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Wanlu
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It is quite an investment...

Unlike buying a figure/puppet, which you can resell, the TOM is licensed to the buyer only and the license is not transferable. So if you buy TOM and you like it...that's good investment and will most probably pay for itself. But if by any chance you don't like it, then you lost a lot of money. Smile

This will be licensed to the first 50 vents only...glad to know I'm one of those 50. Smile

Can't wait to get mine...

Wanlu
"The Old Path"
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tacrowl
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Quote:
On 2009-08-23 09:51, Wanlu wrote:
So if you buy TOM and you like it...that's good investment and will most probably pay for itself. But if by any chance you don't like it, then you lost a lot of money. Smile


Wanlu,
If you like the routine of TOM, then how can you not like it? Make the decision based on the effect - is it right for your show? If so, buy it - if not, don't. You are purchasing the right to do the routine, not just the "secret". If you only want to know the "secret", save your money - it isn't for you!

I've only used TOM once and I am not sure when or if I will do it again. I don't look at it as losing money. I own the rights to do it if I want, AND I know my purchase helps out Bill!
Tom Crowl - Comedy Ventriloquist

ComedyVentriloquist.com

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Bob Baker
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Tom is right. You are buying the right to do it. And you are buying the benefit of Bill's decades of doing the routine. The secret is a head slapper of the "why-didn't-I-think-of-that?" variety. But we didn't; Bill did. If you like the effect, the method is irrelevant. And done correctly is unfathomable to your audiences.

So, Wanlu, I hope you will not learn the secret and put the routine away. I hope you perform it and get the pleasure that it has given many of us.

Bob
Wanlu
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The routine is a killer... no doubt about it.

What I mean by "not liking it" refers to the method. I don't know how its done yet...so now that Im about to find out, Im hoping it wont be too difficult to do otherwise I wont like doing it. Smile I hate giving myself something hard to do. If Im not comfortable doing it, I wont do it. If the headworn mic will be a problem then I wont do the routine. But the fact that I bought it simply means I HOPEFUL ITS SOMETHING I CAN HANDLE. Smile Just like what I said, I don't think TOM will be as effective in kidshows as compared to adult shows, so I don't really see myself using TOM often. Maybe if I get adult gigs which I rarely do.

Just knowing how its done makes me happy already. At least Im one of the 50 who know the secret and one of the 50 who are licensed to do it. Maybe in the future more people (more than 50) would know the secret...but still only 50 are licensed and Im one of them. Smile

Thanks guys! Smile

Wanlu
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leecornell
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Wow. Thanks for the great thread about Bill's tape over the mouth trick. As the producer of Bill's license package and his good friend, let me weigh in a bit.

Bill developed his first version of this trick and performed it for the first time in 1959. Bill is going to be 78 in November. I doubt if there is anyone out there who started doing this before Bill.

I personally never even saw anyone do a tape bit of any type except Bill for years and I've been involved in magic and ventriloquism for over 40 years. (I know what you're thinking...he looks too young, handsome and chisled to have been around the business for that long)...

So, there are very, very few performers of any tape bit, regardless of the method they may use.

There is no one that I am aware of that uses Bill's technique of placing several layers of tape over the mouth - except for those who have purchased Bill's version.

Bill spent a long time perfecting this routine.

Back in the 1950's and the 1960's, lots of vents did "tricks" with their dummies. Bill was no different. When he came up with the idea to put tape over his mouth, he first did the routine using a single wide piece of masking tape. Then he tried duct tape. Then he tried doing a bit where the dummy talked while Bill smoked a cigarette, drank a glass of water and then finished with the single piece of tape.

It got an OK response, but he knew something was missing as he wasn't "killing" with the routine.

It wasn't until he came up with the idea of changing this from a quick vent "trick" into a full routine by using layers of tape and having a volunteer come on stage that would assist, interact with the puppet and Bill, and become part of the routine that he knew he had found the missing piece.

The crowds really were amazed by the bit and it was/is very funny to watch as it plays out. Every time I have seen Bill do this routine, he has received a standing ovation.

That being said, this routine only works if you put in the effort to learn the routine (or tweak it a bit to make it more your own) and you need to be a good perfomer and decent vent. If you have a bad act and/or bad technique, this isn't going to make you a star. The trick itself is not difficult to learn.

We have the price where it is because we only want professional entertainers to perform it. And, the value of the trick is not just in the secret, it's also in Bill's routine.

He has performed this thousands of times over 50 years and has polished this routine to get maximun impact. That's what you're paying for.

I honestly feel it is worth more than the $500 asking price. And, I think most, if not all, of the people who have invested in a license feel the same way.

Is there any way to police someone who might figure it out and then doing Bill's routine? Of course not. However, I have never heard of anyone figuring out how Bill's method works.

But, as in everything, there are crooks who rip people off all of the time in magic, vent or any business for that matter. We just always hope those are the exceptions and not the rule.

Will there be "knock-off" licenses being offered? I really doubt it. This is a small niche trick and I just don't see that happening.

Once all 50 licenses are gone, that will be it. That's a number Bill and I agreed on and I intend to stick to that.

