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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The Society of American Magicians! » » Goodbye to S.A.M. for a year » » TOPIC IS LOCKED (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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csantill
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Quote:
On 2009-01-21 09:55, Rob Stewart wrote:
Quote:
On 2009-01-17 08:25, Merlina wrote:
Greetings, just received my issue of SAMtalk #3442 and was very much surprised to see that under item #5, Most Illustrious Bruce Kalver, National President is asking for "testers".

The item says that over the past few months he has received some requests for an online M.U.M. and this was a project they have been working on for months and are now ready to test it.



I was very surprised at this change. In one of his columns in M.U.M., he had written that "the publication will never go electronic".

Best to Michael Close as the new Editor. His first edition was very good and well received by everyone I've heard from and who has written in this and other newsgroups.

Now I will wait and see what happens when the "test" goes on line....although Mr. Kalver says in his post that this "will not replace the printed copy".

Keep a dream in the making

Maria Ibanez


Maria,

I have gone back to all the past issues of MUM looking at Bruce’s president’s column. Can you tell us specifically where you found the quote saying that he would never put MUM online? I can’t find it and don’t believe he ever said that.

Thanks,

Rob


He made that statement on SAMTalk He said

Quote:
[SAMtalk] Testing MUM Online
Sunday, January 18, 2009 9:28 AM

Our testing labs are full! Thank you to those who wrote in. A flood of
email appeared as soon as the call went out. Obviously there is
interest in this project.

I want to assure everyone that the printed MUM is here to stay. The
online version will be an added bonus.
Clifford the Red
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The bias here is pretty apparent. You better not question Maria in any way or your posts will get deleted by "quality control". Only blind praise is acceptable. Maria can insinuate people are liars and crooks and that is ok though. I get it.
"The universe is full of magical things, waiting for our wits to grow sharper." Eden Philpotts
mormonyoyoman
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Let's see -- Maria can be (and has been) called most of the names in the book, including "liar" and "the worst thing to happen" - but "only blind praise is acceptable," eh?

*jeep!
--Grandpa Chet (VERY disappointed in Clifford)
#ShareGoodness #ldsconf
Clifford the Red
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I have yet to see that here. And one behavior does not excuse another. I am very disappointed in you Chet.
"The universe is full of magical things, waiting for our wits to grow sharper." Eden Philpotts
Rob Stewart
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[quote]On 2009-01-22 18:48, csantill wrote:
Quote:
On 2009-01-21 09:55, Rob Stewart wrote:
Quote:
On 2009-01-17 08:25, Merlina wrote:
Greetings, just received my issue of SAMtalk #3442 and was very much surprised to see that under item #5, Most Illustrious Bruce Kalver, National President is asking for "testers".

The item says that over the past few months he has received some requests for an online M.U.M. and this was a project they have been working on for months and are now ready to test it.



I was very surprised at this change. In one of his columns in M.U.M., he had written that "the publication will never go electronic".

Best to Michael Close as the new Editor. His first edition was very good and well received by everyone I've heard from and who has written in this and other newsgroups.

Now I will wait and see what happens when the "test" goes on line....although Mr. Kalver says in his post that this "will not replace the printed copy".

Keep a dream in the making

Maria Ibanez


Maria,

I have gone back to all the past issues of MUM looking at Bruce’s president’s column. Can you tell us specifically where you found the quote saying that he would never put MUM online? I can’t find it and don’t believe he ever said that.

Thanks,

Rob


He made that statement on SAMTalk He said

Quote:
[SAMtalk] Testing MUM Online
Sunday, January 18, 2009 9:28 AM

Our testing labs are full! Thank you to those who wrote in. A flood of
email appeared as soon as the call went out. Obviously there is
interest in this project.

I want to assure everyone that the printed MUM is here to stay. The
online version will be an added bonus.

[/q

I am not sure you understood my question. In Maria’s post she Quoted Mr. Kalver. She stated he said (in Quotes) "the publication will never go electronic". She stated this quote was from Mr. Kalver’s column in MUM. I am simply asking, exactly in which MUM she read this statement, because I can’t seem to find it.

Rob
Rob Stewart
M U M
Merlina
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Maria Ibanez
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Greetings, I am very disappointed at all the controversy and name calling and accusations that have gone on in the past few posts on this thread.

To clarify my post, I was surprised to see it on SAMtalk that the MUM was being tested for going electronic, I didn't "insinuate people are liars and crooks" as Mr. Clifford the Red states above.

I am in favor of an electronic publication the way it is being proposed by the current administration; as an added benefit of membership and to go in conjunction with the printed publication which we have all come to know and love. I would not like it if it was to replace the printed word....but I am just one person and one vote and one opinion -- everyone is entitled to one, aren't we?

Rob, we are in the process of moving all my magic to a new and all wonderful magic room which is being built up at the home in the north and so other than the magic I am actually using regularly, most everything is packed up. If memory serves
(and we all know we are getting older and what memory becomes)I believe the not going electronic was in the July issue of the MUM but my copies are all packed.

The point is not that it is going or not going electronic. The point is that it is a great step forward if it is going to be in conjunction with and not in replacement of. This I am excited about and think it could be a great benefit to the members overseas who sometimes can take as long as 6 to 8 weeks to get their publications. You know how last month people were complaining that their MUMs were late in arriving and that was within the US, can you imagine for those overseas?

