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magicians Inner circle Teacher and Legend 2898 Posts |
Hey Al, I really thought you'd be impressed that I came up with the Panama Rope answer so fast. Truth is, I have been realizing that I had known far too many dead magicians. I feel like Forrest Gump sometimes. Rubbed elbows with all the past stars of magic and didn't even realize it.
I mean, what are the odds that I not only knew about Ted Collins, but learned his famous effect from him. We spoke about Bob Elliot before, and I remember being in the back of Tannens when he was "hanging around". He showed me some card effects and merely by virtue of being in the inner sanctom of the back room at Tannens, he then showed me the move. These other guys can quote their sources and name drop effects, but I was there, with these guys and they showed me the effects one on one. George Sands, Walter Gibson, Roy Fromer, Frank Garcia, Al Goshman, Dai Vernon, Tony Slydini, Bob Berg, Jerry Andrus, Derek Dingle, Jack Chanin and Ted Collins, just to name a few of the people I met and knew and learned from in my first few years of doing magic. Not just learned, but sat one on one having a drink or lunch during a convention. Having their hands guide me on a move. I never read their books, never watched the videos, rarely saw a lecture. I have been writing about some of the experiences of the past 30 years or so, you can see some of the text on my site: http://Magic-Ian.blogspot.com -Ian
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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Al Angello Eternal Order Collegeville, Pa. USA 11045 Posts |
Ian
I'm 62 how old are you?
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/ "Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone" |
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Andre Hagen Inner circle 1432 Posts |
Very impressive Ian. Paul Harris performed every effect in the Art of Astonishment in my living room and showed me every move. (He had to since I was photographing everything for the books, which I also edited.)
Now if I could just perform everything he showed me. Andy
Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one - Albert Einstein
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magicians Inner circle Teacher and Legend 2898 Posts |
There ya go Andy, we listen to these guys who banter about the effects and tell about moves, but we watched it first hand. Never met Paul Harris. Sold a lot of his videos though and a few of his effects.
I'm 57 Al, going on 90. I had lectured alongside Harris at Tannens, but we never spoke. Pretty cool to be involved in production. Bewteen Al and his Bob Little/Dushek connection, you and I, we just about covered all that's needed to cover. McBride once used a line, that the audience was applauding when they should have been kneeling.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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Spellbinder Inner circle The Holy City of East Orange, NJ 6438 Posts |
You can see Jim Gerrish perform the Panama Rope Effect as it was taught to him by Ted Collins on the DVD "The Wiz Kids Present: Rope Magic." This is a demonstration performance only, not giving the secret explanations. You can locate it by clicking on the Rope Drawer. Note: The way Ted (and Jim and Ted's other students) performed the Panama Rope is not quite the way it is described in Tarbell and not quite even the way it is described in Ted's own instructions that came with the original trick.
Professor Spellbinder
Professor Emeritus at the Turkey Buzzard Academy of Magik, Witchcraft and Wizardry http://www.magicnook.com Publisher of The Wizards' Journals |
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murf Loyal user San Antonio, TX 264 Posts |
Al, how do you define a "pop knot"? I think of them as the kind of knots that "pop" off the middle of the rope and fly into the audience. But judging by the context, you seem to be talking about something completely different, more like the knots that slide off the end of the rope.
Murf |
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
I was thinking the same thing Murf but figured it wasn't worth pursuing...I am glad you did though.
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Al Angello Eternal Order Collegeville, Pa. USA 11045 Posts |
Hi Murf, & Santa
I was talking about lots of different things, and I understand that it is hard for anyone to follow me. A pop knot is a knot that will pop off the rope when you pull on the ends. I have always done the over hand version, but my friend Todd showed me the one he learned from Mike Finney which is a square knot version. I have since looked through my Daryl rope DVD set and the square knot version is done both in the "Chinese rope chain" and the" Panama Rope Mystery" so to the best of my knowledge there are two kinds of pop knot. That being said the Mike Finney way of doing it is a different handling with the same results. Sometimes when I write I'm also thinking and then only I know what the **** I'm talking about.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/ "Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone" |
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magicians Inner circle Teacher and Legend 2898 Posts |
No trivia or minutia should ever be left out. Some call it anal retentive, and some won't even bother to go there. In my estimation, we knitpickers (knotpickers) define the moves and subtlety and artistry we practice and through this forum media we can refine our references.
