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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » Jeff Dunham & Achmed the Dead Terrorist (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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The Drake
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Quote:
On 2007-10-28 18:01, Joey Stalin wrote:
I think you're the one distracting or twisting from the topic. You don't like it, and your point to continue stating this is? I guess if I post anything from Dave Chappelle's show you'll hijack the thread and rant as well? lol


Ummmmmm... a video was posted and I said it thought it was offensive. When others debated it with a different opinion I continued a discussion. How is that distracting or twisting the topic?

Dave Chappelle??? I haven't seen a lot of his stuff but what I have seen is great. My favorite is the " Blind KKK leader who doesn't know he IS black" That is comedy that makes the right kind of statement. So with that said.. Go ahead and post stuff from Dave Chappelle. If you can find the KKK clip I'd appreciate it.

Best,

Tim
NJJ
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On 2007-10-28 14:06, MagicSanta wrote:
Whoa...'sins of the past', are you saying the US sinned in fighting Japan?


Starts with H, rhymes with Diroshima.
Joey Stalin
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On 2007-10-28 17:41, Dannydoyle wrote:
The part that is distubing is that if it wasn't the puppet it could not be done.


Kind of the point of ventriloquism, for some off reason just talking to his hand wouldn't be as funny.
-A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths is a statistic.
-It is easier to fight for one's principles than to live up to them.
-The secret impresses no one. The trick you use it for is everything.

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balducci
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On 2007-10-28 17:11, stoneunhinged wrote:
I just watched it myself, and was frankly surprised at how innocuous it is. Most of the jokes are very generic--double entendres and such, like the couple of jokes at the end--and are in no way Muslim specific. The puppet (COOL PUPPET!) has a Middle East accent. Hmmm. Oh, and the virgins joke.

I have no strong feelings on the sketch one way or the other, but I would have to say that the turban on top of the puppet inherently makes the bit almost entirely Arab / Muslim-specific. There was also the anti-Jew rant made by the puppet that was also Muslim-specific (in a stereotypical way, mind you).

My only other two comments are these. I just didn't think the jokes were all that funny. The crowd must have been really drunk. And the Monty Python troupe would like their stolen "dead parrot" bits back.
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
The Drake
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Quote:
On 2007-10-28 18:32, Joey Stalin wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-10-28 17:41, Dannydoyle wrote:
The part that is distubing is that if it wasn't the puppet it could not be done.


Kind of the point of ventriloquism, for some off reason just talking to his hand wouldn't be as funny.


I don't think that's quite what Danny meant. (maybe you knew that) However... Wasn't it Jeff who did the routine where he talked to his hand as he transformed into various personalities?

Edit: Just checked and I am correct. I saw Jeff do this routine (bare hand) when he toured with Sugar Babies.

Best,

Tim
Joey Stalin
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On 2007-10-28 17:11, stoneunhinged wrote:
(not to mention this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UB5l5UIbSpc)

Jeff

You know that that link goes nowhere, right?
-A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths is a statistic.
-It is easier to fight for one's principles than to live up to them.
-The secret impresses no one. The trick you use it for is everything.

See you space cowboy...
The Drake
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Quote:
On 2007-10-28 18:42, Joey Stalin wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-10-28 17:11, stoneunhinged wrote:
(not to mention this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UB5l5UIbSpc)

Jeff

You know that that link goes nowhere, right?


Take the bracket of the end and you get this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UB5l5UIbSpc

Best,

Tim
NJJ
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Watching this video, I see very little actual racist humour.

He maybe crosses the line a couple of times with the Jews fighting over the penny, but most of it is about the stupidity of fundamentalism and suicide bombing, regardless of the race or religion of the terrorist.
Skip Way
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It's a comedy routine. Comedy is meant to be edgy! Chappelle does it! Rock does it! MAD TV does it in spades! When we can no longer laugh at ourselves then we may as push the button, turn out the lights and return this ravaged globe back to the roaches. Geesh!
How you leave others feeling after an Experience with you becomes your Trademark.

