In recently weeks I have had many people try and tell me certain tricks including the cups and balls are out dated have no real magical value. well I am sure as many of you find this to be pure rubbish. I am a ameteur performer so I don’t have regular performances yet, but I did the Vernon routine at my house this weekend for my brother and several of his friends and his girlfriend. they had never seen magic before expect TV specials ect ect but never in person. during the ball vanish several comments where made on " where did they go" and "what the ..." all the sequences worked well and the final loads really hit home.

what I am getting at is with something that obviously plays so well, is fun to watch and a total mystery. why do you fellows think that many, some that are well known, regard the "trick" as outdated, and only useful for study

Joshua, I do not know who mentioned that and whatever they say will not take my strong belief that cups and balls is a real classic and a real corner stone to the foundation of magic. What is important is what I believe in and not what others say about cups and balls.

Because they're too busy trying to push the newest thing, and if everyone knew that you could find powerful magic in the oldest forms then the crap they sell wouldnt sell at all.
don't get me wrong, some folks look at the c&b like a puzzle, but it's good magic nonetheless.
I think in many ways, it falls on the magician. I mean the sponge rabbits are probably one of the cheesiest routines on the planet, but laypeople love'em. So guys do the routine. Me, I hate the sponge bunnies but I recognize why people like them. So, I understand why it's still good magic.
The cups and balls represent so many (8) of the basic principals of magic. Too many Magi forget that only studying on a subject and not actually applying it or attempting it in front of an audience does nothing for them. They will never see the simplicity of the magic in the cups and balls. And this is their loss.

Just the way I see it...

I'll bet you heard this comment from a fellow magician who does not perform the cups and balls. This effect takes a lot of work to perform professionally and smoothly, with good presentation and patter. It also takes tremendous imangination and creativity to produce a routine that is truly your own. Unfortunately, some magicians are not willing to put that kind of work into an effect.

Don't let their comments deter you.

Kent

Thanks for the comments. it does not deter me at all. I figured it might make good discussion as its a real einigma to me as why they think that why

Kent, you said it all. C&B takes a lot of study and practice to perform competently. A lot of magicians simply can't be bothered when there are so many non-sleight-of-hand tricks around. Never mind, their loss is our gain.

Fortasse

Actually it depends on who made the comments and why. Is there any motive behind those statements made by them? Are they serious cups and balls workers? Or should I say ... can they do cups and balls?

As mentioned by BAH1313, they could also be trying to sell their wares and hype how good these items are, etc, etc.

Some people just like cups and balls while others may just hate it. But it does not justify making a comment like that.

Good thread, Joshua

It came up originally with me talking about cylinder and coins. people said it does not work, cause of the wand and the cylinder. both I disagree with. I downplay the imporantance of the cylinder as a simple peaice of paper ( and it is ) but that's another discussion.

anyway several comments were made that both routines cups and cylinder is "antique" magic. can they do them? I don't know. maybe they never took the time and after one day of practice they blew thier performance.

Usually (this is only my assumption) this kind of reactions only indicate their ignorance about these classics. I believe their reactions did not show any genuine interest on the cups and cylinders - which only indicate (again my assumption) their lack of interest or complete ignorance to the subject.

I ALWAYS "put down" the cups and balls...when I'm finished using them.

Posted: Oct 8, 2007 12:38pm
I really think anyone that "puts down" a trick (like C&Bs) doesn't get it... what actually was most likely the case was a LOUSY PERFORMER.

This is a good one, Pete

One word to sum up the Cups and Balls, "Classic". It has withstood the test of time. Being a classic is far from being 'antique' or 'outdated'.

I put down the cups and balls whenever I decide I need a cup of coffee.

I drink a lot of coffee!

Cups and Balls are without any doubt the essential of a magician. So many principles and effects and above all it is very welcomed by any audience.
It can also give you lot of pleasure!!

I remember reading a book by a well known professional magician who said that he didn't like the cups and balls because "once the ball has gone from your pocket to the cup again, the only thing left is the big load."
He wasn't slating the C&B, he was saying that the C&B wasn't his style.

I agree with him that if something is not your style then you can "walk away" but I disagree with his "the only thing left..."
I have performed the C&B and received great reactions from the pre-final load parts of the routine.

During his recent shows earlier this summer Eric DeCamps chose Cups and balls as his closing effect. Based on the performance I saw it was well recieved by the audience.

I think masny perfromers focus on the latest and greatest, neglecting tricks that have been popular for centuries. And learning cups is more effort than many are willing to put forth, even a simple routine takes time to learn and get smooth.

Palmer... do you know a musical intrument guy in Hawaii named Harry Timmins? He thinks he knows you. He's a cousin of my wife.

When I first got into magic I over looked C&B's for no reason other than knowing nothing about the routines. I unfortunately bypassed Sponge balls as well because I thought it was kid magic!
Now I wish the guy at the magic shop had NOT done his job by selling me all the latest/greatest stuff going. I wish he had directed me to C&B's and Sponges since it has been those 2 have taken my coin work to the next level and taught me about presentation, misdirection, patter etc etc etc!
I am still a raw novice at all this but I think I have learned more and had more fun in the short time as a C&B junkie than anything else!
Let the nay sayers have their way Josh, the fewer that do C&B, the better we can look IMO!
Mick

The only "outdated" thing that I see is that the venues available to us now seem to offer fewer opportunities to perform the cups and balls.

The trick, itself, is very modern, actually.

No, I don't. There is a good chance that he knew my dad, though.