If someone describes a pop knot and doesn't embellish it, then it will only be the pop knot in the reader's mind eye. When defining an overhand pop knot, it makes me curious as to what that might be. I understand that a square knot made to pop off would be different than a mere loop and tie style knot, so this kind of detailed description and pick-a-part is healthy and informative. I am still (k)not clear what an overhand vrs my underhanded method might be. I remember one time when called onto a stage during Blackstone Jr's show, that he asked me to tie half a knot. Not wanting to do something wrong, I could not for the life of me decide what he meant. Until his famous stage whisper helped me out and made me the putz who couldn't tie a dumb knot. -ian
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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Andre Hagen Inner circle 1432 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-11-20 15:29, Al Angello wrote: What a multi-tasker you are Al. Thinking and writing at the same time! Andy
Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one - Albert Einstein
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Josh Riel Inner circle of hell 1995 Posts |
The ones that come to mind that would work are the granny knot, thief's knot, and the square knot. I use the square knot, but it's just out of habit from work. Also it's just the right way...
Perhaps the granny knot is the underhand? I wouldn't know. I remember now, it (Underhand knot) looks like this. Except the leading edge goes through the loop.
Magic is doing improbable things with odd items that, under normal circumstances, would be unnessecary and quite often undesirable.
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
I look at the knots generally in three general catagories.
Dissolving: A knot that is a false knot that simply comes apart and the magi makes it look as if they are making it vanish or compressing it ala the Daryl/Sands routine. False knot: a knot that looks like it is two ropes being held together when in actuality it is on the rope and can be untied and shown to be a separate short piece or slid off or slid and concealed. Pop knot: a knot tied so that it is held to the length of rope by a tuft of rope so that when the long rope is tighened the action loosens the rope. This type of knot can be of any type from a simple overhand knot to multiple square knots. If the knot doesn't pop off the rope when the rope is tightened, to me, it isn't a pop knot. Rock on. |
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magicians Inner circle Teacher and Legend 2898 Posts |
I thought I saw Daryl use a pop knot that after stretching the rope, still sticks to it. Then he just removes it when he wants to. Or is that just a simulated pop knot. The actual knot was false, the knot remaining is the simulation and that can be removed. Would that be a different category?
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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Al Angello Eternal Order Collegeville, Pa. USA 11045 Posts |
The false knot just disappears, vanishes, or disolves, and there are several of them. There is Mr. Hull's knot, and Mr. Hunter false, or vanishing knots.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/ "Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone" |
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Josh Riel Inner circle of hell 1995 Posts |
Do you mean a sliding knot? One that can be slid or just untied to be a separate short piece of rope.
Or when you say it can be removed, do you mean just vanished like a false knot?
Magic is doing improbable things with odd items that, under normal circumstances, would be unnessecary and quite often undesirable.
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Al Angello Eternal Order Collegeville, Pa. USA 11045 Posts |
A sliding knot is a whole nother animal (I think).
What I was talking about was something like the Hunter Bow knot, or the Hull vanishing knot.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/ "Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone" |
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Josh Riel Inner circle of hell 1995 Posts |
Sorry Al, I was actually directing that question to Magicians... I probably should have pointed that out.
Magic is doing improbable things with odd items that, under normal circumstances, would be unnessecary and quite often undesirable.
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
Daryl uses a knot that he acts like he is removing, it isn't a pop knot in a true sense of the word.
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magicians Inner circle Teacher and Legend 2898 Posts |
I hyperviewed the daryl DVD and only briefly viewed the routine. I thought he had some sort of stick on "loop" which he intimated was the knot. I thought he "slid it" by placing it a few inches below where it was. It was , of course already off and just simulated the knot he had vanished.
Not important, just qualifying the minutia of magic. -------- Hey can you dig it? I just qualified as a regular user instead of a new user. My maiden days are over. I guess its better than being irregular.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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Andre Hagen Inner circle 1432 Posts |
Ian, Lots of fiber and 101 posts make you a regular user.
Andy
Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one - Albert Einstein
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