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Leland Stone
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Good point, Skip. My Dad was half Scottish, loved tight-fisted Scotsman jokes (that two-penny bit plays in Edinburgh as well as it does in the Borscht Belt); Mom's half-Italian, doesn't mind threatening to "introduce me to Jimmy [Hoffa] if I don't behave," and has never found "do-wop" songs offensive. Come to think of it, Carlos Mencia has somehow taken the most pejorative terms gabacho culture ever hurled at Mexicans and heaved 'em right back into our Yanqui faces...and we LOVE it.

Not sure I'm following the math on this thread: One hundred million fundamentalist Islamic zealots are seething to die or kill in order to globally enact their version of sharia, but nine hundred million moderate Muslims should be upset about ...one puppet? The guy carrying the foam dummy is more threatening than the guy carrying C4 and ball bearings?

The Tuskogee Airmen didn't b*tch about segregation, they got up in the air and they taught a bunch of racist hillbillies how to fly; Billy Jean King didn't whine about the boorish chauvinism of Bobby Riggs, she simply humiliated him on the tennis courts; JK Rowling didn't waste her time sniveling about the second-class treatment of single mothers on the dole, but wrote her way to respect.

Taking a lesson from that playbook, 900 million moderate Muslims could do more for their own cause than all the political correctness and good intentions of the non-Muslim world combined. How about an anti-fatwah or a safe-house for Salman Rushdie? How about CAIR issuing a condemnation of Khartoum and a demand for Koranic mercy towards animistic or other non-Muslim Sudanese? Or a grass-roots outpouring of sympathy and support for the families of slaughtered Russian schoolchildren, and outrage towards their Islamo-fascist butchers?

Stereotyping? Bad. Complaining about the decor in the room while ignoring the elephant? Worse.

Leland
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Hey, I never said my in laws were Muslims, I said they were Arabic, Palestinians to be exact. You made an assumption that all Arabs are Muslim, the inlaws are Eastern Orthidox Christians as are a great many people in that region. I must insist you stop stereo typing people based on race! Next thing you know you'll be saying Iranians are Arabs. First slave stealing then Japanese internment, now stereotyping Arabs....I won't even go into the accusations of torture brought up by the Taliban yesterday against Canada (actually I think that was a case of a Celine CD being put on loud enough for the Taliban to hear it).
The Drake
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Skip,

I agree with your comment but then so again does Michael Richards...Hmmmmm where back to the same old arguement of where the line is again.

Leland,

Firstly... I don't think its really a 100 million Muslims out there wanting to die or kill for their religion. I'm not sure where Magic Santa got that 10% figure from. It could be a fact that 10 percent see violence as a way to defend their religion if attacked or it could be that we're getting only a very slim view of the facts. If Christians were asked if they'd defend their religious freedom with violence I suspect more than 10 percent would say yes. History will back me up on this. Does this mean Christians are all radical?

I like your point that people should do something instead of just whining. You give some good examples. I agree that people should do something about it..but does that mean that we should also ignore prejudice when we see it and leave it up to those being victimized by it to pull themselves up and out of it?

You mentioned the Tuskegee Airmen. They were indeed heroes and examples for all humanity. I don't think they would have made it to those cockpits however if not for others outside of their race standing up and saying what's right and what's wrong. If we simply said its up to others in their own race to make it happen for them..would it have happened???

Staying with the Tuskegee Airmen... Look at all the terrible Hollywood stereotypes laughed at and accepted as quality entertainment during that era. We thought it was ok then but now know better. I'm sure then many people said.... "I know a black person and they don't seem offended by it." I'm sure many were not. BUT many were and it sent the wrong message. I'm thinking some day we as a population will think the same of this routine. BTW... I'm Canadian and enjoy most of the Canadian jokes I hear . Its all in good fun. If the jokes painted us all as killers of innocent people I don't think I'd find that so great.

