to be right, you remain oddly silent. Kind of puts your agenda in perspective if you ask me.

And notice that it is the formula we find flawed, NOT the performers. We are taking shots at NOBODY. I don't believe many could come across well in this environment. But go ahead keep taking shots at people and throwing bombs.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Parson Smith
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I am not being sarcastic.
I did not audition because I did not feel that I was mystical enough. I also thought that I was not entertaining enough.
I think that I am entertaining, but certainly not one of the top 10 in the world in this field.
I liked the things that the guys did and do not know that I could have done any better.
The only thing that really fooled me was the revelation of the name Jeff Goldblum.
I did not like the way that Criss Angel acted and think that I am a better magician than he.
I think that it is not good for us to unduly critique other magicians unless they are "cheating."
I want to see next week's show.
I admire the guys and lady who are working here and hope that this helps their careers.
I would like to see all of these performers live.
Parson
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DJM
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I liked the poem, Parson.
Parson Smith
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Thanks
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Eddie Garland
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Parson Smith rules!
I want to hug you.
The Drake
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Parson,

You nailed what most of us are thinking. Maybe YOU should have auditioned after all. LOL

Best,

Tim
Parson Smith
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Sorry Eddie. I don't go for Dummies.
Hope that is not Politically Incorrect.

Parson

But you are cute.
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Magical Dimensions
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Quote:
On 2007-10-25 21:33, Slim King wrote:
Lot's of Armchair Quarterbacking by those who are not playing the game. The first quarter isn't even over yet. Hide and watch......


What is there to quarterback? We all can see how mentalism is playing to the TV viewers! Facts are facts and seeing is believing.

You can go and hide, but for me, I rather stand and face it head on. This way I will be able to see what needs to be changed and improve for this type of work.

I look at this as a lesson that we all need to learn from.

As far as I can tell, noone has said anything bad about the performers. It is the type of show/arena that we are talking about. What can we do to play better in this type of program? Tells us Mr. Slim, cause, as you can tell by my other posts, I really DO WANT TO KNOW!

Here is the ball, what are you going to do with it?


Ray
Parson Smith
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Magical Dimensions wrote:
"As far as I can tell, noone has said anything bad about the performers."

You may want to go back and read the thread.
There were some really NASTY things said about the performers.

Peace,
Parson
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Dannydoyle
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Ray what is the matter with you? Don't you know that everyone is great and every idea has merit and everyone is always a success?

Who are you going to believe me or your own lyin eyes? Come on man you can use facts to prove anything that is even remotly true. What good will they do us?

We just need to keep our eyes closed and just say everything is good and then all will work out.

Say anything else and you are called names, made fun of and told that you are being negative.

I agree the ball is in his court, lets see how he spins it to take a shot at me.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
HeyLockwood
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Ray, didn't you say earlier that you haven't even seen the show? Have you had a chnace to view it since then?

And, yes, plenty of negative things have been said about the performers. However, my take on it is that noone is blaming the perfomers alone for the debacle that this show is.

I've definitely heard more about Criss Angle (sic) ruining the show than the performers. People just don't like tuning in to watch arrogant entertainers, even if they're playing the part of a judge. An argument could be made that American Idol has great success, in spite of Simon Cowell. But, Simon is not an entertainer (i.e. one of the contestant's peers) - he is a qualified businessman in the music industry, and while he may be a tad on the blunt side, at least he doesn't act like he's a better performer. It's an important distinction.

And yes, we should all learn from this show. A lot.

-Mike
Why doesn't it tickle when I tickle myself, but it still hurts when I stick a fork in my eye?
Decomposed
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Quote:
On 2007-10-25 17:26, arnon wrote:
Some points:

1. Can anyone here visualize Richard Osterlind performing any effect of his, on any video of his, in the TV slot alloted to the mentalists on Phenomenon?

2. How would Richard's performance stack up?

3. Why must some posts be as long-winded as their mentalism presentations probably are? Not all of us are boring - don't blame the art form for that.

Arnon



A delay but I would have loved seeing RO on stage in Phen. And I can visualize it also. He makes a great connection to any audience he performs for and has performed mentalism/magic for huge audiences live.
Parson Smith
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I felt a shot across my bow.
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HeyLockwood
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I dunno - I'm a big fan of Osterlind, but the format of the show might have been more than he'd want to tackle. And I just can't stand the thought of him having to listen to CA's opinion...

-Mike
Why doesn't it tickle when I tickle myself, but it still hurts when I stick a fork in my eye?
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