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Tom Riddle Special user Chelsea, UK 507 Posts |
"Entertaining children is not a gift, it is not learned naturally, it is obtained from others." Dennis Michael
This statement was made recently on "the rabbits" thread by Dennis, and I believe it is a subject worthy of further discussion. It did not really belong on the rabbits thread, so it would be interesting to see what everyone thinks about this. For the record, I believe entertaining children IS a gift.
"Yes, Virginia, there really are people named Riddle...isn't that AMAZING! And to think of all the royalties I'm missing out on! SCANDALOUS!"
Thomas Williamson Riddle III Chelsea, UK |
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Rodney Palmer Inner circle 1317 Posts |
Tom, you have to have a Natural ability to entertain children. And YES! I believe it is a Gift that one is given to be able to entertain children. I once had a Principal tell me the following after doing a Young 4's Magic Show. " It is amazing how you kept 4 year olds entertained for 40-minutes that is a Gift that has been given to you and the way you are using that Gift is awesome" Children are not easily entertained they need a lot of visual to keep them entertained and they do get bored easily. I believe that your personality also plays a key part in your magic abilities. Children can SPOT a FAKE from a mile away. And you also have to really LIKE KIDZ in order to entertain them and they really know if you truly like them or not. I am a BIG Guy 6'5" and weigh over 260lbs. and kids just flock to me as I am the Gentle Giant. I have a Great Spirit when it comes to entertaining children.
Rodney
"Creating Memories That Last A Lifetime"
In order to keep "MAGIC ALIVE" Please become a Mentor to a Young Person. |
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One Man Elite user Frederick, MD 491 Posts |
A truly great entertainer has to have the gift.
A voice teacher once told me she could teach anyone to sing but not everyone could become a great singer. I think you can learn the mechanics of entertaining children and get by but to achieve a level of artistry you need that something extra. Kevin |
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
Children either like you or they don't, it is a gift. You can learn what kinds find funny and use that but you will never learn to have kids think you are a good guy unless you are born with it. I, frankly, don't understand it because if I was a kid I'd be scared of me but for some reason they like me. I've even had kids follow me out of stores and I've had to drag them back in, one kid even told his father that he wished I was his dad, that went over like a lead balloon.
Is Dennis Michael that fellow who is on here? Perhaps he can better explain his point. I am thinking he must have to work at winning over kids so he may believe that his point is valid. |
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Donald Dunphy Inner circle Victoria, BC, Canada 7563 Posts |
Perhaps, you don't understand the perspective of another.
What if a person didn't believe in any natural gifts at all? Are they wrong, for not believing what you believe? Or maybe they are communicating one idea, while you mean another? Or maybe they just said something in a way that maybe they didn't really mean? Should they be "grilled" for an innocent mistake (accused / inferred of being a less than adequate performer, having to "work at winning over kids", etc.)? I have always found that an attitude of "grilling" (pushiness), makes it hard for people to see things from a different point of view. - Donald P.S. I have been called "gifted", but I also believe in that perspective. I believe in the concept of partial "natural gift", partial "learned talent". It was also told to me much later on, and not as much earlier. Does that mean I wasn't born "gifted"?
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
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Al Angello Eternal Order Collegeville, Pa. USA 11045 Posts |
I agree with Kevin
Childrens entertainers are in large demand, some are in it for the easy money, and others of us would be lost without it. You can read all the courses, buy all the self working magic tricks to be a success, but those of us who have the calling to entertain kids are told by parents all of the time "it is easy to see that you love what you do", so are you an artist, or a technician, only you can judge.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/ "Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone" |
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
Donald, did you miss the part where I asked Dennis to come and clarify? Let us not call it a gift. Some individuals are born with certain attributes that is not common among the majority. This may be coordination, a singing voice, an ability to process mathmatical problems, etc.. There are some people that kids are drawn to. There is no reason for it but it exist. There are some people who kids could do without but they wtill can do magic shows.