Mr. Cliford the Red - I am not sure whether or not I know you because I don't know your real identity but I would like to say to you personally that I am very disappointed in your comment above of -- "You better not question Maria in any way or your posts will get deleted by "quality control". -- Not only do I find that line offensive for myself, but also for the fine people who do such an admirable job for magic by providing this forum for magicians. I do not know any of the moderators personally, I do not know who holds the position that you refer to as "quality control" nor do I have the power or ability to have any post deleted. Are you aware of any post that has in fact been deleted? If so, I would suggest you contact the moderators/owners of this wonderful forum and let them know so that they might look into it and see what may be going on.

To those who have written such nice remarks both on this and other threads about me and my work for magic and for the S.A.M. which we all so dearly love, THANK YOU. Thank you for your support and kudos. As always, please do not hesitate to contact me if you feel I may ever be of any assistance.

Keep a dream in the making for you create your tomorrows by what you dream today.

Maria Ibanez
Clifford the Red
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Maria,

You know well I was referring to the whole ongoing drama in this thread in which you did insinuate many things about SAM and it's leadership. That DEEPLY OFFENDS me as a magician. No you do not know me and all I know of you is what I have seen in this thread which is an undermining of SAM and it's leadership. And of course you continue to post in this thread whose topic is Abandoning SAM. That is very disturbing coming from a former leader and in a public forum to boot. Magic needs unity not petty sniping, especially in a public forum where people go to get information about joining. Sorry but that just rubs me the wrong way. And please drop the whole innocence game, I can read what you have written and I have been a mod at a large site for over a decade so I have seen it all. I look at the content, not the sugary covering. If you have a problem with leadership you take it to the appropriate channels within the organization. You don't go out and poison the potential membership. That is just inappropriate beyond words.
"The universe is full of magical things, waiting for our wits to grow sharper." Eden Philpotts
Borack
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Alrighty then...Guess Ill be waiting some more before joining !!!!
Craig Dickson
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I will not enter this conversation, other that saying I greatly defend freedom of speech. This forum is not edited, or slanted, nothing has been deleted by the SAM as Clifford the Red has stated as fact thus far, but may be at any time by the Café if deemed inappropriate under Café Guidlines, I cannot comment on something I have not read. As far at the SAM deleting posts, on the contrary, if that were the case, his comments would not appear. But they do. If any previous posts were removed, it was not by anyone in the SAM, but rather the Café, and their right to do so. I do not defend or oppose either side, if indeed there are sides. I do support everyone’s rights to be heard. There are times when discussions become totally inappropriate under the guidelines of The Magic Café. We are guests here, do not make their policies, and are bound to abide by the values and overall purpose of this site. Please respect this in all your posts. The management has worked hard building a site to promote magic, encourage discussion, and advance the art of magic. Please do not lose sight of that. Problems, disagreements, differences of opinion exist whenever two or more people join to organise anything in the world. That does not define who we are, or what we stand for. The SAM stands for so much in the world of magic, and has set the standard for many that came after. Do not judge an organisation by periodic disagreements, personality conflicts, current minimal controversy etc. That would be very short sighted. Do get involved to correct or change what you see wrong, that begins on a local level, in your assemblies, then through RVPs. Do get involved to making suggestions, sharing ideas. But do get involved. It is very easy to tear down. It takes much more investment to build. Where would you like to spend your valuable time? I choose vision and progress.

That is what Steve Brooks and the staff of The Magic Café have built. That also is what many in the SAM have valued, worked very hard for, and built. It is a work in progress, and a journey. Read the January MUM, you may get an idea of the vision of many. To some of us, it is still the greatest magic organisation in the world. I believe we produce the greatest magazine in the world. Be part of that progress. That is what many of us stand for, both here on the Café, and in the SAM
Clifford the Red
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I never said SAM deleted anything of mine. Other than that, I totally agree with your comments Craig and they support my whole point. Thank you for pointing out the proper channels for creating change. And thank you for countering the point of this thread and urging people to join this great organization.
"The universe is full of magical things, waiting for our wits to grow sharper." Eden Philpotts
Craig Dickson
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OK Good. See ya out there. Next stop Columbus Magi-Fest, then Winter Carnival TN, and then Blackpool UK. Stop by if you are at any of them. We know have to have fun, and share. It what it's all about, for Joanne and I anyway.

Best Regards
GlennGary
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I didn't renew my membership in SAM this year either and I stopped attending the SAM convention after the Boston 2005. I started writing the reasons that led me to this decision but after four and a half pages decided not to send it. Let's just say there are people that feel that this is THEIR personal organization and they will run it the way they see fit. This is almost an exact quote from a PNP. And if you disagree or do anything contrary to this person’s will, he will do anything in his power to get his vengeance.

When people feel they are so powerful in an organization that they can act and do anything they want and feel the members are there to feed their ego, instead of serving the members; there is something wrong within that organization for tolerating such attitudes. It's a cancer that spreads from one power hungry official to another and should either be neutralized or removed; or it will overtake and consume until the whole organization serves the officers and not the members.

At this stage it seems the purpose of SAM is to provide a select few with personal opportunities not otherwise achievable for them. All the members are doing is providing the ways and means to accomplish their personal agendas. Today running for national office is not to serve the members but to acquire a status symbol and personal power to control and manipulate others within and associated with the organization. Mostly for personal gain; if not monetary, emotional.

There are exceptions, but even the exceptions that do want to serve the members find themselves limited due to the power hold of others. No one wants to make waves because they have too much to lose to fight the powerful.
Make It A Magical Day

Glenn Gary

www.glenngary.com

703-963-0790
doormouse
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Amen
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