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feher Inner circle Michigan 1421 Posts |
Ok so let me get this straight if I move a coin a fraction higher in downs palm its called the Web Grip but Vinnys Crimp Palm has to be called a technique.
Where is the consitantcy (boy I spelled that all wrong..lol) Tim
Mean people SUCK!!!!!!!
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Michael Rubinstein V.I.P. 4665 Posts |
Tim, I think you are missing the point. Vinnie's use of Frickle palm is very original, and his technique for its use is his. The palm has been around for many, many yrs. I remember Garret showing me the position for web grip, and to be honest, I did not equate it with Down's palm at the time, as I remember that he was able to show his hand empty in a way much different than you can for Down's palm. Its like with Angle Palm (i..e JC Palm, Channin grip), and Mutobe palm. One can argue that the positions are variations of each other, BUT each position necessitates a different way of getting in and out, and allows you to do different things. I really can't talk about web grip, because I only saw it at the COINvention back in 2003. BTW, I noticed that I have an incoherent typo at the end of my last post - I was half asleep when I wrote it, but looking at it now, maybe I was totally asleep!
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Jaz Inner circle NJ, U.S. 6111 Posts |
Isn't this labeling/relabeling of these sometimes fractional changes used more to point to possible references rather than for teaching?
Of course sleights could be described as Jon says above by referring to the more classic resources. |
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feher Inner circle Michigan 1421 Posts |
Michael
LOL...asleep I do understand, I guess I'm playing devils advicate. Just trying to see where people stand on this subject. I just look at things different I guess but I will start playing by the rules and calling things what they are even if I feel they are not different enough to be called by a different name. I try to keep things simple but with all these names people call stuff they make it hard....lol Tim
Mean people SUCK!!!!!!!
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vinsmagic Eternal Order sleeping with the fishes... 10957 Posts |
For years the technique for getting into and out of the thumb Crotch was almost the same methiod for the thumb palm.. with my technique for the crimp the coin is held at the finger tips and the coin is tossed into position this techniqu allows me to do many differnt effects using the Crimp (thump crotch) palm ther is no visible finger movement...
if Im am not making my self clear jsut pm me with e mail address and I will send ademo of this in action vinny |
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feher Inner circle Michigan 1421 Posts |
Vinny
If anything out there needs an offical name its your crimp palm. You have sent many vids to me about this sleight through the years. Thank You !!! I know in past threads people would argue aboout your crimp palm saying its a thumb croch palm or fickle palm. If we can have a Web grip which is a high downs palm then we can certainly have a Crimp palm along with Crimping techniques. Tim
Mean people SUCK!!!!!!!
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vinsmagic Eternal Order sleeping with the fishes... 10957 Posts |
Tim Thank you for your support on this matter
vinny |
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MickeyPainless Inner circle California 6065 Posts |
Why are there no names attached too the Classic, Thumb and Finger palms?
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Mb217 Inner circle 9519 Posts |
Tim my friend, you ask a great question here. IMHO, I think a lot of times it just depends on who it is doing the naming that make people yea or nay.
As for the Godfathers Crimp Technique and applications, it's in a category all its own. It's a tree that bears many fruits and sustains people from all around the world. If anything it certainly deserves such recognition and respect. This apple wasn't bought or sold, it was simply given to all.
*Check out my latest: Gifts From The Old Country: A Mini-Magic Book, MBs Mini-Lecture on Coin Magic, The MB Tanspo PLUS, MB's Morgan, Copper Silver INC, Double Trouble, FlySki, Crimp Change - REDUX!, and other fine magic at gumroad.com/mb217magic
"Believe in YOU, and you will see the greatest magic that ever was." -Mb |
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Jay Mahon Special user 983 Posts |
I would say these names are often necessary. Sometimes the change of just a half an inch changes everything. Consider the use of acronymns and short forms these days. It is quite quick to merely mention a move that has been explained before with a fun name. Now with all that being considered, people throwing their own names on things seems to be more recent than anything. Marlo being a very strong believer in putting one's name on everything. That is fine and dandy if you are reinventing the wheel but if you aren't perhaps our names should stay on our driver's licenses or student cards.
