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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Knots and loops » » Professors Nightmare...whoa (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Al Angello
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Eternal Order
Collegeville, Pa. USA
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Ian
You negelected to mention your body builder physique, and you matinee idole good looks.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com
http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/
"Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone"
magicians
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Now you know why I stood out in the big audition room. All those anorexic models and acrobats didn't stand a chance.
I am on a twelve step diet though, I never sit less than twelve steps from the buffet.
My broadcasting course teacher said I had a good face for radio.
I guess I can't have brains, talent And good looks. But I do a great Santa Clause, and a really slow dancing cane.
Thanks Al.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
magicians
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Here is an experimental move which I believe improves my "Dances with Ropes" effect. It is raw footage of the new segment. It could stand alone.
http://magicians.podbean.com/works-in-progress/

If the link does not work, go to http://www.magicians.tv and look for "works-in-progress" link. I shot this at noon today. In my estimation, it will eliminate a "fumble' factor". Your feedback is always appreciated.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
jolyonjenkins
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United Kingdom
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Ian - could you shoot this so that we can see the whole lengths of all three ropes to start with? At the moment the long and medium are hard to distinguish, apart from the fact that you tell us which is which.
Jolyon Jenkins
murf
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San Antonio, TX
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I'll second the motion from rjenkins. In several of your videos it's very difficult to see if there's really any difference in the length of the two longer ropes.

Murf
magicians
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Good feedback, I did it quickly and wasn't sure if it was visible.
I did it close-up at a club meeting tonight.
I will reshoot. Check out the same link at around 1 am.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
jolyonjenkins
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Yes that is clearer. I don't know the workings but it still seems strange that the medium and long ropes are so similar in length, compared to the short rope. I don't know whether this is a necessary feature of the method, and whether it could be improved.

Also what strikes me as very obvious is that there is more total rope at the end than at the start; whereas in the original PN the total is the same and the long rope has got shorter, as well as the short rope getting longer. In your version it's not clear that the long rope has got any shorter (if it has).

Of course someone seeing it for the first time might well not notice any of this.
Jolyon Jenkins
magicians
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Quote:
Yes that is clearer. I don't know the workings but it still seems strange that the medium and long ropes are so similar in length, compared to the short rope. I don't know whether this is a necessary feature of the method, and whether it could be improved.


The problem with your thinking is that you are associating the original effect and method with what you are seeing. Which is why this is called "dances with ropes" rather than calling it a "nightmare effect".
The premise of the professors nightmare is of course, that you are taking 3 different lengths and now they are equal.
The original patter for the nightmare is that you are "averaging" the lengths of the rope.
If you do not state the premise of the nightmare and just go with what is being said, you will allow yourself a different perspective.
All I say is that I have a small, medium, and long rope and now they are the same length. I am not saying that they are averaged out. Of course, the ropes are longer than they started out, that IS the trick.
The entire routine is shown in the other link, dances with ropes.
IN that routine, I start with the unequal, and do "average" out the rope lengths without noticeable difference in rope length and true to tradition, one gets short and one longer.

Segment two, was to do it again, but this time to have the three ropes separate and equal. (not a bad name for a rope effect or patter). To do this, I am not doing your Fathers method, I am doing the magicians fooler which also plays well to the layman.
So, back to your feedback, which I am greatful for. The actual rope lengths you are seeing are 14" 32" and 50". In actuality, segment one, does indeed average out to 3, 32"+/- ropes, then I go back. The proportions of the "start" are perfect.

Quote:
Also what strikes me as very obvious is that there is more total rope at the end than at the start; whereas in the original PN the total is the same and the long rope has got shorter, as well as the short rope getting longer. In your version it's not clear that the long rope has got any shorter (if it has).

Of course someone seeing it for the first time might well not notice any of this.

The deviation (this segment) is the strange one, where the three ropes become the same by becoming longer.
So, your comment is partially valid there, as the three ropes do become 50" lengths (longer than they started out)rather than averaged out. My question is, "is that a problem, or just part of a puzzle?"
The latest technique to do this might be too quick and not enough misdirection and I must consider that. The first method I used, simulated the placing of the three ropes into the hand, and having all three lengths out of sight for a moment and then they become the same. The "magic" may require the misdirection of that movement to remove that mental dilemna.
All of this routine developement was a challenge by the Café members to be able to do my original Professor Ian's nightmare, in the middle of the act, rather than as an opener. That method, was solved. But then, I decided to add some elements to become a routine that envelopes the linking ropes without requiring special preparations of the "stock" product.

The fact that two of the ropes grow, is perhaps acceptible in the context of the entire routine, and you are right. As a stand-alone effect, this would be more of a magicians puzzle.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
Al Angello
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Eternal Order
Collegeville, Pa. USA
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Ian
I've watched it a couple of times, and it is pure genius that once again will fool a magician. I have an idea how you do it but the more I know the more impressed I am. I'm sorry it took me a couple of days to get back to you but even magicians work occasionally.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com
http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/
"Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone"
jolyonjenkins
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OK, thanks for the clarification. I'd missed your performance of dances with ropes. I agree it makes more sense after the traditional PN. But, if the puzzle of this section is for two of the ropes to become longer, then might it not be a good idea for you to say so in your presentation? i.e. phase one is: all ropes become the same; phase two is: all ropes become the same, but there is more rope.

As it is in your live performance, phase 2 comes over as PN-to-fool-magicians (which it does very effectively).

I really like the linking ropes (as did your audience).

