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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » Jeff Dunham & Achmed the Dead Terrorist (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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GlenD
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Ehh... as I also said, I did not find the routine all that funny. If you're watching a tv show or movie or whatever and you get offended by the content then walk out or turn the channel. No big deal. Who said anything about comedy on comedy central as being good clean fun?

GlenD
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stoneunhinged
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Quote:
On 2007-11-21 15:58, balducci wrote:
That's okay? You think the average Jew and Catholic bishop shares in the joke as much as you do?


Well, they do if they have a sense of humor.

Why not make fun of people? Why not make fun of them because of their color or religion or alcoholic disposition or the size of their baby maker? Who makes the rules here?

What bothers me about this whole discussion is that there seem to be people who think that it is unethical to hurt people's feelings. So? I get my feelings hurt daily--I don't ask for compensation or for people to be forced to shut up.

I wish we lived in a tougher world. I think a tougher world would be--paradoxically--more sensitive, because people would be forced to think about souls and hearts and what makes people truly love and hate rather than focusing on all this superficial "I wear a cowboy hat and don't you dare make fun of me for wearing it" stuff.

I wear my cowboy hat in public all the time, and people laugh openly in the streets. I wear it anyway, because I'm not a silly crybaby. Well, I am, but not about my hat.

When it comes to humor, anything goes, period. Nothing is or should be sacred. Once things become off limits, we are depriving ourselves of the primary function of humor, which is to remind us that we are not gods. (Go ask Aristophanes.) To say I cannot make fun of, say, someone with a pink forehead is to say that a person with a pink forehead is a god.

Is some humor rude? Yes. Is some humor disgusting? Yes. Is some humor inappropriate? Of course. So what? IS IT FUNNY? If so, then laugh. If your laughter offends, think about who you are and why you think something offensive is funny...and learn from it.

Folks...if you don't allow it, you'll never learn from it.

I'll repeat, because I've had a lot of Guinness tonight and I'm very wise when I've been drinking: If you don't allow something to be joked about, you'll never learn anything from the joke.

And we are on this earth to learn.

WORD!

Jeff
balducci
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Quote:
On 2007-11-21 17:48, stoneunhinged wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-11-21 15:58, balducci wrote:
That's okay? You think the average Jew and Catholic bishop shares in the joke as much as you do?


Well, they do if they have a sense of humor.

Why not make fun of people? Why not make fun of them because of their color or religion or alcoholic disposition or the size of their baby maker? Who makes the rules here?

You think saying "Jews are so cheap they'll fight over a penny" or "Catholic bishops are all homosexuals" as done in the Achmed routine really qualifies as jokes?

Playing off a stereotype to make a joke is one thing. Simply stating a stereotype in order to get a laugh is a cheap and rather tasteless attempt at humour.

Of course, that's just my opinion. Maybe I just don't find 'obvious' or cheap attempts at humour very funny.

I saw "snakes on a plane" this evening (which incidentally isn't all that bad of a movie ... at least not nearly as bad as some reviews made out). There is a male steward on the flight. Everyone assumes he's gay because of his look, voice, and demeanor. At one point he mentions his girlfriend. A passenger says "girlfriend, yeah, right". At the end of the flight we find out that the steward really isn't gay and actually has a hot girlfriend. It's sort of a funny little scene near the end of the movie. In that case, they successfully played off a stereotype to make a joke. But the stereotype itself wasn't the joke.
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We had a get together at my home this weekend and watched Jeff's routine with a few couples we associate and perform with. The overall consensus was Jeff's routine is genius and carefully done. Afterwards, a discussion broke out regarding some of Jeff's stereotypical bits and surprisingly there was more outrage over the 'comedy' found on Comedy Central, BET and HBO.

Our final analysis was in the end; to each their own. We can't mandate morality, ethics or prevent the use of stereotypes in entertainment - but we can do our best to ensure our routines are produced and designed as carefully as possible when dealing with the hot topics of the day. Jeff took risks - no question about it, but that's the difference between a professional and an amateur. In this case his risks paid off...in the future, he may not be so lucky.
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Samuel Catoe
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It's comedy folks. Nothing more. Personally, I liked it. I liked it even more when he first began using the puppet. It was not Achmed; it was Osama Bin Laden. It was more topical then than it would be now, but was just funnier than heck. I have to ask though if it would be better if it were a dead crusader that was being depicted? It's the same thing. Just because someone was a crusader doesn't make them a christian, but many were. Just because someone is a terrorist doesn't mean they are muslim but many are. So the puppet is muslim, ao what. Walter is a mean old man, but we don't sit here and fuss because he's making fun of old men.