The fact that we are describing very specific placements of small objects in something as small as one's hand means we are talking about differences of fractions of an inch to accomplish completely different results. Think of the days when we just said put a coin in your hand and conceal it by turning it over. Then comes Erdnase and WHAM huge details are given with precise mention of everything. Now we have Richard Kaufman and Stephen Minch as well as many others providing works with tremendous detail. It is exhaustive but for some of the finest work out there it is necessary! Jay |
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Wes65 Inner circle I've said very little in 1219 Posts |
Quote:
On 2008-05-18 09:24, Jaz wrote: "Harbottle Edge Grip Variation", one down....200,000 to go.
Wes
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rutabaga Inner circle Toronto, Canada 1283 Posts |
Quote:
On 2008-05-18 19:48, MickeyPainless wrote: Mick, surely you know of Tom Classic, Dick Thumb and Harry Finger.... |
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MickeyPainless Inner circle California 6065 Posts |
Thanks buddy, I spose I shouldn't add the "Thingy" part to some of those aye!
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Gary Yin Elite user Sabah, Malaysia 449 Posts |
Well what I consider the Web Grip is not only the position, but the applications and techniques to it which is not merely placing it somewhere and naming it.
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rannie Inner circle 4375 Posts |
Quote:
On 2008-05-18 23:29, Gary Yin wrote: Gary, I know the web grip and I do use it. How is it applied in the context of the word Web? I would agree that it was named because of its position though. Before knowing about the web grip. I used to call it the High Downs Palm. I used to use it for my false put some time back just to fool around with the guys at the local club. I did not have applications for it till I saw Thomas. Are there any other applications I missed? Kindly pm me if there are any. thanks! Rannie
"If you can't teach an old dog new tricks, trick the old dog to learn."
-Rannie Raymundo- aka The Boss aka The Manila Enforcer www.rannieraymundo.com www.tapm.proboards80.net |
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Gary Yin Elite user Sabah, Malaysia 449 Posts |
Hi Rannie, nah I don't think you miss any
I too don't have any idea with the word Web. What I mean my last post was the Web Grip is technique to extend the hand from High Downs Palm. So I think that the Web Grip is not a position but a subtlety and technique. that's my opinion about it though. Garrett is probably spiderman. |
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rannie Inner circle 4375 Posts |
Ok! I thought it was the web because it is indeed held in that position. The subtlety or the technique does not resemble a web but it's a great grip and I like it a lot.
"If you can't teach an old dog new tricks, trick the old dog to learn."
-Rannie Raymundo- aka The Boss aka The Manila Enforcer www.rannieraymundo.com www.tapm.proboards80.net |
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Justin Style Inner circle 2010 Posts |
Okay, what would you call it when you can produce TEN SILVER DOLLARS from a single Downs' Palm?
I call it the Ultimate Style grip! (But it's still the Downs' Palm...) |
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Jay Mahon Special user 983 Posts |
Justin you mistaking one's proficiency with technical variance. You can Downs Palm 10 coins, great! But that is not any different from the original downs palm, just that you are doing it with a large number of coins.
So let's call it the 10 coin Downs Palm? (Add Extreme and Elite as seen fit to make it worth selling on a DVD...) Jay |
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Mb217 Inner circle 9519 Posts |
Jay, if I'm not mistaken, I think you've just made Justin's point really.
*Check out my latest: Gifts From The Old Country: A Mini-Magic Book, MBs Mini-Lecture on Coin Magic, The MB Tanspo PLUS, MB's Morgan, Copper Silver INC, Double Trouble, FlySki, Crimp Change - REDUX!, and other fine magic at gumroad.com/mb217magic
"Believe in YOU, and you will see the greatest magic that ever was." -Mb |
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