I realise that you were really asking for feedback on the handling rather than the routining. Obviously you've cracked the problem of how to incorporate it in the middle of a routine.

In the traditional PN, I've never really liked the handling where you bring the ends of the rope up together, because it seems unmotivated (and is also unnecessary). Is there any way in your version in which you could eliminate the draping-the-rope-over-the-hands move, so that you can just "stretch" the ropes?
Jolyon Jenkins
magicians
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If you get a chance to see the very first move in Dances, that's what I do.. A flash equal length then a flash restoration.
http://www.magicians.tv look for dances with ropes. I have done it better, but someone taped it live so I am going with it as a work in progress.
I will post each segment separately.
I am doing this as a test reaction thing before I release the finished project. This forum is a great asset to develope material and get International commentary and critique. I just have to remember not to get on the defensive since I asked for it.
This last move is different than on the "dances w ropes" demo. That had a fumble, which this variation eliminates. In the patter I am working on, I kind of acknowledge what "other magicians do", or "you've seen other magicians do this".
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
magicians
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Quote:
On 2008-02-02 17:42, magicians wrote:
If you get a chance to see the very first move in Dances, that's what I do.. A flash equal length then a flash restoration.
http://www.magicians.tv look for dances with ropes. I have done it better, but someone taped it live so I am going with it as a work in progress.
I will post each segment separately.
I am doing this as a test reaction thing before I release the finished project. This forum is a great asset to develope material and get International commentary and critique. I just have to remember not to get on the defensive since I asked for it.
This last move is different than on the "dances w ropes" demo. That had a fumble, which this variation eliminates. In the patter I am working on, I kind of acknowledge what "other magicians do", or "you've seen other magicians do this".

We shot the instruction and some nicer footage of my Dances with Ropes routine. My performance still has some minor flaws (mostly timing and patter)but this latest clip is bright and clear.
http://magicians.podbean.com/dances-with-rope/
or go to http://www.magicians.tv and search. For those of you who were waiting for the instruction, it should be ready mid week.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
Al Angello
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Eternal Order
Collegeville, Pa. USA
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Ian
I think that all of your moves have meaning now with the addition of words.
BEST YET
Al
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com
http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/
"Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone"
yachanin
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Hi Ian,

Sweet. Can't wait for mid week Smile

Regards, Steve
magicians
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Dances with Ropes DVD: Well, I worked on the editing for a day and a half now. I think I have it right. I put the demo, instruction, and theory behind each move. Plus each segment is taught separately. I include linking ropes instruction, plus my older linking ropes performance. I also included the original Professor Ians nightmare on the DVD. Runs 51 minutes. I will be trying out a lecture on just that routine on Friday. Bob Sanders will be there, he and I are lecturing at Magic by the bay in Tampa, fl. Not sure about pricing this, but I am including a set of Linking Ropes, so maybe convention prices of $39.99 might be reasonable.
All those who have helped in the developement of my effects have special pricing.
The video was shot by Chuck Smith who has the "Enigma the Video" Bi-monthly Video Magic magazine so the footage is clear.
The first copies have a green screen backdrop. Later versions will have some sort of magical backdrop as soon as I get my Chroma-key working.

-Magic Ian
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
Al Angello
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Eternal Order
Collegeville, Pa. USA
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Ian
I will hold off buying a set of linking ropes untill your DVD comes out.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com
http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/
"Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone"
magicians
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I am doing the lecture in Tampa on Friday on just the "dances with Ropes effect". The (almost final) cut of the DVD has several segments on it. First is a very fast looking professors nightmare, totally unexpected, then a second one using my "handling" from a move mentioned on another post. Also unepected.
Third is the "answer" to the Professor Ians nightmare that can be done at anytime in the act. The ropes may all be shown as separate equal lenghths.
Then you do linking ropes, then vanish one of the three ropes, but you then go from two equal lengths to three equal lenghths again, then finally the ropes are small medium and long.
I have slowed down all of the moves so as not to "race" the effects like Fibre optics. I was also careful NOT to have anything that is included in The Sanders, Sands, or Tabary routines.
Those routines are perfect compliments to mine and will blend nicely.
--------
Also included on the 55 minutes DVD is my original routine that has been downloaded, plus the linking rings change bag effect from my lecture, a 3 minute live show segment, plus one additional trick with rope and card.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
KyletheGreat
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Personally, I have had a set of linking ropes for a couple years now, and have never used them for reasons concerning practicality. I never could find a good excuse for using them.

HOWEVER, After seeing Ian combine them with the "Professor's Nightmare", the "Linking Ropes" now have a good usefull place to be.

Thanks for sharing that with me IAN!
Kyle Jarrard
"Entertainment at its Best"

http://www.kylesmagic.com
http://www.hypnobilly.com
magicians
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The rope lecture went well in Tampa. I was then asked to do the Friday evening show with an encore performance. I did the rope effect as the opener, then cards across, then finished with my own "slice-of-Hand" illusion, all well received.
I pretty much sold all of the DVD sets and ropes that I brought with me.
Thanks to all on the Café for your seeds of ideas that lead to the creation of "Dancing with ropes".
I will be posting the final patter and polished routine soon. The DVD is ready now.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
Bob Sanders
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For over thirty years I had no reason to change my rope routine. After the lecture Ian gave at Tampa, I will be making changes that I never believed could actually be done.

In Ian's hands, rope is magic!

Bob Sanders
Magic By Sander
Bob Sanders

Magic By Sander / The Amazed Wiz

AmazedWiz@Yahoo.com
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