I'm not going to say "Hurry! Get yours now before they run out!" I am in no hurry to sell them all. I'm more concerned about the "right" people getting a license than I am about trying to sell them all out quickly just to get your money.

How many licenses are left? I'll be right up front and tell you - I have sold 18 to date (it's been available for a little over a year), which leaves 32. Will I run out tomorrow, next week, next month, next year? I doubt it. But, they will sell out someday and there will be no more issued after that happens.

So, right now, there are only 18 people IN THE WORLD who have Bill's secret and routine. That's a pretty dang small amount of people. In contrast, for example, how many people do the zig-zag illusion or linking rings?

There is a way, way greater chance of someone seeing some of those staples in magic at a show than in seeing the Tape over the Mouth routine.

It is a great trick and routine, but if $500 seems like too much, the trick is not for you.

It is not implied in this thread, but in other situations I'll hear people say about a product "It's just a DVD and a book. Probably only cost them $5 to package "x". $200, $300 (or whatever) is a rip-off."

If that's what you think in regard to this trick, don't purchase it. Please.

I plan on posting a video clip of Bill's performance on the web page soon. If you haven't seen the bit, watch it. If you like what you see and like how the audience responds and would like that same kind of routine for your show, that's all that matters.

The trick blows people away. Period. That's the value of Bill's Tape over the Mouth trick.

Thanks.

Best,

Lee

http://www.ventriloquism101.com
Neale Bacon
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Burnaby BC Canada
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Just for the record...I have seen the bit and consider it amazing. My full time career is really just getting rolling again and I don't seem to be able to come up with the money RIGHT NOW.

I consider it a good price and want to get it some day.

I hope my post wasn't misunderstood as me saying it was too much money. Just for me RIGHT NOW.

Hope that clears up my previous post.
Neale Bacon and his Crazy Critters
Burnaby BC
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www.baconandfriends.com
leecornell
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Fellow magi and vents,

Just a couple of quick comments.

Tom is right. This does help Bill. He is retired now and the extra he makes from the occassional sale of his TOM routine really is a big help to him and he is very thankful to the pros who have invested in a license.

Second, I just wanted everyone to know that I have had nothing to do with all of the really great and positive comments about the routine. It's been a while since I've visited the forum and was pleasantly surprised to see all of the fabulous reviews.

It was a labor of love to put this together with Bill (well...plus I got to learn the secret since I shot the DVD and interviewed Bill...8-).

Bill wanted to keep his legacy going by making this available to a few individuals. And seeing the positive messsages makes it all worth while, knowing that we've put out a quality product that does what it says it will do. Thanks.

Lee
tacrowl
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Maryland
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Thank you Lee! You not only help out Bill, but the entire vent community by making this and other great products available through ventriloquism101.

BTW - I absolutely LOVED the Sammy King DVD. Since I wasn't able to make Venthaven this year - that was a real treat!
Tom Crowl - Comedy Ventriloquist

ComedyVentriloquist.com

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Dynamike
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Eternal Order
FullTimer
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Quote:
On 2009-08-24 11:50, leecornell wrote:
Wow. Thanks for the great thread about Bill's tape over the mouth trick. As the producer of Bill's license package and his good friend, let me weigh in a bit.

Bill developed his first version of this trick and performed it for the first time in 1959. Bill is going to be 78 in November. I doubt if there is anyone out there who started doing this before Bill.

I personally never even saw anyone do a tape bit of any type except Bill for years and I've been involved in magic and ventriloquism for over 40 years. (I know what you're thinking...he looks too young, handsome and chisled to have been around the business for that long)...

So, there are very, very few performers of any tape bit, regardless of the method they may use.

There is no one that I am aware of that uses Bill's technique of placing several layers of tape over the mouth - except for those who have purchased Bill's version.

Bill spent a long time perfecting this routine.

Back in the 1950's and the 1960's, lots of vents did "tricks" with their dummies. Bill was no different. When he came up with the idea to put tape over his mouth, he first did the routine using a single wide piece of masking tape. Then he tried duct tape. Then he tried doing a bit where the dummy talked while Bill smoked a cigarette, drank a glass of water and then finished with the single piece of tape.

It got an OK response, but he knew something was missing as he wasn't "killing" with the routine.

It wasn't until he came up with the idea of changing this from a quick vent "trick" into a full routine by using layers of tape and having a volunteer come on stage that would assist, interact with the puppet and Bill, and become part of the routine that he knew he had found the missing piece.

The crowds really were amazed by the bit and it was/is very funny to watch as it plays out. Every time I have seen Bill do this routine, he has received a standing ovation.

That being said, this routine only works if you put in the effort to learn the routine (or tweak it a bit to make it more your own) and you need to be a good perfomer and decent vent. If you have a bad act and/or bad technique, this isn't going to make you a star. The trick itself is not difficult to learn.

We have the price where it is because we only want professional entertainers to perform it. And, the value of the trick is not just in the secret, it's also in Bill's routine.

He has performed this thousands of times over 50 years and has polished this routine to get maximun impact. That's what you're paying for.

I honestly feel it is worth more than the $500 asking price. And, I think most, if not all, of the people who have invested in a license feel the same way.

