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The Magic Cafe Forum Index ŧ ŧ Magic names and the media ŧ ŧ Do we need a separate forum just for Criss Angel? (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Dr Spektor
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Hmmm... lets open it up to any type of hero!

And here is an ARE YOU READY trailer... look at the main character's long hair style etc... could CA have been inspired by GOTCHAMAN??????

(Zoltar was actually a hot blonde babe, in case no one figured that out)

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=LVS4hv41yOc&feature=related
"They are lean and athirst!!!!"
Mind Guerrilla
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Quote:
You seem to have quite a crush on this Angel fellow (and he is a fellow, in case the hair and makeup fooled you).


Another productive addition to this discussion.

Stop projecting.

I'll have you know Criss and I broke up after he refused to stop using stooges and creative editing on his show. I won custody of Johnny Thompson.
John Nesbit
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Quote:
On 2007-11-24 23:26, Dr Spektor wrote:
Hmmm... lets open it up to any type of hero!

And here is an ARE YOU READY trailer... look at the main character's long hair style etc... could CA have been inspired by GOTCHAMAN??????

(Zoltar was actually a hot blonde babe, in case no one figured that out)

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=LVS4hv41yOc&feature=related


There certainly is a lot of similarities and parallels to that clip (1994) and the mindfreak images. I think you GOTCHAMAN, Doc ! Smile
Slim King
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Quote:
On 2007-11-24 23:34, Mind Guerilla wrote:
Quote:
You seem to have quite a crush on this Angel fellow (and he is a fellow, in case the hair and makeup fooled you).


Another productive addition to this discussion.

Stop projecting.

I'll have you know Criss and I broke up after he refused to stop using stooges and creative editing on his show. I won custody of Johnny Thompson.


Funniest thing you've ever said Smile
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Decomposed
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SPeaking of breakups and CA, I just saw this hot off the AP. May be old but still sad:

"Criss Angel is being sued for divorce by his estranged wife, Joanne Sarantakos, who alleges that the celebrity illusionist has been cheating on her with Cameron Diaz and has stopped supporting her financially."

WOnder how much NBC paid him to sit in a chair.
Slim King
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Tony has a nice video on a related subject...I'll look Smile
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
Slim King
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THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
Ximines
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Oh no - talk about unintended consequences - look what I've begun!
CinChiller
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@ Mind Guerilla: If you are Batman, Iīm spiderman. Smile

Bye the way, iīm within the scene of mentalism in germany and europe and of course criss angel is also well known in germany, but not as mentalist. Not many professional mentalists in germany will see CA as mentalist or somebody who supported the art of mentalism in a "positive" way. Why? Because mentalism has also something to do with credibility and after the mindfreak series CA isnīt really a representative for credibility of mentalism - not for an intelligent audience.

For me, CAīs reaction of jimīs performance in the uri geller show was comical and a proof of the double moral standard of somebody who claims not to work with camera tricks.

CA is a TV magic "superstar" performer, thatīs ok and I donīt begrudge the sucess he has to him. But he isnīt a mentalist and this thread is a thread about and for mentalism.
So, I think Tony named the right thread for Ximies question. But this is just my humble opinion of course. Smile
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Mind Guerrilla
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On 2007-11-25 11:38, CinChiller wrote:
CA is a TV magic "superstar" performer, thatīs ok and I donīt begrudge the sucess he has to him. But he isnīt a mentalist and this thread is a thread about and for mentalism.


He performs mentalism effects so why shouldn't he be discused here? Richard Osterlind performs magic tricks (linking rings, bill in cigarette, glass of water production) does that mean he is not a mentalist in your book either? Many would disagree.

You say mentalism is all about credibility. I'm not sure what you mean by that. Are you saying it's about convincing people you have real paranormal abilities? I recently saw mentalist Sam Eaton performing in Manhattan (his show is called "The Quantum Eye" and is currently playing at a theater in Times Square). After the show he greeted the audience and answered questions. I was amazed at how candid he was, explaining to one spectator who asked him how he does what he does that it is all basically a con. Does being honest make him less credible in your view? It seems paradoxical. I need to say the word "paradoxical" once every few months or I spontaneously combust.
Slim King
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So if someone wants you to be honest and tell him your magic secrets you should? Is that it?
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CinChiller
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Quote:
On 2007-11-25 12:30, Mind Guerilla wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-11-25 11:38, CinChiller wrote:
CA is a TV magic "superstar" performer, thatīs ok and I donīt begrudge the sucess he has to him. But he isnīt a mentalist and this thread is a thread about and for mentalism.


He performs mentalism effects so why shouldn't he be discused here? Richard Osterlind performs magic tricks (linking rings, bill in cigarette, glass of water production) does that mean he is not a mentalist in your book either? Many would disagree.

You say mentalism is all about credibility. I'm not sure what you mean by that. Are you saying it's about convincing people you have real paranormal abilities? I recently saw mentalist Sam Eaton performing in Manhattan (his show is called "The Quantum Eye" and is currently playing at a theater in Times Square). After the show he greeted the audience and answered questions. I was amazed at how candid he was, explaining to one spectator who asked him how he does what he does that it is all basically a con. Does being honest make him less credible in your view? It seems paradoxical. I need to say the word "paradoxical" once every few months or I spontaneously combust.


How would you define a mentalist? Just because somebody shows some mental effects doesnīt make him or her to a mentalist.
Richard Osterlind is in my eyes a mentalist although he also performs magic tricks, because he mostly shows, explains and invented mental effects.
I know that CA also showed very nice mental effects (pk touch with banachek as consultant), but does these few effects makes him to a mentalist? If you would ask somebody from the magic scene what CA is, do you really think that most colleagues would define him as mentalist? I donīt think so.