Does this mean I am in favor of making fun of muslims or terrorists or old men? YES. It does. I am in favor of anything that's funny. No one should be exempt. If you're offended because someone makes fun of your group, grow some thicker skin. If someone is making fun of a race to degrade them in the eyes of others, shame on them for doing it and shame on us for laughing to it. That was not the case here. Dunham was not degrading a race of people. He was making fun of the terrorists who attacked the US so recently. Period. Not muslims, not arabs, the terrorists who attacked us. They just happen to be muslim and arabian. Had they been communist and chinese, they puppet and routine would have reflected that.

If you didn't like the routine, don't watch it. If you liked it, do like I did and buy it so you can watch it until your wife's ears bleed.
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I know this topic is old but I just have to add my two cents to it....like many have said on the post..."its comedy people"....his "racial" comedic performance isn't new....George Carlin, Richard Pryor, Eddie Murphy, Andrew Dice Clay,George Lopez, Carlos Mencia, Jeff Dunham and the list goes on and on have racial jokes. You shouldn't take it so personal, if you do then don't watch it. Carlos Mencia is a perfect example, he says in his shows that he's going to talk about situations and events that we are afraid to say outloud, jeff's comedy is hilarious, he's not just talking about one race or culture, he has "bubba Jay" a nascar loving beer drinking redneck, "Sweet Daddy Dee" a flashy dressing smooth talking money hungry black agent, "Jose Jalepeno" a cuban/mexican immigrant with a slow lazy speaking strong accent who loves to sing and romance the ladies, "ahmed the terrorist", a muslim sucicide bomber who stongly believes in his culture and pokes fun about his sucicide training....Now with that said it doesn't mean that all white people are beer drinking nascar watching rednecks or all black people are smooth talking money hungery people, or all hispanics have a strong lazy accent and sing all day to romance there women or that all muslims are terrorists...It's freakin entertainment. My opinion is that jeff is doing a great job, he's very funny and talented and I can't wait for a 3rd tv special....Mandrake I thank you for posting, it was fun or should I say entertaining. and you can't forget about Walter, that character is my favorite.
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ed rhodes
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Quote:
On 2007-10-28 14:04, MagicSanta wrote:
During World War 2 they DID go after the Japanese in cartons (see Bugs Bunny and Popeye).


There was also a magazine cartoon justifying the internment of Japanese in California. It showed a long line of Japanese men, each giving the next one orders, stretching from California to the Emperor in Japan! It was drawn by Dr. Seuss!

You mentioned Popeye. I have two cartoons from Paramount with Superman. In one, "The Japatours," Superman stops a group of Japanese spies who are trying to steal a prototype airplane. (Think an aircraft carrier in the sky.) In another "The Eleventh Hour" SUPERMAN is the terrorist as he destroys some aspect of Japan's military each night at exactly 11:00!

Quote:
On 2007-10-28 16:16, MagicSanta wrote:
100 million hate filled Muslims? That makes me feel better. I doubt many of them watched the show in question so no harm no foul.

I have an announcement to make:

During World War Two the racist collective known as Canada interned people of Japanese decent....a total of 22,000 of them in fact. Canada, forcing people from their homes and locking them into camps. Unlike the US, which kept families together, Canada sent the men to.....WORK CAMPS with out their families. It should also be noted that the US allowed the interned to file suits against the policy, no record of this in Canada, and that the US ended the practice in 1944, five years before the hate filled Canadians. The US also paid money to the Japanese Americans and others of Japanese ancenstory detained (not enough in my opinion because many lost farm lands worth millions today) and issued an apology, again I could find no record of this occuring in Canada. It should also be noted that the thousands of German, Italian, and other European (that is right kids, caucasians) that were put into internment camps were not paid nor did they, as of 2004, receive an official apology.

I swear before God and man that I shall NEVER allow Canada to take advantage of a race of people like that again!