Is there any way to police someone who might figure it out and then doing Bill's routine? Of course not. However, I have never heard of anyone figuring out how Bill's method works.

But, as in everything, there are crooks who rip people off all of the time in magic, vent or any business for that matter. We just always hope those are the exceptions and not the rule.

Will there be "knock-off" licenses being offered? I really doubt it. This is a small niche trick and I just don't see that happening.

Once all 50 licenses are gone, that will be it. That's a number Bill and I agreed on and I intend to stick to that.

I'm not going to say "Hurry! Get yours now before they run out!" I am in no hurry to sell them all. I'm more concerned about the "right" people getting a license than I am about trying to sell them all out quickly just to get your money.

How many licenses are left? I'll be right up front and tell you - I have sold 18 to date (it's been available for a little over a year), which leaves 32. Will I run out tomorrow, next week, next month, next year? I doubt it. But, they will sell out someday and there will be no more issued after that happens.

So, right now, there are only 18 people IN THE WORLD who have Bill's secret and routine. That's a pretty dang small amount of people. In contrast, for example, how many people do the zig-zag illusion or linking rings?

There is a way, way greater chance of someone seeing some of those staples in magic at a show than in seeing the Tape over the Mouth routine.

It is a great trick and routine, but if $500 seems like too much, the trick is not for you.

It is not implied in this thread, but in other situations I'll hear people say about a product "It's just a DVD and a book. Probably only cost them $5 to package "x". $200, $300 (or whatever) is a rip-off."

If that's what you think in regard to this trick, don't purchase it. Please.

I plan on posting a video clip of Bill's performance on the web page soon. If you haven't seen the bit, watch it. If you like what you see and like how the audience responds and would like that same kind of routine for your show, that's all that matters.

The trick blows people away. Period. That's the value of Bill's Tape over the Mouth trick.

Thanks.

Best,

Lee

http://www.ventriloquism101.com

Any questions? Smile
Wanlu
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Manila, Philippines
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Got mine this morning...

I'm not sure if I did well but check out how I did during practice...I feel like I misunderstood something and did something wrong. Pardon the language barrier...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nXNMWDqcW0
"The Old Path"
www.angdatingdaan.org

Wanlu's Affordable Puppets
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Wanlu and his Puppets
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Daveandrews
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Erm, Wanlu, I don't think you've got the hang of it just yet - close, but not quite close enough. I would try reading the instructions again Smile
Don't worry, you will get there, I'm sure.

Best wishes,

Dave
http://[URL]www.partymagic.org.uk" target="_blank">www.partymagic.org.uk" target="_blank">http://[URL]www.partymagic.org.uk

Winner of KIDabra International's 'People's Choice Award'
Winner IBM British Ring Dittia Shield for manipulation
Wanlu
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Thanks Dave Smile Will do...
"The Old Path"
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Wanlu's Affordable Puppets
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Servante
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Profile of Servante
There's something...not quite right about it, Wanlu.
Can't put my finger on it, exactly, but...

Well, keep practicing!
Servante
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Maybe it's the tape. Maybe you need to...

No. That's not it.
Daveandrews
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Sevante - you may be on to something with the tape. Will give it some thought, but I don't have the benefit of the instructions Smile

Dave
http://[URL]www.partymagic.org.uk" target="_blank">www.partymagic.org.uk" target="_blank">http://[URL]www.partymagic.org.uk

Winner of KIDabra International's 'People's Choice Award'
Winner IBM British Ring Dittia Shield for manipulation
Bob Baker
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You guys are hyper-critical. It looked fine to me.

Bob
Wanlu
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Quote:
On 2009-09-14 11:02, Servante wrote:
There's something...not quite right about it, Wanlu.
Can't put my finger on it, exactly, but...

Well, keep practicing!


Thanks Servante...but I think it went pretty well. Smile
"The Old Path"
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Wanlu
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Quote:
On 2009-09-14 13:25, Daveandrews wrote:
Sevante - you may be on to something with the tape. Will give it some thought, but I don't have the benefit of the instructions Smile

Dave


I don't think its the tape... but somehow I feel that there is something wrong. Smile
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Wanlu
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Quote:
On 2009-09-14 15:30, Bob Baker wrote:
You guys are hyper-critical. It looked fine to me.

Bob


That's what I'm talking about...if Bob says it looked fine then it is.

Thanks Bob! Yodaman! Smile
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Wanlu
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I hope this will not appear like it's a mockery of TOM....for the record I can say that it's a great routine and probably the best investment on something that can improve a vent's act.

For me, it's worth every centavo I spent...and the license/certificate that is included is a treasure. It's the closest thing to being in the conVention and actually talk with Uncle Bill. Somehow, I feel like I have this instant connection with Mr DeMar...

This is actually an honor and a privilege for me to be one of the licensed TOMers in the international vent community. Smile

The video I made is just a spoof on my vent mentor Ony Carcamo thus the video is in our native language. Smile

Thanks Smile

Wanlu
"The Old Path"
www.angdatingdaan.org

Wanlu's Affordable Puppets
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Wanlu and his Puppets
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