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cngmagic New user Los Angeles 27 Posts |
Hi guys,
I just finished doing a stand-up show at a dinner party in a restaurant. But the problem is I don't think I did a good job because not many people were paying attention. There were about 20 tables surrounding the stage. And a lot of the tricks that I did were not for a big audience. Here is a list of the tricks that I did, Bill in lemon, ABC block, Invisible deck, Invisible touch, Coin in Soda. The problem is most of these tricks are for a smaller size audience. I usually get great reaction when I do them for a smaller size audience. But tonight the reaction was very bad. A lot of people in the back couldn't even hear what I said. And most of them were eating instead of watching. Can anyone give me some advice on doing a stage show? Any good stand-up tricks and illusions for this type of shows that are practical and affordable? Where can I get a good microphone? What can I do to improve on catching the people attention in the back? Thanks, Charles |
Chezaday Inner circle Naperville, IL 1673 Posts |
You know .. sometimes things are just out of your hands. If the audience is eating .. you're out of luck, you'll never connect with them. Next time tell them you'll do you act after dinner.
Some nights you're on top of the world .. other nights, it just doesn't work out. It's all part of the game. Steve |
JasonB Regular user 174 Posts |
Tabary Rope, comedy rope escape, gene anderson newspaper tear, snow storm in china, airborne soda etc., paper over head, multiplying bottles, floating rose, egg bag, linking rings, manipulations, mouth coil, that's a good start. Most of these effects are not too expensive. To any working pro it's pretty clear what happened to you. Your venue is one that most pros have done many, many times. Good mics are expensive. An excellent combo is a Sennhieser wireless with a countryman E6, tons of pros use these, but this combo is about $800. The general rule is that stage performers can communicate to close-up but that close-up performers can't just communicate as stage performers unless they gain a good amount of experience.
On stage you speak louder than in close-up. You don't have the intimate setting on stage that you do in close-up so you need to get and retain the attention of the audience. When possible if you're on stage have all of the lights lowered in the room except the lights that shine on you and your stage space, this will reduce talking from the audience and create focus towards you. Pan your eye contact across the audience. Make eye contact to the people on the left, to the people on the right and right ahead. Don't just focus on one section or you lose the other sections. If people aren't listening then don't just react and get louder actually get quieter for a little bit to recapture their attention. Your effects need to be larger. Yes, some people will be able to perform very small effects onstage. However, larger venues need larger effects or a larger personality, one or the other is needed. Because of your post I know you don't yet have a capturing personality so you need to use larger effects that can play to the back of the room as well as the front. "Coin in Soda"?? unless you have a huge personality or a huge projection screen you can't pull this off on stage. Remember it's magic and you can't create magic if people can't see it happen or you're not painting a picture in their minds. A rule I've also found is just avoid anything that happens from the waist down, it just can't be seen by many people in the room. The book Maximum entertainment by Ken Weber is great, check it out. Also, Henning Nelms' "Magic and Showmanship" as well as one of the Fitzkee books "Showmanship for Magicians" these are three great places to start. Other than that, perform a TON and ask yourself each time "what did they like & what did they dislike?" Put one or two of the above listed effects into your next stage show and see what the reaction is. Listen and watch the audience, how do they respond? Are they more or less interested in what you're doing compared to the other smaller material? After all of that and ten years later as Steve said "Some night's you're on top of the world..other nights, it just doesn't work out". Best of luck you've got a long fun road in front of you, JB |
Bob Sanders Grammar Supervisor Magic Valley Ranch, Clanton, Alabama 20504 Posts |
Charles,
There are times with magic when it is not "The Show". If people are eating, walking around, waiting for the line at their favorite carnival ride to get shorter, sitting down to rearrange their load, feed the baby, make a phone call or take their shoes off; the magician is not the real "Show". The focus is everywhere else. For a show "in the flat" (same level as the audience), the actual audience is actually very small anyway regardless of the size of the room. Raised stages in a flat floored room aren't a whole lot better. (Preachers learned this long ago. Look at churches.) Stage space also can limit prop space and therefore, limit what can be performed there. Yes, size matters! (Even if it isn't politically correct to acknowledge.) There is no zoom lens in stage magic either. TV magic is usually very poor stage magic. Everything, even the magician, stays the same size throughout the show to the audience in a real stage show. Props in a good stage show make use of the whole stage. Your props need to be unmistakably visible at least 60 feet away. Otherwise only the magician is fooled. Your effects would work on TV. Stage and platform magic is a different animal. You seem to have caught on right away. Good for you! I'm sure your stage and platform magic will be very different in the future. Be glad you did not make the mistake I endured last week at a show in Florida that was supposed to be a real theater show. The magician spread a deck of cards on a table top and ignored the fact that his audience could only see the underside of the table. The real miracle was that the audience held out hope that the magic show would be resumed later. Bob Sanders Magic By Sander |