Several of my friends have performed in the UAE. I suspect Jeff has as well. The UAE is very pro-western and not involved in any of this terrorist nonsense. Do you think Jeff would perform this routine there? Would you perform this routine there if you were Jeff?

Best,

Tim

P.S. This is my official acknowledgment that even though I swore it'd never happen again. MagicSanta bested me AGAIN. Most of his earlier posts in the thread were designed one for reason and that was to see if any gullible Café members would bite the flame hook. (if they were Canadian fish all the better ) I did bite. It was only at the end that I realized I have been fodder. MagicSanta... You are evil, EVIL I tell you. Next time I REALLY will be ready for you. LOL
Doug Higley
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"Look at all the terrible Hollywood stereotypes laughed at and accepted as quality entertainment during that era. We thought it was ok then, but now know better."

Really? Who knows better?

Martin Lawrence' characterizations?...and the many others on TV...

The stereotypical jive *** clowns in Rap? All dress the same, act the same, speak the same, unintelligible 'know what I'm sayin' over the top junk talk. You think maybe they don't embarrass a huge block of Black people that work to avoid stereotypes?

I don't know about that. If you don't act the comical fool your out.

'We' have learned nothing.
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The Drake
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Well said Doug,

I spoke too soon it seems. It does still exist as it is protected by free speech. It has an audience but isn't accepted as it was years ago.

We have learned something though. Back then Black actors only got cast in roles written as a black character. This was something I never really noticed until Bill Cosby mentioned it in an interview once. The script would have to say.."William is a black man" in order for a black actor to get the part. These days it doesn't quite work that way. The consumer market is more interested in talent and popularity than what color or religion he/she is.

Quote:
On 2007-10-30 13:23, Doug Higley wrote:
I don't know about that. If you don't act the comical fool your out.


My answer to that is Will Smith, Sidney Potier, Denzel Washington, Morgan Freeman, Bill Cosby and Samuel L Jackson,Nichelle Nichols...etc.

Best,

Tim
The Drake
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On 2007-10-30 12:54, MagicSanta wrote:
Hey, I never said my in laws were Muslims, I said they were Arabic, Palestinians to be exact. You made an assumption that all Arabs are Muslim, the inlaws are Eastern Orthidox Christians as are a great many people in that region. I must insist you stop stereo typing people based on race!


Well said!

My Egyptian friends ( who are Muslims ) wish me a Merry Christmas each year. I was surprised at this at first which proved to be ignorance on my part as they told me of their many Christian friends living in Egypt who celebrate Christmas.

Best,

Tim
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'My answer to that is Will Smith, Sidney Potier, Denzel Washington, Morgan Freeman, Bill Cosby and Samuel L Jackson, Nichelle Nichols...etc.'

Agreed. Add Jeffery White (Who can and does play ANYTHING. An Awesome actor.) Cuba Gooding Jr. is a master actor as well who has pretty much avoided the stereotype. (He needs better roles!)

I think the finest ensemble that covered all the ground and was as real as it gets was 'Glory'. In my top 5 of all time.
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Just because someone can break out of a stereotype, doesn't make it right.
Magic is doing improbable things with odd items that, under normal circumstances, would be unnessecary and quite often undesirable.
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Yes it do.
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Josh Riel
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No, they don't. Without stereotypes how can we efficiently make fun of people?

This method for turning a group of people into an individual has been in place for millennia and for good reason. It's too hard to keep track of a lot of different people and make fun of or imprison them. Like the Canadians do.
Magic is doing improbable things with odd items that, under normal circumstances, would be unnessecary and quite often undesirable.
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The above was a opinion and as such (Although correct) is not necessarily the opinion of Josh Riel or Josh Riel Incorporated.... Even if it is in fact Josh's (Very correct) opinion.
Magic is doing improbable things with odd items that, under normal circumstances, would be unnessecary and quite often undesirable.
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