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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Tricky business » » Google Adwords Price (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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John Martin
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Inner circle
1010 Posts

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Thanks BG, that helps me understand the process much better.

All the best,

John
Al Angello
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Eternal Order
Collegeville, Pa. USA
11047 Posts

Profile of Al Angello
Booster Gold
Welcome to the magic Café. Lyndel is a magician friend of mine from right here at the magic Café, and if he wants to link my web site from his I will have to thank him. I think your description of me as a dummy who doesn't know what he is doing, and has an adviser with a little bit of knowledge is a very accurate description of me and my web site designer, I'll be the first to admit that I am a juggler/magician just trying to make a buck but when you google "juggler Philadelphia" or "magician Philadelphia" my name has consistently come up in the top ten for over 10 years. Google is only one search engine I am on the top ten list of the other most popular search engines too.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com
http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/
"Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone"
impossible man
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Elite user
401 Posts

Profile of impossible man
What I haven't seen mentioned a lot here is whether the number of hits a site has received plays into rankings, how much, and why. Should that be a separate post? If number of hits is a factor, perhaps I should post a lot of questions so everyone will go check my site? (Kidding)
Dean Gilbert
Impossible Man
www.impossibleman.net
Al Angello
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Eternal Order
Collegeville, Pa. USA
11047 Posts

Profile of Al Angello
The number of hits you get is your way of thelling if people are looking at your web site. If the meter isn't clicking that means that no one is looking at it.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com
http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/
"Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone"
Bradacal
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Special user
593 Posts

Profile of Bradacal
I gotta say that I just signed up for Web-stat...absolutely amazing, its shows you everything in detail, spot on.

Great referral guys!
Carducci
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Denver
539 Posts

Profile of Carducci
The number of hits plays only a very small part in your page ranking. If the user has the google toolbar and has agreed to share their browsing data with google, than it can play a small role in the equation (very small) what matters most fist is your content, then who is linking to your site, then other, more obscure details like how old your domain name is, when it expires, etc. For the most part, hits to your site are not tracked by search engines.

The number of hits only tell you part of the story. If you get 100,000 people hitting your site, but 99,999 people turn around and leave then you might as well get only one hit. That's called your bounce rate (which most stat packages, including google analytics, don't tell you)

MB, good on you! Web-Stat rocks!
impossible man
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401 Posts

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Happily, since the mention of Comcast I updated my Comcast-hosted page to match the new page I put on my hosted domain. I come up #1 in Yahoo! for "magician mycity mystate."

But in Google the site I had a listed on doesn't come up at all now and I have advanced from the top of the second page of results to the bottom of the first. Meanwhile people have started calling off my ad again, and they are not contacting me from the web.
Dean Gilbert
Impossible Man
www.impossibleman.net
MikeClay
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Atlanta GA
756 Posts

Profile of MikeClay
For SEO your simply competing against other people who are rating higher than you... analyze their site and go one step beyond...

as far as submitting your site to Google.. umm if you know what your doing you can make the list in 24hrs and never even submit.. and there are a few phrases that I rank position 5 on Google that I wasn't even listed for last week (re-tweaking my site)

SEO is a game and the rules change ALL the time...

Learn how to analyze the data from different analysis tools and how to compare your site to your competition... that's your starting point...

after you learn how todo that then your ready for market domination

imagine someone searches for a magician / children's entertainer / or anything along those lines in your area and "ALL ROADS LEAD TO YOU"
if you can take MULTIPLE listings on Google (and getting 5 isn't hard) then you get the most traffic...

then you need to make sure that traffic is converting into phone calls

currently I get 25 - 30 unique visitors a day with a average of 4 page views
and get about 5 emails and 2 calls a day about pricing and availability..
My goal is to triple that within the month so I am booked so solid that I can start referring other entertainers..

but SEO is easy IF you have the right information..
and tools..
Al Angello
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Eternal Order
Collegeville, Pa. USA
11047 Posts

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Mike
Very few people know what they are talking about here, thanks for the good advise.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com
http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/
"Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone"
impossible man
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401 Posts

Profile of impossible man
I was wondering how to submit my site to Google and got an ad from them. Their webmaster toolbar is available free from my hosting company. So I opened it this morning and got this report:

Site Information Sitemaps Errors Warnings Verified?
http://www.impossibleman.net/ 1 0 0 Verified

I don't see any other diagnostics offered. How does this help? Or is this a subset of what I would get if I paid for another level of tools?
Dean Gilbert
Impossible Man
www.impossibleman.net
Al Angello
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Eternal Order
Collegeville, Pa. USA
11047 Posts

Profile of Al Angello
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
http://www.juggleral.com
http://home.comcast.net/~juggleral/
"Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone"
Carducci
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Special user
Denver
539 Posts

Profile of Carducci
All of google's webmaster tools are free.

https://www.google.com/webmasters/tools

You will need a google account and you will need to verify owership of the site (by placing a meta tag or similar on your site)

Once you've done that you can see various stats and info about your site.
impossible man
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401 Posts

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When I run them from Google's site I am only offered "Index Stats." All other links under the Statistics head are disabled, "grayed out."
Dean Gilbert
Impossible Man
www.impossibleman.net
impossible man
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401 Posts

Profile of impossible man
Okay, I need to verify. I did this through my host and didn't get the stats but it looks like I can just do it through Google. Got it.
Dean Gilbert
Impossible Man
www.impossibleman.net
avimagic
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Loyal user
Hollywood, Florida
233 Posts

Profile of avimagic
I'm coming in late here, but web design and marketing are areas of my expertise so I thought I'd jump in anyway.