soleil Loyal user 294 Posts |
Dear Charles,
I think here at the Café many magicians will understand you problems because we work every day in situations like this. The difference is that some of us have some experience and can handle more easily these difficult situations. You all talked about what doesn't depend on the performer. I agree there are things that don't depend on us but there are also many things that depend on us. If we concentrate and work on the solutions that depend on us we can make things better at least with 50%. 1. Buy a good and professional stage magic equipment. I always choose tricks that are visible from a big distance. I agree you must spend a long time on internet looking at catalogs, and then spend a lot of money but this is the path of almost every successful stage magician. 2. Let a good theater magic director work on your show. 3. Make someone announce your show, say a few words so people know that something special will come; also, they understand that you are specially invited by the restaurant and probably consider you with more respect ( we have to think about it since we are not all famous) 4. Begin the show with a very visual and short act to some dynamic music - to grab attention and create interest. That's not all but these are some successfull ideas and tips I've used and continue to use. Hope this helps, Best, Soleil
"Art is the Artist. The Artist is God."- Goete
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leapinglizards Inner circle 1263 Posts |
Charles,
You already said what the problems were, really, the choice of visible material, and lack of proper sound amplification. So, the best thing to do is start selecting some larger material for such venues, examine some of the things you are doing and ask youself how they could be made more visible, and invest in a PA and mic. Some of the routines you did COULD still be done, depending on how you staged them. If you posted this and didn't know WHY you had some challenges, I would be surprised... So, I think you approached it right AND I do think you need to understand that even with other material and support equipment, this type of audience setting is very challenging!
Leaping Lizards!!! Who knew it was possible.
<BR> <BR>www.LeapingLizardsMagic.com |
JayH Regular user Finland 140 Posts |
I don't remember what the DVD is called, but I have seen in some video that there are regular "small" scale tricks and they do little changes to those and then they can play the same trick to bigger audiences.
Jay p.s Must check what that DVD was... Will be back.... |
cngmagic New user Los Angeles 27 Posts |
Thank you guys! This helps alot.
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SoCalPro Inner circle Southern California 1634 Posts |
I'm not sure if this suggestion was mentioned or not as I just skimmed over the responses. I NEVER..EVER perform DURING dinner or any other meal for that matter. "The food is the entertainment". A good friend of mine told me that and I totally agree. It's your job to educate the client on this when they call as most seem to think this is an appropriate time.
When they request my show during a meal, I always let them know that I want them to get more magic for their buck and if the guests are paying attention to their food, they won't be watching or listening to me. I also agree that an appropriate sound system is a must as well as making sure that your effects are large enough to be seen. |
Magic Patrick Inner circle Minnesota 1591 Posts |
Charles,
I had a similar type of show about 2 years ago and I went out and bought a sound system an that made all the difference. This is a necessary evil as most times you will be competing with other noise and parlor magic is so dependant on the performers words. Good luck. BYUDAD |
Bob Sanders Grammar Supervisor Magic Valley Ranch, Clanton, Alabama 20504 Posts |
Having a pre-recorded introduction is well worth the money too.
Bob Sanders Magic By Sander |
Bruce Chadwick New user 7 Posts |
If you are looking for a stand microphone, you cannot do better than to buy a Shure model 77. This is an excellent speaker's mircophone that you don't have to "eat" when speaking into. You can keep a good distance of 12 to 18 inches away from the mic and it will sound great. This is the exact same microphone that you often see on the presidential podium. It has a flat response and is an excellent microphone. They only cost about $100. Just keep in mind that there is a big difference between a good cardoid type speakers microphone as compared to a singer's microphone. Big difference.