Thank you Magicsanta. I was unaware of other countries locking up Japanese. I thought it was pretty much just California.

Were any Germans or Italians locked up here? Seems to me we were at war with them too!
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[quote]On 2007-11-20 20:57, Timothy Drake wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-11-20 19:36, gabelson wrote:
The P.C. mania has died down a bit from where it was in the 90's, still, a show like "All In the Family" would probably not get greenlit by a major network today. Don't forget folks, the routine is NOT Achmed the MUSLIM, but Achmed the dead TERRORIST. So are we objecting to dead terrorists?


How many non-Muslim terrorists are suicide bombers? Since Achmed is a suicide bomber, unless you can show a lot of non-Muslim suicide bombers, depicting Achmed as a Muslim is fair game.

A man tries to leave Islam, he is sentenced to death! The courts determine that he can not be executed because he is insane. The priests thunder from the pulpit that the courts are corrupt and the man must be killed.

A couple is attacked and raped by a gang of men. I don't know if the men are ever caught, but the couple is tried and convicted of violating Islamic law by being out without a chaperone for the woman and sentenced to be whipped!

I am leary around the concept of Islam.

Hey! The Video's gone!
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"Dying all the time, lose your dreams and you could lose your mind.
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The Drake
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Mandrake,

This is an old thread and I think everything that anyone wanted to say was said and maybe a bit more than that ...LOL

Feel free to debate it but please don't quote me as I wish not to be dragged back into it reopen this old wound thread again. I had many battles in with many people and we all pretty much agree its water under the bridge.

Many Thanks,

Tim

Day 4
ed rhodes
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Quote:
On 2008-03-04 10:27, Timothy Drake wrote:
Mandrake,

This is an old thread and I think everything that anyone wanted to say was said and maybe a bit more than that ...LOL

Feel free to debate it but please don't quote me as I wish not to be dragged back into it reopen this old wound thread again. I had many battles in with many people and we all pretty much agree its water under the bridge.

Many Thanks,

Tim

Day 4


My apologies. It just took me awhile to come up with something to say.

I'm done.

Day 4
"There's no time to lose," I heard her say.
"Catch your dreams before they slip away."
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Ain't life unkind?"
The Drake
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Many Thanks,

In my rush to post I should have mentioned that I have a friendly or at least peaceful relationship with all those I clashed with here in this thread. I'm enjoyng that I'm not looking to turn that aspect around. LOL We're all good guys.. we just have a few different views.

Best,

Tim

Day 4
zifferinolpm
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Quote:
On 2007-10-28 11:38, Timothy Drake wrote:
Contrary to what appears to be popular opinion I find this video offensive to both Muslims and Jews. If this character were done with any other ethnic culture it'd be chastised but these days it seems to be Ok to bash Muslims.

Jeff is mega talented. I love all his other work. This is bad taste however.

Best,

Tim


Look, comedy is making fun of people, situations and circumstances. To say that this is in bad taste is crazy. Let's quit trying to be politically correct and loosen up a bit. You would have really loved this character back in 2001 when Jeff introduced him as Osama Bin Laden. Your head would have probabally exploded!
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I'm gonna see Jeff Dunham on Sept 25 in Columbus, OH. I saw him 4 years ago at the Funny Bone in Columbus, but I know he has new material.

In Jeff's defense, he picks on many different types of people, including himself. Who is worse, Jeff for making the jokes, or us for laughing at them...? I don't think any harm is being done.
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Brian S. Tanner
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I would first like to start off by saying I respect everyone's opinion. Even those with whom I disagree. With that, I'd like to voice my opinion on the subject.

It would seem to me that we are becoming too thin skinned in this country. We feel we must appease EVERYONE. It's getting to be absolutely ridiculous. I agree that we shouldn't make light of someone's personal tragedy. There's a limit. However, it just seems like you can't say "boo" without offending some people, and their delicate sensibilities. Enough already !

Most people will tell you that Blazing Saddles is one of the funniest movies they've ever seen. In this movie, Mel Brooks(a Jew) poked fun at everyone from Indians, ( I know "Native American" is the PC term. I still refer to them as Indians). Jews, Blacks, Hillbillies, Women, Gays, Nazis, Irish, and Chinese people.....and the list goes on. The movie is hysterical ! Is it P C ? No! Is it a polite little story ? Heavens no. Is it funny and entertaining even though certain ethnicities and faiths were messed with ? You bet your a#% !!!