Do note I fully expect those that children are not drawn to to not believe such a thing exist. |
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TrickyRicky Inner circle TrickyRicky 1653 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-10-12 11:52, First Class Magician wrote: Rodney. That is why you are a (First Class Magician). Well said in your post. Richard (Tricky Ricky) |
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Regan Inner circle U.S.A. 5726 Posts |
I am a singer/songwriter/guitar player, and I also play some other instruments but not as well as I can play guitar. I know I was born with a certain amount of talent. I was singing at a fairly, early age. However, I didn't really discover that I had the talent or ability to play an instrument until I was about 16-17 years old. I wanted to play guitar, but had never tried. When I first picked up a guitar, I didn't just magically start being able to play anything I wanted to. I had to work at it.
I think you all can see where I am going with this. I believe you have to have some degree of talent if you are ever going to be good at something. Talent alone will get you nowhere if you don't apply it and strive to keep improving it. So come on guys, let's quit wasting time arguing about this point, and let's start channeling this energy at honing our talent and skills! Regan
Mister Mystery
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Donald Dunphy Inner circle Victoria, BC, Canada 7563 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-10-12 14:28, MagicSanta wrote: No, I didn't miss that, MagicSanta. However, the WAY that request was made by some might have come across as more than a simple request for clarification. I agree with Regan, it might be time to move on. - Donald P.S. Is it "entertaining" kids that's a gift, or "working with" kids that's a gift, or both? Every moment you are around a child, do you need to be "entertaining" to them?
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
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Al Angello Eternal Order Collegeville, Pa. USA 11045 Posts |
Regan
How many men do you know that would wear that spooky makeup that you have on? Guys Are you an artist, or a technician????
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/ "Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone" |
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kimmo Inner circle Sheffield 1193 Posts |
I'd like to post the following from another forum. It was a post by RONNIE MCLEOD and I quote it here with his permission. I've changed a couple of names to protect the innocent (or guilty!). It might provide some food for thought.
'Someone without a natural bent for entertaining children who sweats and studies with great seriousness and who overcomes their natural disadvantages and yet becomes a master despite the difficulties is more to be applauded than someone who has a natural ability but out of laziness does not pay attention to the details. It is not just a matter of technical perfection and in fact very little technical handling ability is required to entertain children. However there are other skill sets that have to be mastered and they are all presentation ones which are actually more difficult to attain than technical ones. If someone who is not naturally a showman manages somehow to overcome the difficulties and make a success of things anyway they are to be applauded more than someone who has a natural ability just given to them by the Gods. The former has had to work at it and the latter hasn't done a bloody thing. In other words if you are blessed by the Gods you are just a lucky b***** and deserve no praise at all so there is no point getting a swelled head but if you have a pathetic personality and somehow by the sweat of your brow manage to overcome this defect you are more to be praised than someone who has just had it handed to them on a plate. The trouble is with this argument is that it makes Magician 1 equal to Magician 2. Magician 2 has a natural talent for showmanship and he doesn't have to do a *** thing for it. He hardly does any shows but yet he can equal any mentalist who does 5 shows a week. I know this may seem impossible but it happens to be true. In my opinion he is to be scorned more than some less charismatic performer who by the sweat of his brow has managed to get to the top despite the lack of natural advantages. Magician 2 has looks, charisma and personality. But that was not given to him by hard work. It was given to him by the Gods and he doesn't deserve any particular praise for it. I have told him this on many occasions especially when he stares at himself for hours looking in a mirror saying "mirror, mirror on the wall, who is the fairest mentalist of them all?" Magician 1 on the other hand despite being a sleazeball of the first order deserves more praise since despite being devoid of charisma and personality by the sweat of his brow and intense study of magic learned to entertain children and did very well with it. When he performs children's entertainment he always looked very self conscious and as if he was giving a sermon in church and was worried if the Bishop was watching him. Stiff and self aware as he worked. Very tense and unrelaxed. He was not given natural relaxation on stage or good looks and natural charisma. However through work and sweat he managed to do well at his profession nevertheless. He tried hard to overcome his disadvantages and some of the time he succeeded. He is more to be praised than Magician 2 who just lets his natural charm do all the work for him. Just because you do not have natural ability does not mean you cannot entertain children. You CAN if you are willing to work hard to overcome your disadvantages. Most people have limitations. If you can overcome those limitations by the sweat of your brow you deserve more praise than someone who is able to entertain naturally but may neglect the fine details because of over confidence.