I also suggest the powered Mackie SRM 450 monitors. Excellent speakers that don't require a microphone. Add to this some sort of music playback source and an inexpensive mixer (if needed) and you will have a heck of a sound system. You can buy all this from a company called Full Compass in Middleton, WI. Excellent company and they have some of the best prices around. One thing you can do to capture your audience is to lower the audience lights to make the stage or platform lights hotter than the rest of the room. We carry a small cabaret spotlight and often this is the only light we have for the stage. We usually don't have someone man the light. Rather, we just clamp it down to put a nice pool of white circular light on the stage area. Also our experience is that music routines have a tendency to capture the audience's attention much more than talk routines. You might also think about using music as a background for some of your effects, at a low enough volume level so that you can also talk over the music. Bruce Chadwick |
Bruce Chadwick New user 7 Posts |
Excuse me. I meant that the powered Mackie SRM 450's don't need an amplifier. Of course you need a microphone.
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Decomposed Eternal Order High Desert 12059 Posts |
With mentalism, there are not a lot of big "props." I had one show like this and never received any feedback, postive or negative (which is negative).
I try to structure my show to have teh entire audience involvement about midway. Select someone from a far back table a helper so when they get back to the table, they can tell their friends how good you are. This is a lifelong learning process, for me anyways.
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trickychaz Special user West Virginia 549 Posts |
I once took a booking from a client whom had found my website online. It was for about 80 round tables, and at the Charleston Civic Center in WV. At that time I was thinking I have to take this gig as it would be great to put on promotional stuff, and a great reference letter.
She rushed me up on stage with my show while people were still eating in fear that everyone would leave after they eat. My show was smaller, but I thought winning them over with interaction, personality etc would make it worth $300.00. I found just the opposite to be true. They were focused on looking at their forks so that their food wouldn't end up on their shirts and ties, drinking their coffee. I video taped the entire performance, and there was laughter, amazement etc, but the client was still unhappy I can only figure out two reasons. #1 I didn't get the reactions that I deserved because they were focused on eating. #2 For $300.00 and 2 hours travel to the gig the client was expecting me to travel with an entire cast and crew Chaz |
Frank Simpson Special user SW Montana 883 Posts |
There does seem to be a consensus here that I can certainly echo that you quite simply cannot compete with food. Period.
Whether my magic show, my vocal quartet, a dramatic reading, etc. I NEVER allow them to pressure me into performing while the audience is eating. The only concession I ever make, and only seldom, is that I'll begin as coffee is being served after dessert. Most presenters simply do not understand the room dynamics, and will often try to pursuade you to go on earlier because "last year we had a band playing during dinner and everone loved it". I will explain that a band can function as background entertainment, but that I can only function as "foreground" entertainment. I require the audience to follow what I'm doing, step by step in order to "get" what's going on. This is usually sufficient explanation for them, and I am careful to mention all of this to presenters at the time they are contracting my services. A couple of years ago my quartet was performing for a holiday festival and we explained that we cannot functionally"entertain" during food service, as we require audience interaction. When we arrived, they had set up the front portion of the room for us, with several rows of chairs facing the stage, but then the rest of the room was set up for, you guessed it, eating. Everybody lost. The diners paid no attention to the fact that we were trying to perform and carried on their conversations. They complained that they had to talk so loud to be heard over us. Our audience was perturbed that it was difficult, if not impossible to hear our dialog sequences, let alone the music. And of course we were angry because we were completely unnable to play to the room, and our show was greatly diminished. We now spell out in our contracts that there is to be no distractions of any kind in the room immediately before and during our shows. |
rtgreen Inner circle Portland, Oregon 1322 Posts |
I totaly aqree Frank. I had three shows in the last couple of years where the exact same thing happened. One was held at a casino banquet hall and to add to the food service problem, there was a loud band playing just on the other side of the open doors next to the buffet. That show was a disaster. Unfortunately, I lost another party gig for Nike because of bad word of mouth after that show. I also recently did a show for a college student association where about 5 minutes into the show, one of the organizers walked onto the stage and announced that the food was ready and being served at the back of the room. Nearly the entire audience got up and left. I ended up performing for about 20 die-hards who were very supportive. To add insult to injury, the person who booked me approached me after the show and asked if everything went OK. They told me they wanted to see the show, but didn't want all the good food to be gone, so they went to eat instead.
In both of these cases, I had an agreement to perform either before or after the food was served, but it just didn't happen. I usually don't mind performing while they are having desert of during cocktails before the dinner, but during dinner is just a lose-lose for everyone. Thanks, Richard |
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