In contrast to magic tricks where everybody knows that it works with (finger flicking) tricks, mentalism plays with the eventuality that the effects have another "truth" than "just tricks".
Derren brown and many other mentalists offer an "explanation" for what they do and often the people believe it.
Of course it depends on the performance style of the mentalist if you want to show that you have some special skills or the audience itself has these skills.

As long as you present these "lies" in the context of your performance as mentalist, it should be allowed not to be honest, because itīs part of the illusion you sell.

Depending of your performance and your style you can also claim that you create the illusion of the 6th sense with your 5 senses (like banachek or osterlind).

If Sam Eaton thinks that he wants to explain the audience the truth behind his presentation, itīs his own decision. I donīt want to judge about this kind of bahavior as long as I have the freedom not to do it if I think itīs not necessary.

At that moment somebody comes to me after a show to want an advice for his life or decisions he has to make, I have to tell him that I havenīt the power he might think I have of course.

In spite of my bad english, I hope you understand my opinion and what I mean this time.
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The Drake
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On 2007-11-25 13:12, Slim King wrote:
So if someone wants you to be honest and tell him your magic secrets you should? Is that it?


Just so things don't get more confusing. We're talking about " real or not" here and not magic secrets. Nobody expects a mentalist to expose methods. I see nothing wrong with them saying its a show and not a real link to the paranormal. I don't expose methods but easily tell people its not real and just an " Illusion".. hence the term Illusionist.

I think its each performers call as to whether or not they want to discuss the reality of what the audience experienced.

Best,

Tim
Dr Spektor
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On 2007-11-25 07:34, Candini wrote:
SPeaking of breakups and CA, I just saw this hot off the AP. May be old but still sad:

"Criss Angel is being sued for divorce by his estranged wife, Joanne Sarantakos, who alleges that the celebrity illusionist has been cheating on her with Cameron Diaz and has stopped supporting her financially."

WOnder how much NBC paid him to sit in a chair.


Paparatzi footage of Mumm-Cri$$ (whom keeps covering up his age) seranading blonde celebs... (notice like the others he has been with, has been in a state of semi-consciousness)...

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=84Dv61DAT2M
"They are lean and athirst!!!!"
Dr Spektor
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On 2007-11-25 11:38, CinChiller wrote:
@ Mind Guerilla: If you are Batman, Iīm spiderman. Smile

Bye the way, iīm within the scene of mentalism in germany and europe and of course criss angel is also well known in germany, but not as mentalist. Not many professional mentalists in germany will see CA as mentalist or somebody who supported the art of mentalism in a "positive" way. Why? Because mentalism has also something to do with credibility and after the mindfreak series CA isnīt really a representative for credibility of mentalism - not for an intelligent audience.

For me, CAīs reaction of jimīs performance in the uri geller show was comical and a proof of the double moral standard of somebody who claims not to work with camera tricks.

CA is a TV magic "superstar" performer, thatīs ok and I donīt begrudge the sucess he has to him. But he isnīt a mentalist and this thread is a thread about and for mentalism.
So, I think Tony named the right thread for Ximies question. But this is just my humble opinion of course. Smile


Nono.. I keep telling you - I'M Batman
"They are lean and athirst!!!!"
Lord Of The Horses
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On 2007-11-25 15:34, Timothy Drake wrote:
[

I think its each performers call as to whether or not they want to discuss the reality of what the audience experienced.

Best,

Tim


On this, I think, we agree.

That's why (leaving aside any unprobable milion and any challenge) I believe Criss Angel should have limited his role to being a judge and not having any saying about how Jim Callahan chose to present his effect.
Then you'll rise right before my eyes, on wings that fill the sky, like a phoenix rising!
Mind Guerrilla
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On 2007-11-25 15:24, CinChiller wrote:
How would you define a mentalist?

In spite of my bad english, I hope you understand my opinion and what I mean this time.


Your English is fine.

I'm almost afraid to define "mentalist" because I'm sure no matter how I do it, a group of angry villagers will start lighting up torches.

How about this: a magician who does mind reading tricks? (Locking myself in a bomb shelter)

I don't really understand the apparent need for some people to draw the distinction between magic and mentalism. Why must it be an either/or situation? Is it some sort of self esteem thing? Is it somehow demeaning for someone with a mind reading act to be called a magician?
Mind Guerrilla
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On 2007-11-25 16:17, Lord Of The Horses wrote:
I believe Criss Angel should have limited his role to being a judge and not having any saying about how Jim Callahan chose to present his effect.


This statement is almost zenlike. Let us meditate on this: to judge without judging. Om... Smile
Lord Of The Horses
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Are you kidding, right?

Maybe, for you, the concept of saying just GOOD or BAD effect is impossible to grasp.

And, yes, he could have even said that the performance was comical to him.

But then - is not the judge duty to go on and tell people if that is a real effect or not.



Well, now I let you with your own thoughts, hoping you will not die out of boredom.

Oh, and btw, what is really zenlike is your nick "MIND guerilla", since to do that you should first have a mind.
Then you'll rise right before my eyes, on wings that fill the sky, like a phoenix rising!
CinChiller
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Quote:
On 2007-11-25 15:56, Dr Spektor wrote:

Nono.. I keep telling you - I'M Batman


Ok, ok, you are batman. So long as I can carry on being spiderman, itīs ok for me. Smile
The Gaff Book Collection - the right tool for your booktest.
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Visit: http://stores.lulu.com/dankworth01
The Magic Cafe Forum Index ŧ ŧ Magic names and the media ŧ ŧ Do we need a separate forum just for Criss Angel? (0 Likes)
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