VISIT MY ONLINE STORE!: www.kimmomagicshop.com
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Donald Dunphy Inner circle Victoria, BC, Canada 7563 Posts |
Thanks, Kimmo, for passing those thoughts along.
- Donald
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
Note my statement was concerning children being drawn to certain individuals and not to the performance of magic. While some have a knack for it I do not and had to work at getting the timing and handlings right, a lot of practice. I think that a practiced magician can be as good as a guy who just catches on quickly. Now the guys who excel in the art are very much gifted.
As for the musician above I hold musicians above even the best of magicians...mostly because I have no musical talent. I like to listen to Steely Dan and when I hear their music, and music written by others, I realize that it is a gift and not something learned. As for Donald this is the first time I believe I've encountered him here and he seems to believe I'm someone else he knows and dislikes. I am not that individual, who ever it may be. Ronnie McLeod speaks well and is obviously a seasoned veteran in the performance of magic. |
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Donald Dunphy Inner circle Victoria, BC, Canada 7563 Posts |
I have interacted with you on various threads, MagicSanta (or so I thought), and I like you just fine. I enjoy reading your posts and respect you greatly. You seem to have a wonderful perspective, even though it is different from mine sometimes.
- Donald
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
Magic for children is considered by some to not be
artistic but I think that isn’t true at all. Many of us really work hard at what we do and while you all are keepers of the flame the other magicians are not so kind. Lets face it, we have an obligation to keep working everyday to make our magic look great and be funny. who out there thinks kids magic shouldn’t be funny? I can’t think of anyone who wants their kids show to be somber but there may be someone. Realize that you represent magic to these kids and all our future magicians come out of those lil’ children catching you at a birthday or festival. So, put on a smile, keep ‘em laughing, and you will be the hero of the day in some kids eyes. |
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Tom Riddle Special user Chelsea, UK 507 Posts |
Well, I think this is turning into a most enlightening debate. I agree with much of what is being said. I LOVE the post by Mr. Mcleod. It is interesting, however, that he puts "Gods" in the plural. Maybe he is a Hindu! However, from his name it seems more likely that he would be "Church of Scotland!" I will have more to say on the subject matter shortly. Let us see if Dennis will make a contribution first.
"Yes, Virginia, there really are people named Riddle...isn't that AMAZING! And to think of all the royalties I'm missing out on! SCANDALOUS!"
Thomas Williamson Riddle III Chelsea, UK |
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TomBoleware Inner circle Hattiesburg, Ms 3163 Posts |
"Entertaining children is not a gift, it is not learned naturally, it is obtained from others."
I think what Dennis is saying here is that the entertaining part can be learned by most anyone with a desire to do so. I don’t believe he is saying that kids aren’t naturally attracted to some adults more than others. Actually, he said about the same thing that Ronnie said. “Just because you do not have natural ability does not mean you cannot entertain children. You CAN if you are willing to work hard to overcome your disadvantages.” Sometimes children love you for who you are, but they can also love you for what you do. If you can learn to do things well that they enjoy, why wouldn’t they like you more? I think by simply going out of your way to please kids is somewhat of a love for them, and that is the part that they can easily pick up on, and that is what makes up the better performer. Tom
The Daycare Magician Book
https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/amazekids/the-daycare-magician/ My Blog - https://boleware.blogspot.com/ |
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
I don't know anything about either gent but they likely would be pals, Ronnie and Dennis.
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Dr Mage Veteran user Southern California 332 Posts |
"Entertaining children is not a gift, it is not learned naturally, it is obtained from others."
Entertaining children is a gift...and a curse. If you have the gift, children can tell. They will gravitate to you, and there is no escape.
What is the color of magic?
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