Quote:
Hey, Al....I'm curious. You say you've gotten 28,000 "hits" to your site. Is that 28,000 unique visitors? What is the time frame for getting those hits? You've had your site up for 10+ years, is that right? I'm just trying to get a reference to compare my site numbers which has been up for less than a year. I don't know if my numbers are good or bad, so I'd like to know how they compare to yours. Thanks in avance for your clarification, Al.


Al's site has a big 90s-style counter on the homepage that currently reads 28,197. So (correct me if I'm wrong, Al) I'm guessing his count of 28,000 was based on that counter. Problem with that is it's counting page views, NOT unique visitors. Now, the counter is smart enough to not go up if it logs more than one hit from the same IP address (so it doesn't go up when you hit refresh) but those unique views are only good for 24 hours or so. So if Al has his web page set as his homepage when he opens his web browser, you can probably assume that one of those hits each day belongs to him.

Whatever you do, you should have a really good web stats program (most domain-based hosting providers give them to you for free) so you know what your "real" numbers are, and where your traffic is coming from.

Also, you should have some rel content pages, not just a single page in Flash that changes when you click on links. Google can't see the difference between the pages that come up like that (and can't read their content either) so to Google, Al's whole site looks like one page.

To Al's credit, his site has a Google PageRank of 3 out of 10, which is pretty good for a 1-page site. My sites are new so they are still sitting at 0, but they'll be up soon. I have yet to see a magician's site rank higher than 4.

As for the Adwords question, it's a matter of simple math and logic.

Anyone who says that you can beat your competitors by simple search engine optimization is speaking in a vacuum. Sure, with some SEO you can boost your rankings, but by how much?

If you want to rank in the top 20, you can do it, sure. Read up on it, find out what tags to add, how often to submit, what not to do, etc. But that only assumes that your 20 biggest competitors aren't reading the same materials or paying a pro who's better at it than you are! If you're in a large or saturated market, you may NEVER make it to the top, simply because of the number of other magicians with the same keywords that you're competing with.

It all comes down to the same question that Sharon Osbourne keeps asking the acts on America's Got Talent before they audition: Sure, you've got talent, but are you talented enough to win this whole competition?

A lot of Al's (and other people's) advice is very good. Do the SEO. Submit to Google and other search engines. But until you rank in the top 10, the only way to be absolutely certain you appear on page 1 of Google is to be the highest AdWords bidder.

My 2 cents!

Avi
avimagic
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Loyal user
Hollywood, Florida
233 Posts

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P.S. I posted the above without noticing (DUH!) that there was more than 1 page in this thread... sorry for any redundancies. Some web expert I proved to be, huh?

Also, the whole discussion piqued my curiosity, so I checked my stats... I'm getting an average of 40 unique visitors a day, so I should be at 28,000 within 2 years. Smile
MrHyde
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Special user
810 Posts

Profile of MrHyde
Quote:
On 2008-06-25 08:06, avimagic wrote:

I have yet to see a magician's site rank higher than 4.

Avi


Best not look at Lance Burtons or Copperfields then. Smile

Actually there are a few Café regulars who have or at least used to have a 5 Ranking.

My resource site http://www.magiccoach.com used to be PR5 but it's back to 4 at the moment.

Timothy
Decomposed
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Eternal Order
High Desert
12020 Posts

Profile of Decomposed
Quote:
On 2008-06-04 10:05, Al Angello wrote:
This may help
http://www.google.com/addurl/


I just used this and I will try to remember to use it once a month. I am unsure if I ever submitted my URL before. Bookings are down all over my area. Thanks Al, we miss you.
Carducci
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Special user
Denver
539 Posts

Profile of Carducci
Candin,

You truly do not need to submit every month. Once is enough (there are ways to get your site listed very quickly)

Google does not forget your site, in fact once your site is crawled, the googlebot will come back soon to get an idea of how often you update your site. How often your site is updated dictates how often your site will be crawled. If your site is not updated regularly, you will still get regular crawls from google.
Scott O.
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Inner circle
Midwest
1142 Posts

Profile of Scott O.
For free webstats try http://www.statcounter.com/

This is a great site. You can pay to use it, but the free version will keep track of stats on the previous 500 hits.
Do not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time you will reap a harvest, if you do not give up. Galatians 6:9
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