See? Nobody got hurt. Nobody felt like a victim. Nobody who saw the movie was shattered, and rolled into a fetal position and cryed while they rocked themselves to sleep, after eating a bottle of sleeping pills.

If Dunham's character is truly insensitive to certain people, cannot the same be said of a magician, who slices, chops, cuts, saws, and impales his female asisstant(s)? Does this mean that the illusionist hates women, and wishes to use them at his whim and cause bodily harm ? Is he trying to OFFEND the females in his audience ? The answer: Certainly NOT !!!

Well, that's my feeling on the subject.
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zifferinolpm
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Quote:
On 2008-07-08 23:29, B to the T wrote:
I would first like to start off by saying I respect everyone's opinion. Even those with whom I disagree. With that, I'd like to voice my opinion on the subject.

It would seem to me that we are becoming too thin skinned in this country. We feel we must appease EVERYONE. It's getting to be absolutely ridiculous. I agree that we shouldn't make light of someone's personal tragedy. There's a limit. However, it just seems like you can't say "boo" without offending some people, and their delicate sensibilities. Enough already !

Most people will tell you that Blazing Saddles is one of the funniest movies they've ever seen. In this movie, Mel Brooks(a Jew) poked fun at everyone from Indians, ( I know "Native American" is the PC term. I still refer to them as Indians). Jews, Blacks, Hillbillies, Women, Gays, Nazis, Irish, and Chinese people.....and the list goes on. The movie is hysterical ! Is it P C ? No! Is it a polite little story ? Heavens no. Is it funny and entertaining even though certain ethnicities and faiths were messed with ? You bet your a#% !!!

See? Nobody got hurt. Nobody felt like a victim. Nobody who saw the movie was shattered, and rolled into a fetal position and cryed while they rocked themselves to sleep, after eating a bottle of sleeping pills.

If Dunham's character is truly insensitive to certain people, cannot the same be said of a magician, who slices, chops, cuts, saws, and impales his female asisstant(s)? Does this mean that the illusionist hates women, and wishes to use them at his whim and cause bodily harm ? Is he trying to OFFEND the females in his audience ? The answer: Certainly NOT !!!

Well, that's my feeling on the subject.
FWIW,
Brian


To which I say AMEN!
Harry H
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Id just like to say(if I didn't already in this overlong thread)that Jeff Dunham is not funny.

Don't care if it's offensive comedy-so long as it's funny comedy.
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For a guy who's "not funny", I'll bet he makes more money entertaining with a comedy act than most of his critics could. What about Lisa Lampinelli? She's an equal-opportunity offender, as well. Makes fun of everyone in the audience equally. How is it that these people "aren't funny", but continue to sell out big theaters?

When you say he's "not funny", that's a personal opinion. Let me ask you, how many times have you watched the "Achmed the Dead Terrorist" segment of that special? Why would you watch it entirely even once if it offends you? If there's something I find offensive (ex: Oprah Winfrey), I don't watch it. Unplug the TV and stay off youtube, and you won't be offended.

Steve
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Quote:
On 2008-07-09 17:31, Stevethomas wrote:
How is it that these people "aren't funny", but continue to sell out big theaters?


Pretty much the same way that people who nobody would call "talented chefs" sell a truckload of Big Macs.
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But...McDonald's critics aren't saying that the Four Star cuisine they serve isn't up to standards, either. You get what you expect. You want a laugh, you watch something funny. You know what you're getting before you go. You don't go see a street mime work and expect a Quiet Riot concert.

Steve
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At Christmas I got a Dunham dvd at a gift exchange. My wife and I watched it a few days later. Neither of us thought he was very funny (Achmed wasn't on it, but I don't mind politically incorrect humor, so that didn't enter into the equation). The audience was laughing, to the point that we seriously considered the possibility that it was an invited audience or friends, relatives and acquaintences.

I know that everyone likes different types of comedy. Some like Bill Cosby while others prefer Eddy Murphy - but at least both of them are funny! ;^)
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